Wall and Crawford made NBA history. Congrats to them & EG!

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Sat, Mar 26
G Jordan Crawford and G John Wall made history in Wednesday's loss to the Clippers. They became the first pair of rookie teammates in NBA history to score at least 25 points and record 10 assists in the same game.
(Yahoo! Sports)

It's not the stats that matter to me, but I'm thinking about Isaih Thomas and Joe Dumars and all the combinations of players that might have been able to replicate that. None were rookies together. Mark Jackson was a rookie and Rod Strickland was drafted the next season. They might have been able to do that.

Ernie has really done something special getting Crawford from ATL.

[montestewart]

I wonder how often that's been done overall, especially in non-overtime games. Can the game checker do two-player combos?

That they (Wall, Jordan, McGee, am I missing anyone?) set records speaks to their individual abilities and tells me that there are possible true building blocks beyond Wall. Add Booker, Seraphin, Young, maybe Ndiaye, that's a lot of names that could take steps to become quality rotations players or better on a winning team. I'm almost suffocating from holding my breath.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Young is very capable of dropping 55-60 in a game. Booker will probably one day go off for 20 points and 20 rebounds with multiple blocks. Blatche is a guy I dump on a lot lately, but he's capable of a triple double of points, rebounds, and assists. So is Booker, a guy that has exceeded all my expectations.

Guns N Roses (hey, I'm usually a Soul, R&B, and lately Gospel music fan, but I liked my metal in the day) had a song called "Patience". All we need is just a little patience comes to mind about now. There is some serious talent on this team.

[Piston Boris]

Does anyone have an idea of what Washington's long term plans for Jordan Crawford are?

I'm curious.

I also happen to have him on a Yahoo fantasy dynasty team. Since I picked him up from waivers last week, Crawford has been balling. I want to hold on to Crawford if Washington will develop him.

[Kanyewest]

^^ It all depends if the Wizards resign Nick Young or not this offseason. It looks like the Wizards will look to keep Nick Young if they can lock him into an affordable contract. If that's the case, Crawford will more likely than not be the first guard off the bench for the forseeable future.

If Young walks this offseason, Crawford may get the job as the starter in the short term and will have a chance to prove himself as a long term starter.

[Piston Boris]

^^ It all depends if the Wizards resign Nick Young or not this offseason. It looks like the Wizards will look to keep Nick Young if they can lock him into an affordable contract. If that's the case, Crawford will more likely than not be the first guard off the bench for the forseeable future.

If Young walks this offseason, Crawford may get the job as the starter in the short term and will have a chance to prove himself as a long term starter.

Copy that.

Thanks for the info.

I'll be monitoring Nick Young in the offseason.

I once had Young on my dynasty team this season, but Rotoworld and CBS Sports kept projecting he would lose his spot in the starting lineup so I waived him. The "experts" called that wrong.

[jivelikenice]

CCJ, who do you think would be the better backcourt mate for Wall between Young & Crawford? I'll admit, I was initially 100% behind a Wall, Young backcourt, but I see some potential and a little more versatility out of the Wall/ Crawford pairing.
Young Positives
1. Better shooter
2. Works w/o ball
3. better defender

Young Negatives
1. Lack of versatility- assists are not in his vocab
2. lack of foot speed- NY is athletic, but he's not fast running the floor
3. BBall IQ- bad shot selection, and letting a guy like Arenas get in his head during a game

Crawford Positives
1. Versatile scorer- Can shoot and create off the dribble for himself
2. Ball handling- Capable of sharing ball handling duties which IMO will take some pressure off of Wall having to always create the offense...Similar to Hughes when he was in D.C.
3. BBall IQ- shot selection is a work in progress, but he does understand that the attention he gets creates for others and the assist numebrs prove that
4. Speed- Can run the floor with Wall

Crawford Negatives
1. Size- a little small and lacking bulk at the SG position
2. Shot selection
3. 3 pt range- i don't think we have a large enough sample size to show how good of a 3 pt shooter he can be

I'm not suggesting moving one of these guys, but trying to think of who is really the better starter and who is more suited to be play the 6th man...

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I'm the wrong guy to ask. Errrrbody knows I'm the resident Wall hater. I thought you asked me, "What do I think about a Crawford/Young backcourt?"

jivelikenice, I've got to actually watch more than just the Clips game to say how I feel about Crawford. Crawford looks to me initially to be a Vinnie Microwave Johnson and Ben Gordon type player. He can come off the bench as a flamethrower. But he's also the type to shoot a team out of a game. Dude has no conscience about teeing it up. One thing, though, is you mention his versatility. He's a much better passer than those guys.

Crawford or Nick? Crawford's way more versatile a passer than Nick. Nick has the ability to dominate defensively because of his length. In a way, they're like fire and ice. Nick is cold-blooded and quiet about his work. He just scores when he's on--but he's very, very inconsistent. Crawford seems like an up and down shooter also, but he's a high basketball IQ and fiery competitive type. Having thought about it, Nick is a good starter already, at the right price. I'd keep Crawford coming off the bench unless he just took the job by consistent, good play.

