Official Raptors 2011 NBA Draft Thread, Part 5

Dr Positivity · Post #1461 » by **Dr Positivity** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:15 pm

Well to me making a stand on opinions is 90% of the fun of projecting. If you disagree with me tell me why. I have no problem being proven wrong. I'm not here to say wishy washy stuff like "Well Kemba worries me but he can be great because every player can, I guess he can be a bust or be great and we just don't know!" for 1000 posts. I'd rather talk about the reasons why Kemba would succeed or fail. I don't think a 5'11 shoot first PG is a starter and I'll say it

The truth is there's a reason all these players succeed and fail and the fun of this part of the year is finding that out. Thabeet was too skinny to get position under the basket and had no head for the game. Jeff Teague was a SG in a PG's body. I should've foreseen that more 2 years ago

I don't think I've been any more absolutist than Reignman in this thread, not that he's been a problem, in fact he's probably been the MVP of the draft discussions so far. If I come off overconfident in my opinions that's a nice surpise for me because I'm the opposite out here. It's not like I'm beating my chest and calling out anyone for disagreeing with me as infedels

crosswalkryan · Post #1462 » by **crosswalkryan** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:24 pm

While i disagree with alot of your opinions on players, right on for not straddling the fence and being able to admit when youre wrong. Too many ppl jumping on you imo.

Dr Positivity · Post #1463 » by **Dr Positivity** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:32 pm

chocolateSensi wrote:
lol

1. no one is ripping on Mufasa. I'm just merely pointing out that his ability to accurately assess talent is below par, therefore his opinion should carry less value than others.

I disagree my friend, I don't think my history of opinions is anything to sneeze about compared to most here. Yeah I was wrong two years ago on Thabeet, Derozan, Teague, Clark. Over half this board were wrong on Thabeet, Teague and Clark collectively. Well not entirely wrong on Clark, I think everyone knew he had a high bust chance but it was worth it cause he had star talent. I've also been accurate on Monroe, Favors, Evans, Jennings, Hill, Lawson, Budinger, Patterson and others. And besides I'm fairly confident saying I've learned a lot from the wrong projections I have made

Secondly there is no coorelation between my history and the reasonings I'm giving for these players. If I'm wrong tell me why. It is my experience that the people who counter comments like "Barnes has no on ball skills" with "Well nobody should believe you because you stink!" are the ones who can't come with any better way to disagree with them

DreamTeam09 · Post #1464 » by **DreamTeam09** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:44 pm

I think Barnes is the player that fills all the questions you shud ask when selecting a player.

Does he fit long term...
Potential factor...
How good is he ri now...

Barnes fits here long term at the SF spot and with his style of play...
His potential could be as one of the best in this class...
He's as good as ne of top players in this draft ri now

So I don't see ne other direction to go in if Barnes is still on the board.

Post #1465 » by **5DOM** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:53 pm

DreamTeam09 wrote:He's as good as ne of top players in this draft ri now.

Not even close to being true.
Guys like Williams, Walker, Knight, Irving, Sullinger, Fredette and many more are clearly better players than him right now

Reignman · Post #1466 » by **Reignman** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:56 pm

LOL @ Fredette being better than Barnes.

That's like saying Mike James was better than J Kidd in 2005.

Post #1467 » by **5DOM** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:58 pm

Reignman wrote:LOL @ Fredette being better than Barnes.

That's like saying Mike James was better than J Kidd in 2005.

Except Barnes wasn't even close to being a Jason Kidd level player this year. Fredette was much better player this season. I don't know how this is even debatable

sunny · Post #1468 » by **sunny** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:59 pm

Reignman wrote:LOL @ Fredette being better than Barnes.

That's like saying Mike James was better than J Kidd in 2005.

in the game of college basketball, Fredette is so much better than Barnes, that it would be hard to even make a comparison between the two of them.
If you want to judge them as prospects in general or how they would fare in a game of 1 on 1, thats completely different, so I don't know what specifically you are trying to point out here.

drew_28 · Post #1469 » by **drew_28** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:02 pm

we don't even know who is declaring...

that being said, lets say we have fourth pick...Irving first, DWill second, Barnes third....assuming all the big players declare...who do we pick? PJones? Kanter? If Kentucky wins it all behind huge leadership from Knight do you go with him?

If Knight has a big game against Kemba Walker and leads the Wildcats to victory...that might sell it for me.

DreamTeam09 · Post #1470 » by **DreamTeam09** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:05 pm

No I still think Barnes is better than Jimmer. Jimmer may have done more, even more this season, but Barnes is prolly still a better player than him. I only say prolly because I don't speak in absolutes... The other guys u mentioned I don't think have pulled themselves far away enough to say they are clearly all better den Barnes ri now...

