Draft Thread Continued. 2011 part two...

[fishercob]

There are varying degrees of projects. If we're 5th or 6th and Irving, Williams, Kanter and Barnes are all gone, I'd go with one of the Euro's. They can mature in Europe during the lockout, where are domestic "projects" like Perry Jones are more likely to languish.

[Dat2U]

There are varying degrees of projects. If we're 5th or 6th and Irving, Williams, Kanter and Barnes are all gone, I'd go with one of the Euro's. They can mature in Europe during the lockout, where are domestic "projects" like Perry Jones are more likely to languish.

So we want to draft players simply b/c they have the option to go to Europe? Meh. It didn't matter one iota how much experience Oleksiy Pecherov or Vicktor Khyrapa got in Europe. They were going to suck once they put on an NBA uniform.

I'm not against drafting a Euro player, but it needs to be based solely on the merits that they are the best available talent on the board, not simply whether they can stay in Europe and get extra seasoning against middlin' at best competition.

[fishercob]

No, Dat. I'm not saying their ability to go to Europe is not the sole criteria. What I was saying was all things equal, if we're picking between projects, I'd pick the one who has the means to keep improving immediately -- at a critical stage of their development.

[Dark Faze]

Now with Rubio likely coming to Minnesota next season, what would the Wolves do with a top 2 pick? They already have Love, Randolph, Beasley, Wesley Johnson at the 3/4...and Rubio, Ridnour and Flynn at PG. I can't see how either Irving or Derrick Williams would fit there.

I'd think they'd like a legit center since their rotation of Darko and Pekovic hasn't cut it long term. Perhaps they are a candidate to trade down with Washington for a Kanter or Voluncios and the WIz could nab DW with their pick?

I think its a good possibility that this could happen. From what I've heard Wolves fans would like to move Beasley and try to get an upgrade at the 2 through such a trade and draft Williams for the 3 if possible...but I think that's unlikely.

Either way Wiz fans should feel pretty good right now. With the way our schedule looks right now and with the needs that other teams have there is a good chance that we'll be able to get whatever guy we want.

[nate33]

Now with Rubio likely coming to Minnesota next season, what would the Wolves do with a top 2 pick? They already have Love, Randolph, Beasley, Wesley Johnson at the 3/4...and Rubio, Ridnour and Flynn at PG. I can't see how either Irving or Derrick Williams would fit there.

I'd think they'd like a legit center since their rotation of Darko and Pekovic hasn't cut it long term. Perhaps they are a candidate to trade down with Washington for a Kanter or Voluncios and the WIz could nab DW with their pick?

Interesting notion eitanr.

Would we trade, say, the #5 plus the #20 to move up to #2 and draft DWill? Would Minnesota? What about the #5 plus Nick Young?

I'm not sure Minnesota is at the point where they can look for "fit" ahead of BPA. If Williams is there at #2, I think they'd be inclined to draft him and then figure out what to do with Beasley and or Wesley Johnson.

But what about some other scenarios? Let's say Minnesota is picking 3rd, we're picking 5th, and Williams is off the board. Presumably, Minnesota would be eyeing Kanter. Would we trade up so we could nab Barnes? Or do we do nothing and hope that Barnes slips on his own?

[peZt]

For reference, here's that picture of Kanter (#0), Terrance Jones (#3) (and Rod Strickland!!!) again, probably taken in mid to late 2010.....



The Hoops Summit April 2010 measurements for Kanter were....

Height: 6'10.5
Weight: 255
Wingspan: 7'1

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Nik ... -One-3429/

Standing Reach is supposedly 9'1".

Terrence Jones was measured in July of 2009 at the Le Bon Bon camp as being....

Height: 6'8"
Weight: 219
Wingspan: 7'

http://inside.nikebasketball.com/news/w ... Roster.pdf

Draw whatever conclusions you will.

A few months after the hoop summit Kanter was measured at 6'11. So hes atleast 6'11 and maybe 6'11.5 right now. He might not have great length but I wouldnt call him undersized.
And imo he is a pf and not a center and for a 4 he has excellent size.

[LyricalRico]

^ I don't want anymore projects. I understand the reasoning that we should go for the "high risk, high reward" pick since we're probably going to stink next year anyway. I just don't want to go that route, and that's what Perry Jones would represent for me.

I wouldn't disagree, but what do you do in a scenario which is fairly likely, that Barnes, DW, and Kanter are all off the board?

Find somebody salivating over Jones and Trade out for a 2012 pick. Detroit needs a longterm solution at SF, so does Cleveland. Our 2011 pick to CLE for the 2011 pick they got from Miami plus their own 2012 pick unprotected works for me. It would be a hard PR sell, but that's what I'd like to see happen if all of the guys that will fill needs for us and can play right away are off the board.

