If we woulda let Joe walk!!!

[general]

If we would have saved that $124million and Let joe walked.We would be doin good just like Denver Nuggest are doin without Carmelo Now..It's more of a team And no Ball stoppers.Just like when Joe went down with his elbow injury we were Winning and looked so good He rushed to get Back to the Line-up..Now we dont have any Money to spend....

[HoopsGuru25]

I was actually thinking of the Joe/Carmelo comparisons a few months ago. I think Carmelo is clearly better....but their productivity(PER) and intangibles(both seem very aloof as leaders)don't really match up to their accolades.

[Geaux_Hawks]

Joe walks, we are in the lottery for sure.Denver traded Melo for all those guys they got, not signed. Could you make a list of guys that would have came to Atlanta last summer.

[Jamaaliver]

Umm...no.

Denver has a better, more balanced roster than we do. They also have a more experienced, respected coach.

JJ was out for surgery earlier this year, and the results during his time out were not pretty.

A better option would have seen us doing a sign and trade getting, perhaps, Luol Geng from CHI or Chandler/Gallinari from NY.

We still would have had Mike bibby as PG and lazy Josh Smith as our team captain.

A good question is, why pay a player significantly more money when we, as a result of LD's more balanced offenive system, expected him to produce less?

[HMFFL]

We lack talent in many areas of our team and you think we would be better off without Joe Johnson?

I have been very high on Danilo Gallinari and Wilson Chandler. I wanted Dallas to acquire Wilson Chandler last season because New York was trying to trade him for nothing just to move salary. He turned things around this year and helped New York acquire who they've been wanting.

[johnny878]

Joe walks, we are in the lottery for sure.Denver traded Melo for all those guys they got, not signed. Could you make a list of guys that would have came to Atlanta last summer.

we probably could of gotten a decent haul off of joe too, if we traded him on his expiring contract. maybe something similar to what denver got but plus one bad contract back.

[Ruhiel]

Spilt milk, ATL needs to decide what to do going forward. I would get a center and slot Marvin at the 2 instead of Joe.

I heard Kahn was interested in middling teams shedding salary ala Joe but now that Wesley Johnson is settling in... who knows.

The best thing would be Joe to have a good showing in the playoffs and then trade him for a solid center if possible. Then emphasize Smoove and Marvin losing weight in offseason and build around those gus and Horford as the main threats down low. and in transition. Hawks need a Center going forward.

[MaceCase]

Would we be a lottery team without Joe? Please, this is the East we are talking about here, we'd have enough continuity and talent to muster 30+ wins to get into the playoffs. As far as the argument about the team is deficient in talent in certain areas? Well investing 126 mil into one player that doesn't address any of those needs clearly wasn't the answer either. Without Joe we clearly would of had a larger share of our already limited resources to address depth and over the span of years assembled a deeper team. We could of even remained buyers if we had a TPE or Beasley or Chandler as assets. Instead this team is what it is for the foreseeable future with no chance at a bench and if we want to change the core we'd be sellers instead of buyers. In order to avoid a 30% chance at the lottery this year we've pretty much guaranteed 100% chance at the lottery within 2 years where we are guaranteed to be Isiah's Knicks or the GIl, Butler, and Jamison Wizards.

[geeman]

We as Hawks fans are in Purgatory!!!!

[Harry10]

Joe walks, we are in the lottery for sure.Denver traded Melo for all those guys they got, not signed. Could you make a list of guys that would have came to Atlanta last summer.

Hawks might be a lottery team, but in the scope of 5 years, the team would have been closer to winning a championship. but with Joe and his contract, the Hawks will remain as a pretender until Joe's contract runs out, and then their will probably be a painful 5 year rebuilding process.

i'm okay with being a lottery team this year, and adding a talent like Irving, or Derrick Williams while Josh and Horford are in their prime and the Hawks finally become a contender.

[FCNATL85]

Josh is in no prime and probably won't because, in spite of his talent, he is sorely lacking the disciplin that could allow his game to be raised at all star level or maybe more...
hence, he is the 1st one we need to get rid off...beacuse it will also be easier than getting rid of joe... (Dallas; joe + filler or 2nd for haywood and JT)

[HMFFL]

i'm okay with being a lottery team, and adding a talent like Irving, or Derrick Williams while Josh and Horford are in their prime and the Hawks finally become a contender.

This team won't be a true contender as long as we have that combination at the 4/5. The ASG will most likely not move Josh Smith, but it needs to happen, and it would be for the greater good of the team.

[HMFFL]

(Dallas; joe + filler or 2nd for haywood and JT)

Cuban claims that he contacted us about Joe Johnson to work a S&T while he was a free agent. I have my doubts about that because I honestly think Cuban is keeping the check book closed. I also believe he has become content with winning during the regular season and not doing what it takes to make-up for so many mistakes he has made over the year and continues to make with trades/free agency.