WALL HATER COMMENT (sorry) ALERT: Crawford's a bit more competitive IMO than Wall. He can't do what Wall does but he's got something in the way of determination and fight that Wall doesn't seem to me to have yet. Perhaps it's confidence/nerves. I love the dynamic of all three young guys, including Nick.

[Piston Boris]

It sounds like Washington could have the nucleus for a versatile and deep backcourt.

Piston fans can attest to success with deep backcourts. Unfortunately, for the current Detroit team, Dumars has gone overboard and is handcuffed by the stalled sale with his options in fixing his mistakes.

It looks to me that a new coach needs to be brought in who can get Wall, Young, and Crawford to complement each other.

Plenty of Piston fans would love to have Wall as the new franchise PG. But since Detroit has the latest Georgetown big man, who looks like another Tim Duncan, plenty of Piston fans are hoping to land a PG in this year's draft. Another quality young big man wouldn't hurt neither.

[nate33]

I like Young better as the starter because of his superior off-the-ball play and his defense. I like Young even more when he has a capable backup like Crawford who can be brought in when Young's shot isn't falling. The two will definitely complement each other.

[hands11]

I'm the wrong guy to ask. Errrrbody knows I'm the resident Wall hater. I thought you asked me, "What do I think about a Crawford/Young backcourt?"

jivelikenice, I've got to actually watch more than just the Clips game to say how I feel about Crawford. Crawford looks to me initially to be a Vinnie Microwave Johnson and Ben Gordon type player. He can come off the bench as a flamethrower. But he's also the type to shoot a team out of a game. Dude has no conscience about teeing it up. One thing, though, is you mention his versatility. He's a much better passer than those guys.

Crawford or Nick? Crawford's way more versatile a passer than Nick. Nick has the ability to dominate defensively because of his length. In a way, they're like fire and ice. Nick is cold-blooded and quiet about his work. He just scores when he's on--but he's very, very inconsistent. Crawford seems like an up and down shooter also, but he's a high basketball IQ and fiery competitive type. Having thought about it, Nick is a good starter already, at the right price. I'd keep Crawford coming off the bench unless he just took the job by consistent, good play.

WALL HATER COMMENT (sorry) ALERT: Crawford's a bit more competitive IMO than Wall. He can't do what Wall does but he's got something in the way of determination and fight that Wall doesn't seem to me to have yet. Perhaps it's confidence/nerves. I love the dynamic of all three young guys, including Nick.

Add one more pure shooter and you have something to look forward to next year.

[Ruzious]

WALL HATER COMMENT (sorry) ALERT: Crawford's a bit more competitive IMO than Wall. He can't do what Wall does but he's got something in the way of determination and fight that Wall doesn't seem to me to have yet. Perhaps it's confidence/nerves. I love the dynamic of all three young guys, including Nick.

Well titled. I think Wall's tired from losing, but as for doubting his competitiveness - I think you'll look back at your comment some day and laugh.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I think I will. That whole DeMarcus/Wall debate thread is pretty laughable already.

[hands11]

Questions.

Is there anything against a team getting the #1 pick two years in a row. I never heard anything but I just wanted to double check.

Secondly. If the Wizards get the first pick, who should they take ?

Secondly.2 Who is the best player in the draft ?

The reason I ask it like this is the clarify the decision about the first pick or even the top 5 picks. Do you get the best player regardless of position ?

Look at past drafts. Was the first pick the best player available ? How about the other 4 picks ?

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-draft-history/

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

The draft lottery rules were not changed just because Orlando selected Shaq and Webber (who they traded for Penny Hardaway) in back-to-back drafts. The Wizards could pick first again if they are lucky.

If the Wizards get the top pick, IMO they need to work out a deal for sending the consensus top player, Kyrie Irving, to the team that will give up the most for him. I want Derrick Williams, but there's a lot of variables that would come into play if the Wizards got the top pick.

(Pistons have Austin Daye and the ability to take Shard Lewis' deal off the Wizards hands. Kings have Cousins plus their lottery pick for the Wizards pick plus Blatche or Seraphin. Conceivably, If the Wizards get the top pick they could effectively swap Cousins for Blatche and still have the pick which gets Barnes PLUS the ATL pick! It would mean a lot to pick #1, hands.)

I think the best player is Walker. The player that will have the biggest NBA impact could be Henson but I'll say Kyrie Irving. If the experts are comparing him to Chris Paul, I won't argue.

[hands11]

The draft lottery rules were not changed just because Orlando selected Shaq and Webber (who they traded for Penny Hardaway) in back-to-back drafts. The Wizards could pick first again if they are lucky.

If the Wizards get the top pick, IMO they need to work out a deal for sending the consensus top player, Kyrie Irving, to the team that will give up the most for him. I want Derrick Williams, but there's a lot of variables that would come into play if the Wizards got the top pick.