[Dark Faze]

Now with Rubio likely coming to Minnesota next season, what would the Wolves do with a top 2 pick? They already have Love, Randolph, Beasley, Wesley Johnson at the 3/4...and Rubio, Ridnour and Flynn at PG. I can't see how either Irving or Derrick Williams would fit there.

I'd think they'd like a legit center since their rotation of Darko and Pekovic hasn't cut it long term. Perhaps they are a candidate to trade down with Washington for a Kanter or Voluncios and the WIz could nab DW with their pick?

Interesting notion eitanr.

Would we trade, say, the #5 plus the #20 to move up to #2 and draft DWill? Would Minnesota? What about the #5 plus Nick Young?

I'm not sure Minnesota is at the point where they can look for "fit" ahead of BPA. If Williams is there at #2, I think they'd be inclined to draft him and then figure out what to do with Beasley and or Wesley Johnson.

But what about some other scenarios? Let's say Minnesota is picking 3rd, we're picking 5th, and Williams is off the board. Presumably, Minnesota would be eyeing Kanter. Would we trade up so we could nab Barnes? Or do we do nothing and hope that Barnes slips on his own?

I'd be hesitant to trade Nick. I'm a huge Williams fan but I doubt i'd do it. I'd definitely trade Crawford before Nick.

Of course Minnesota will want to take the best player available but there is also the chance they get the #1 overall and actually go with Irving...to act as if Rubio is a sure thing would be dumb.

So at this point I don't even know how to speculate. For all we know Sota could get Irving and the Cavs could have two picks ahead of us, trade down with Sac , Sac chooses Williams, Cavs go with Barnes/Kanter/Late first rounder from Sac or Cousins or something...

*shrug*

Its going to be a wild finish...

[LyricalRico]

Let's say Minnesota is picking 3rd, we're picking 5th, and Williams is off the board. Presumably, Minnesota would be eyeing Kanter. Would we trade up so we could nab Barnes? Or do we do nothing and hope that Barnes slips on his own?

If they know we covet Barnes, they could take him and try to force a trade. Of course that would only work if whoever is at #4 passes on Kanter, so they would still be taking a risk. Best case for Minny is probably them picking 4th with a CLE/WAS/SAC top 3 (in any order) since that would almost certainly mean Kanter is gift wrapped for them.

Of course, if the Wiz are #3 and Minny is #4 and we know they really want Kanter, we could take him and force them to deal 4+19 to get him. We take Barnes at #4 and gain another pick (although I'd prefer not to use it, maybe package it with the ATL pick to get another 2012 pick or maybe a vet).

[closg00]

I'd take Donut before Jones, if Kanter is gone.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFqK-YXlsHs&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]

[nate33]

Let's say Minnesota is picking 3rd, we're picking 5th, and Williams is off the board. Presumably, Minnesota would be eyeing Kanter. Would we trade up so we could nab Barnes? Or do we do nothing and hope that Barnes slips on his own?

If they know we covet Barnes, they could take him and try to force a trade. Of course that would only work if whoever is at #4 passes on Kanter, so they would still be taking a risk. Best case for Minny is probably them picking 4th with a CLE/WAS/SAC top 3 (in any order) since that would almost certainly mean Kanter is gift wrapped for them.

Of course, if the Wiz are #3 and Minny is #4 and we know they really want Kanter, we could take him and force them to deal 4+19 to get him. We take Barnes at #4 and gain another pick (although I'd prefer not to use it, maybe package it with the ATL pick to get another 2012 pick or maybe a vet).

Interesting analysis. When you think about it, we have a big advantage because we could use any of Kanter, Barnes or Williams. If we're drafting ahead of Minny, we could just pick the guy we think they want, and then work out a trade (though surely we wouldn't play any games like that if Williams was still on the board). If we're drafting after them, they wouldn't have much negotiating leverage because we could could simply draft the next best guy on our board without considering it much of a downgrade.

[fishercob]

I'd take Donut before Jones, if Kanter is gone.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFqK-YXlsHs&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]

Wow, he looks like an infinitely better prospect than Valanciunus to me.

[nate33]

Yeah, pretty impressive. He certainly seems pretty skilled for a 20-year-old big man. My only real criticism is that he doesn't really get off the floor when he jumps. He seems barely able to dunk the ball.

nbadraft.net has a write up on him which indicates that he has quick feet and projects to be a power forward. They also noted that he's sometimes a bit lazy, relying on his superior athleticism. However, the write-up is 2 years old. The DX write-up says he's a highly skilled offensive player but a terrible rebounder and an uninterested defender. He sounds a bit like Blatche, but with less length and quicker feet.

