Prospect Watch Thread

eyeteeth · Post #801 » by **eyeteeth** » Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:33 pm

B Calrissian wrote:What do you guys think of Lamb from uconn? I haven't been keeping tabs on this thread so I apologize if he has been discussed alot already.

I'd be happy if we got Lamb with the Mem pick. He's long for being 6'3" and plays with a high IQ. If he was an inch or two taller I'd like him more, but then he wouldn't last that late in the draft. It also depends what else we do. I'm still hoping we pull off a #1 pick, draft Irving, send him to the Suns for Nash and pick up Raja Bell from the Jazz kind of summer. Not sure how Lamb fits in with that.

horaceworthy · Post #802 » by **horaceworthy** » Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:38 pm

B Calrissian wrote:What do you guys think of Lamb from uconn? I haven't been keeping tabs on this thread so I apologize if he has been discussed alot already.

I've brought his name up a few times, but there hasn't been too much discussion on him.

I really like him. He's got a smooth, effective game, great touch and ridiculous length for a shooting guard (7'4" wingspan). If he came out this year he'd probably be fighting Alec Burks for the title of best SG in the draft. He's also a solid passer who can do some things off the bounce. He's also funny to watch because he's pretty much all arms and legs at this point.

kiwi_adam wrote:
AQuintus wrote:I can definitely see that, and that's a big part of why I wouldn't be too excited to draft him top 5.

i know what you mean but you can't really hope for a whole lot better in a weak draft like this, and the kid's only 18 so he has a lot of room to grow, deng is a very good player and if barnes could be that kind of player it'd help us a lot and who knows he could become a paul pierce like player.

His game reminds me more of Ray Allen than Pierce.

This draft actually looks to be a pretty normal draft to me. It's an interesting group of freshmen and sophomores, the strength of this draft hinges on who will declare out of the group. People act like just because there's a lockout life will stop, which isn't the case. There are still 30 guaranteed contracts to be had, it's the quickest shot for many at realizing a lifelong dream, some people just don't enjoy going to class, probably better off competing for draft slotting against this year's senior class than next year's freshman class, players will get left in the lurch by coaches who recruited them getting fired/moving on, all that stuff. The lockout is a potential issue, but we won't know how impactful it will be until we actually see who is/isn't coming out.

AQuintus · Post #803 » by **AQuintus** » Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:50 pm

moss_is_1 wrote:Beasley's defense/shot selection/turnovers/Low Iq have taken a toll on me.

Once again I don't get how people can be so high on Barnes but so low on Beasley.

Defense - I can see this. Barnes has better fundamentals than Beasley, but who knows how that will transfer from the NCAA to the NBA level? On top of that, any increase in individual defense from Beasley to Barnes will be greatly negated by Rambis' terrible system.

Shot Selection - Barnes' shot selection is every bit as bad, if not worse than Beasley's and has resulted in him having a terrible 1.17 Points Per Shot against college defenders that he almost always has a substantial physical advantage over. Compare that to Beasley's 1.11 PPS this year against NBA defenders and after battling a slew of injuries.

Turnovers- I've gone over this before. Beasley turns the ball over at a rate that's pretty consistent with other high usage wing players. Beasley - 12.3 TO%, 28.4 USG%, Durant - 10.5 TO%, 30.6 USG%, Granger - 12.6 TO%, 26.7 USG%. Compared to Barnes. Beasley has 3.1 TOs per 40 pace adjusted, Barnes has 2.4 TOs per 40 pace adjusted (again against much inferior defenders).

BBIQ - I'm not going to talk much on this because it can't be objectively measured, but even if Barnes does have high BBIQ than Beasley, does it even matter if it hasn't lead to better production against inferior competition?

I'll say, though, that I wouldn't mind Barnes if, and only if, he's the definite BPA where we're picking, but we shouldn't take him with the intention of using him to replace Beasley in the starting lineup (at least not right away), and we absolutely (!) shouldn't dump Beasley to make room for him. With that said, if we can move Beasley for an equal or better player at a position of more need (C, specifically) then we should absolutely do it and take Barnes to fill his spot, but that won't happen. Beasley's value has risen since this summer but not that much, so it's really not worth talking about.

Edit:

horaceworthy wrote:His game reminds me more of Ray Allen than Pierce.

His game reminds me more of OJ Mayo than either of those guys (and it doesn't remind me of Paul Pierce at all. I have no idea where that comes from).

Post #804 » by **The J Rocka** » Mon Mar 28, 2011 11:08 pm

AQuintus wrote:
horaceworthy wrote:His game reminds me more of Ray Allen than Pierce.

His game reminds me more of OJ Mayo than either of those guys (and it doesn't remind me of Paul Pierce at all. I have no idea where that comes from).

I don't see too much OJ Mayo in him. Barnes plays "bigger" and can rebound better. Has better intangibles and jump shot as well. I see Paul Pierce mixed with Luol Deng.

Post #805 » by **Klomp** » Mon Mar 28, 2011 11:41 pm

The McDonald HS Skills Comp is on ESPN2 right now

Post #806 » by **Klomp** » Mon Mar 28, 2011 11:58 pm

From what I saw in the passing drill, this kid is going to be really good I think. http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketb ... r-williams

Post #807 » by **Klomp** » Tue Mar 29, 2011 12:09 am

Devilzsidewalk wrote:
Worm Guts wrote:Tyler Zeller consistently beats his guys down court and has incredible hands. If you want to run, he's definitely a guy you want to look at as a backup center.

he's doing it to Harrellson some too. That being said, I like Zeller's size, but I'd actually be positively giddy at the idea of having Harrellson on the roster as Bill Laimbeer's special project.

Wolves have been needing an annoying hustle guy ever since Mad Dog left. Plus he's got attitude and he's big too, I can just picture that guy being a local fan favorite and public enemy #1 for all opposing fans.