(Pistons have Austin Daye and the ability to take Shard Lewis' deal off the Wizards hands. Kings have Cousins plus their lottery pick for the Wizards pick plus Blatche or Seraphin. Conceivably, If the Wizards get the top pick they could effectively swap Cousins for Blatche and still have the pick which gets Barnes PLUS the ATL pick! It would mean a lot to pick #1, hands.)

I think the best player is Walker. The player that will have the biggest NBA impact could be Henson but I'll say Kyrie Irving. If the experts are comparing him to Chris Paul, I won't argue.

I haven't watched enough Kyrie but it is easy to see the Kembra seems like a sure thing. He has such a polished NBA ready game. He is directing people out there. He gets the spacing of a team and how to get his own spacing. He is vocal and active about it. He is fearless and has a polished shot. He is active and he hasn't back down on the bigger stage. He isn't potential. He is already it. Someone is going to get a very good player.

It always interesting when evaluating these players. You look to see if they have something physical that translates to an NBA game but I think often people get caught up to much in height. There is always that X factor and for me it is based on shuttle things about how they move, some small things that stands out about their personality, and their activity level. Something beyond just reach, etc, it it is how their bodies are designed.

I have been focused on D Williams a lot so far but I have not put in my final bid that he is the right player to pick.

So who is better. Wall or Kyrie ? Or let me ask it this way. If Kyrie and Wall were both going out this year, which would you take ?

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Kyrie. No doubt in my mind.

Wall is a terrific end-to-end athlete who can score and distribute, but he tends to operate full throttle. He doubts his shot a bit at this stage. Yet, on offense the guy's already an 8.5 out of 10 IMO. He's headed for 10. What I don't like is Wall's defense is bad. He lost his matchup most games at PG and that shouldn't happen for the #1 overall pick IMO.

Irving has a much better handle and a better shot than Wall. He's also a much better defender. He doesn't have the speed, length, and elite athleticism Wall does; but IMO Irving's a game manager who's going to win games, immediately, like Chris Paul did as a rookie. Irving is quick to a spot as a set up guy and as a defender. The last part distinguishes him from Wall IMO. I don't think he turns it over much, either.

hands, Wall has the athleticism to be Westbrook/Rose/Kidd all rolled into one guy. His upside is sky high and with the right teammates he can be HOF or all-time great.

Wall would probably be the pick for 75% of people over Irving. Like I said above, I'm the resident Wall hater on this board (but even I know the guy's potentially great).

[hands11]

Kyrie. No doubt in my mind.

Wall is a terrific end-to-end athlete who can score and distribute, but he tends to operate full throttle. He doubts his shot a bit at this stage. Yet, on offense the guy's already an 8.5 out of 10 IMO. He's headed for 10. What I don't like is Wall's defense is bad. He lost his matchup most games at PG and that shouldn't happen for the #1 overall pick IMO.

Irving has a much better handle and a better shot than Wall. He's also a much better defender. He doesn't have the speed, length, and elite athleticism Wall does; but IMO Irving's a game manager who's going to win games, immediately, like Chris Paul did as a rookie. Irving is quick to a spot as a set up guy and as a defender. The last part distinguishes him from Wall IMO. I don't think he turns it over much, either.

hands, Wall has the athleticism to be Westbrook/Rose/Kidd all rolled into one guy. His upside is sky high and with the right teammates he can be HOF or all-time great.

Wall would probably be the pick for 75% of people over Irving. Like I said above, I'm the resident Wall hater on this board (but even I know the guy's potentially great).

Well, you are one of a hand full of people that post here that I could actually explore this conversation with without getting the standard... are you insane.. type response.

Just playing with the clay, which is all we really can do here. We don't get to pick any of these players. Just considering things. Thinking outside the box. This team is still at stage 1 of the rebuild while they are in the final stages of tearing things down. Only Lewis's contract is left to manage in the tear down part of things.

So would you personally consider the idea of getting Kyrie and then getting a bunch of good stuff for Wall ? God I hope no one else reads what we are writing. LOL.

Or, could you have both for a year ? I like Crawford so far but I am far from sold on him. I think players that take to long like Nick can be picked up later when you know more about them. I want college players who are ready to go. Getting it done year one and banging it out by year two.

For me is still about accumulating as many valuable assets as possible. Look what Denver just got for Melo. I think this team needs to be done with adding projects. I want draft picks that can produce today.

I like Kyrie, Kembra, The Morris Brothers, Tyler Zeller, maybe Hanson and Jan. Even Jimmer seems like he would produce right away. The kid has a strong body already.

Never was a huge fan of some of the players that say they are not coming out. Sully and Barnes.

[Wizardspride]

So would you personally consider the idea of getting Kyrie and then getting a bunch of good stuff for
Wall ? God I hope no one else reads what we are writing. LOL.

Forget Kyrie...I'm taking Kemba and trading Wall.

Yeah, I said it.

[P'Oed]

if this team were to trade John Wall I'd immediately stop being a fan