He hyped up the addition of Stojakovic, who was going to retire two years ago, and has been sitting on the shelf just to collect his check before he does retire. He hyped him up to the casual fans and to any season ticket holders that would listen. Cuban also claims that he is in the red with the Mavericks, but it only rains more praise on him by Dallas fans, and Cuban is most certainly making a nice profit off the team.

Back to the trade proposal. It's not certain that Tyson Chandler will be back for Dallas, so Brendan Haywood is the backup plan, and will stay with Dallas if Tyson Chandler declines to stay. Jason Terry would be in the final year of his contract but I think it's unlikely that Sund and the ASG would want him.

[FCNATL85]

It is clear that haywood would have to resign first.
If not, would it be possible to a Zaza + Joe for JT + Chandler (S&T)?

Chandler- Armstrong- Collins
Al- Marv- Powell
Wallace- Marv- Damian
Matthews - JT
Teague- Hinrich- FA

Maybe a trade with Smoothe and JC S&T for wallace and matthews in POR

[HMFFL]

It is clear that haywood would have to resign first.
If not, would it be possible to a Zaza + Joe for JT + Chandler (S&T)?

Chandler- Armstrong- Collins
Al- Marv- Powell
Wallace- Marv- Damian
Matthews - JT
Teague- Hinrich- FA

Maybe a trade with Smoothe and JC S&T for wallace and matthews in POR

Why would Tyson Chandler want to play for us when he is already established with Dallas? Cuban is going pay to keep Chandler since free agents won't come to Dallas (not that they have cap space). The Mavericks off-season will be to lock Tyson Chandler and Caron Butler (dumb!) up.

If Jason Kidd decides to retire he should be involved in a trade to make the money work. Jason Kidd, Brendan Haywood, a filler, and future pick(s) for Joe Johnson is about the only way I see a trade happening. I still doubt the ASG would be interested.

[myrak433]

I don't know why you people want to get rid of Joe and Smith while keeping Horford. Horford can't create for his self nor does he command a double team. His defense isn't top notch either. he is just consistent. Now I don't won't to get rid of Horford, I like his game. But he is not untouchable. Ideally I would love to keep both and have one come off the bench like Lamar Odom does in LA. But I don't think either one of their ego would let them do it.

[Geaux_Hawks]

I don't know why you people want to get rid of Joe and Smith while keeping Horford. Horford can't create for his self nor does he command a double team. His defense isn't top notch either. he is just consistent. Now I don't won't to get rid of Horford, I like his game. But he is not untouchable. Ideally I would love to keep both and have one come off the bench like Lamar Odom does in LA. But I don't think either one of their ego would let them do it.

OMG finally someone who see's what I see. I been preaching that for so long and fans think I'm crazy for saying such things. Now true Joe and Josh tend to have inconsistent stretches and aren't true leaders, but both can do so many things on their own.

Horford to Milwaukee along with Marvin for Bogut Ilyasova, CDR would be a good deal if we could maybe get a third team(Cavs or Wiz) to take Maggette for something.

[parson]

When it comes down to it, Horford does what he needs to in order to win.
Outside of injury or neglect, he does time after time. He is a team player.

When it comes down to it, Smoove chooses whatever he feels he wants.
We've seen that time after time. And Smoove does not create: he takes long jumpers.

[Geaux_Hawks]

When it comes down to it, Horford does what he needs to in order to win.
Outside of injury or neglect, he does time after time. He is a team player.

When it comes down to it, Smoove chooses whatever he feels he wants.
We've seen that time after time. And Smoove does not create: he takes long jumpers.

Horford doesn't even ask for the ball and when he does get it, he would rather make the extra pass to someone else, so how can you say he does what he needs to do in order to win. Yes I would like to keep and acquire some one else without giving up a whole lot, so with that said I would only trade him for Nene or Bogut.

Josh chooses to do whatever he feels because he doesn't have a coach that will stay on him like Woodson did. This is the first year Josh has taken so many jump shots. Josh has the ability to create but doesn't because he choose to shoot jumpers and thats something i am disappointed with, but realize no one is making him change his game either.(I.E Larry Drew)

[parson]

On a team that doesn't share the ball with him very often, Horford has a PER of 21.73 (18th best in the NBA among ALL players).
On a team that doesn't share the ball with him very often, Horford is the most accurate midrange shooter in the NBA (57%).
On a team that doesn't share the ball with him very often, Horford averages 15.7 pts/gm.

If I keep on, I'll start getting into opinions, but those facts are unavoidable. Horford is the best PF on our team and our best player.

I love Smoove's drive and ambition but he kills me with his lack of intensity. He only brings it when he wants to. And this is NOT the "first year Josh has taken so many jump shots." Sorry to disagree but he and Woodson butted heads for years. Notice you agree he "chooses to do whatever he feels" but you blame it on the coach.

Notice, also, that you don't disagree with my claim that he DOES NOT create his own shots. And that really bothers me about him: he could be Domminique-like if he would _drive_to_the_basket (grrr).