Reignman · Post #1471 » by **Reignman** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:07 pm

5DOM wrote:
Reignman wrote:LOL @ Fredette being better than Barnes.

That's like saying Mike James was better than J Kidd in 2005.

Except Barnes wasn't even close to being a Jason Kidd level player this year. Fredette was much better player this season. I don't know how this is even debatable

Compared to Fredette, Barnes was definitely J Kidd on defense.

Shoot, show me 1 highlight clip of Jimmer playing D and I'll be impressed.

Or are we only judging players on offense? In that case Bargs is the 15th best player in the league right?

Post #1472 » by **5DOM** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:15 pm

Jimmer was BYU. Although I think his teammates tend to get underrated, it's still safe to say Jimmer carried that team. What about Barnes? Probably the 3rd or 4th most important player on a very stacked team who IMO is much more replaceable than Jimmer for BYU. Jimmer, even without D, was clearly a better college player than Barnes this season.

CunningLinguist · Post #1473 » by **CunningLinguist** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:18 pm

drew_28 wrote:we don't even know who is declaring...

that being said, lets say we have fourth pick...Irving first, DWill second, Barnes third....assuming all the big players declare...who do we pick? PJones? Kanter? If Kentucky wins it all behind huge leadership from Knight do you go with him?

If Knight has a big game against Kemba Walker and leads the Wildcats to victory...that might sell it for me.

I take Knight and it doesn't matter to me what he does in the final 4.

sunny · Post #1474 » by **sunny** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:31 pm

Reignman wrote:
5DOM wrote:
Reignman wrote:LOL @ Fredette being better than Barnes.

That's like saying Mike James was better than J Kidd in 2005.

Except Barnes wasn't even close to being a Jason Kidd level player this year. Fredette was much better player this season. I don't know how this is even debatable

Compared to Fredette, Barnes was definitely J Kidd on defense.

Shoot, show me 1 highlight clip of Jimmer playing D and I'll be impressed.

Or are we only judging players on offense? In that case Bargs is the 15th best player in the league right?

If I only saw Jimmer in the tournament, I'd agree with you. But when they had Davies; Jimmer and the rest of the team were simply incredible. Jimmer this year was the best college player I had seen in years. He simply dominated everyone he played. Looking back on his games vs Arizona, UNLV, UTEP, SDSU and some others, he was flat out amazing.

Post DAvies, his defense and the rest of his team is a completely different story. Regardless, he contributed so much more than Barnes or really any other player in the ncaa this year.

TiKusDom · Post #1475 » by **TiKusDom** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:53 pm

drew_28 wrote:we don't even know who is declaring...

that being said, lets say we have fourth pick...Irving first, DWill second, Barnes third....assuming all the big players declare...who do we pick? PJones? Kanter? If Kentucky wins it all behind huge leadership from Knight do you go with him?

If Knight has a big game against Kemba Walker and leads the Wildcats to victory...that might sell it for me.

Knight is already one of the best prospects in this draft. Fighting for the best PG position with Kyrie, if he leads Kentucky to a championship on clutch play. while still being only 18, he will undoubtedly become guaranteed to be picked in the top 6. Everything about Knight screams impact player and winner.

The Raptors need to solidify their PG position to run this team for the the good next decade . Calderon is not the answer and the NBA is stacked with excellent point guards. An 18 year old two way player like Knight , who is dominating as a freshman, would be a perfect selection for the Raptors.

DreamTeam09 · Post #1476 » by **DreamTeam09** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:58 pm

I'm open to picking Knight if Barnes & Kyrie are off the board. I don't think knight goes top 6 but prolly top 10. So if we are as high as 4 i'd trade down & select knight while picking up another prospect. I'd take PJ top 5 b4 I take knight top 5 tho...

Post #1477 » by **Rhettmatic** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:00 pm

Chad Ford says Irving is leaning towards entering the draft.

Brinbe · Post #1478 » by **Brinbe** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:07 pm

Rhettmatic wrote:Chad Ford says Irving is leaning towards entering the draft.

Awesome, draft really didn't need to become any weaker. :lol:

And y'all already know my stance on Knight, but I agree with everything TiKusDom said. In fact, I think Knight's stock will only rise, similar to Paul George/Tyreke Evans in previous years. But hopefully, unlike those previous years, we'll still be in drafting range in June to pick him up.

Post #1479 » by **5DOM** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:08 pm

Rhettmatic wrote:Chad Ford says Irving is leaning towards entering the draft.

He should just declare right now.

Post #1480 » by **FluLikeSymptoms** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:08 pm

Rhettmatic wrote:Chad Ford says Irving is leaning towards entering the draft.

Coach K won't try to stop him with Rivers and Cook coming in, will he?