I think Tolliver has been that guy this year.

AQuintus · Post #808 » by **AQuintus** » Tue Mar 29, 2011 12:11 am

Klomp wrote:From what I saw in the passing drill, this kid is going to be really good I think. http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketb ... r-williams

Syracuse: Check
Big Smile: Check

No thank you.

Post #809 » by **Klomp** » Tue Mar 29, 2011 12:28 am

AQuintus wrote:
Klomp wrote:From what I saw in the passing drill, this kid is going to be really good I think. http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketb ... r-williams

Syracuse: Check
Big Smile: Check

No thank you.

I knew someone would bring that up.

Post #810 » by **Klomp** » Tue Mar 29, 2011 12:43 am

Man, I want Austin Rivers

_AIJ_ · Post #811 » by **_AIJ_** » Tue Mar 29, 2011 12:55 am

Deandre Liggins?

moss_is_1 · Post #812 » by **moss_is_1** » Tue Mar 29, 2011 1:20 am

AQuintus wrote:Defense - I can see this. Barnes has better fundamentals than Beasley, but who knows how that will transfer from the NCAA to the NBA level? On top of that, any increase in individual defense from Beasley to Barnes will be greatly negated by Rambis' terrible system.

Barnes' defensive system at UNC isn't any better then Rambis'. Roy Williams equally sucks.

AQuintus wrote:Shot Selection - Barnes' shot selection is every bit as bad, if not worse than Beasley's and has resulted in him having a terrible 1.17 Points Per Shot against college defenders that he almost always has a substantial physical advantage over. Compare that to Beasley's 1.11 PPS this year against NBA defenders and after battling a slew of injuries.

Barnes is also 18 years old, while Beasley is nearly 22 and still hasn't learned anything. Barnes has drastically improved his %'s since Marshall took over, whether it's from better PG play or if something just clicked who knows.

AQuintus wrote:Turnovers- I've gone over this before. Beasley turns the ball over at a rate that's pretty consistent with other high usage wing players. Beasley - 12.3 TO%, 28.4 USG%, Durant - 10.5 TO%, 30.6 USG%, Granger - 12.6 TO%, 26.7 USG%. Compared to Barnes. Beasley has 3.1 TOs per 40 pace adjusted, Barnes has 2.4 TOs per 40 pace adjusted (again against much inferior defenders).

He's a ball stopper, those other guys are either elite at scoring or can create for themselves and others on a consistent basis to make up for the high turnovers. Beasley struggles to create his own shot, and he sure as hell isn't going to create many shots for others. I'd venture to think that a lot of Beasley's turnovers are from over dribbling/loose hanldes/over penetrating compared to those other guys having them come from other areas.

Barnes has a shaky handle as well and he may never fix that but he has a lot of ways to score. He has a mid-range jumper, 3 point shot, can get to the rim, has been drawing more fouls lately, and I've seen him post up as well. Barnes has to fight with Zeller and Henson for shots so he is making the most of it when he gets the chance.

AQuintus wrote:BBIQ - I'm not going to talk much on this because it can't be objectively measured, but even if Barnes does have high BBIQ than Beasley, does it even matter if it hasn't lead to better production against inferior competition?

Like I said before Barnes has to battle against Henson and Zeller for shots, and over the last half or so of the season has been playing like an All-American. Add in his great attitude/personality and I just think he's going to be a superb pro.

Devilzsidewalk · Post #813 » by **Devilzsidewalk** » Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:54 pm

ALICEinJAM wrote:Deandre Liggins?

the next Bruce Bowen!

Devilzsidewalk · Post #814 » by **Devilzsidewalk** » Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:55 pm

Klomp wrote:
Devilzsidewalk wrote:
Worm Guts wrote:Tyler Zeller consistently beats his guys down court and has incredible hands. If you want to run, he's definitely a guy you want to look at as a backup center.

he's doing it to Harrellson some too. That being said, I like Zeller's size, but I'd actually be positively giddy at the idea of having Harrellson on the roster as Bill Laimbeer's special project.

Wolves have been needing an annoying hustle guy ever since Mad Dog left. Plus he's got attitude and he's big too, I can just picture that guy being a local fan favorite and public enemy #1 for all opposing fans.

I think Tolliver has been that guy this year.

nah, Tolliver is a nice guy, I think people like him. We need a true villain. I big bully villain.

moss_is_1 · Post #815 » by **moss_is_1** » Tue Mar 29, 2011 3:17 pm

Beasley at least pisses people off with his trash talking I guess.

Krapinsky · Post #816 » by **Krapinsky** » Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:29 am

Colorado down 36-30 at the half to Bama. If Burks can lead his team to vicotry in the second half I'll be seriously impressed.

Krapinsky · Post #817 » by **Krapinsky** » Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:15 am

Bama outmuscling Buffs inside bigtime.

bluethunder0005 · Post #818 » by **bluethunder0005** » Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:16 pm

Well Burks couldn't hit the gamewinner but his game was solid outside of the poor shooting (6-14) which isn't awful. He's still my favorite player in this draft for the right price. I think he goes well next to Johnson or Beasley since he is a very good slasher and gets to the line at a high rate.

Krapinsky · Post #819 » by **Krapinsky** » Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:40 pm

Burks doesn't blow me away. He reminds me of Manny Harris.

jpatrick · Post #820 » by **jpatrick** » Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:54 pm

He reminds me of a poor man's Evan Turner which actually might be Manny Harris (or a little better than Manny Harris). Until Burks can consistently hit an 18-20 footer, no way he's an above average or even effective SG in the NBA. He does have decent form on the shot but it just doesn't go in at the moment. Can he fix this? That's a big question mark for someone people on this board are talking about as a top 10 pick.