[DMVleGeND]

I would love to have Jones. He's my 2nd favorite prospect right now behind D-Will. He's raw right now, but if developed properly and put on the right team, he can be special. I think that it would be good for him to slip a little because he isn't ready to make a big contribution right away, and he the expectations won't be as high for him to produce right away, but some teams might draft him very high because this draft isn't deep.

I want D-Will, and would draft him if he was available with our pick, but if that were to happen, I would try to find away we could get another top 10 pick and hope that Jones falls to us.

D-Will and/or PJIII FTW!!!

[Hoopalotta]

While a Polish(ed) offensive player, Donnie Mountjoy looks like an outright disaster to me on the defensive end.

The iconic DX pic strongly suggests that the dude has some 'itty-bitty little arms that aren't going to be good for much more than flailing feebly while absorbing whiplash dunks.



I don't think he can rebound either.

While possessing a more versatile offensive game, I'm expecting not un Yi-like result. I'd suggest that Valentine's defensive potential is many strata higher and I've got Vesley as having better tools too.

As to Kanter, if he does push the size mentioned by some here, I'd feel a lot better about him, though I'm not sold on the power forward talk. But if he has the bulk to bully-boy properly from the 5 spot, that would go a long way as I feel you need at least one of size or athleticism going for you in conjunction with skill/feel/toughness.

[Ruzious]

Yeah, pretty impressive. He certainly seems pretty skilled for a 20-year-old big man. My only real criticism is that he doesn't really get off the floor when he jumps. He seems barely able to dunk the ball.

nbadraft.net has a write up on him which indicates that he has quick feet and projects to be a power forward. They also noted that he's sometimes a bit lazy, relying on his superior athleticism. However, the write-up is 2 years old. The DX write-up says he's a highly skilled offensive player but a terrible rebounder and an uninterested defender. He sounds a bit like Blatche, but with less length and quicker feet.

He's definitely not an above the rim player and not a power player. My inclination is to stay away from 7 footers who play like 3's. Then again, who knows - maybe he develops into Pau Gasol lite.

[eitanr]

Montiejunas seems like a mix of Andrea Bargnani, Raef Lafrentz, and Toni Kukoc...Does seem like a Yi Jianlian or a soft PF. Meh, Wiz got Blatche, McGee we need a tough interior player. If we go for finesse it should be Derrick Williams.

Now to completely contradict myself I find myself convincing myself that Perry Jones could be worth a risk if Kanter, DW are gone. (And Barnes is not entering or gone etc).

He was projected by many scouts to be the top pick prior to the year and even early on in the year. I just feel if scouts saw that kind of potential in him then he has tremendous upside there. Could be a terrific up tempo 4 with Wall. I could see it working. I just don't see those draft day trades panning out and as much as I'd love an extra 2012 pick, I think the Wiz are more than likely sitting on such a pick unless some GM gets obsessed with a prospect.

I also do love Terrence Jones and feel he could be had via a trade using that Atlanta pick and/or the 2nd rounder. I still look at Charlotte as a possible partner, them or Milwaukee may bit at something.

[The Consiglieri]

^ I don't want anymore projects. I understand the reasoning that we should go for the "high risk, high reward" pick since we're probably going to stink next year anyway. I just don't want to go that route, and that's what Perry Jones would represent for me.

The Hawks pick, or the Hawks pick with the 33rd/34th pick in a deal up should be used on the non-project though, and I expect that. The top pick needs to be the guy with the best chance of genuinely being a building block for the future. Unlike the previous post to yours, i actually feel were slotted for 3/4, pending some results, w/a probable drop if we have bad luck of 1-2 slots, meaning we should be slotted somewhere between 3 and 6th overall, i actually think 5th or 6th is basically worst case scenario. Granted we normally achieve that in the lottery but maybe Leonsis brought some luck. We seemingly can't miss w/the caps these days after all (loads of bottom of round 1 guys playing like top 5 picks in the minors or already with the big club, the latest being Kuzy, 2nd or 3rd highest rated euro skater, and we nabbed him at 24?!?! finally a pay off for a miserable choke job yet again by the caps last spring, at the world juniors this winter Kuzy blew up and was considered the best prospect, period, if a redraft happened he would probably go in the top 2-5 of last years draft-anyway, i digressed.

I really think after Barnes, if he comes out, Kantner, and D Will there really isnt any guy that makes sense other than Perry Jones. Granted I feel we already have two athletic mental wastes in Blatche and McGee, but Perry actually seems to mean well, all things considered and he has the most athletic talent in the draft, period. After the top 2-3 guys go, you are basically looking at making the mistake minny made last year in getting a role player with no upside in Johnson, or going for the gold with a guy with a great ceiling like Cousins (cant remember if Favors was available or not when Minny made that moronic pick), we cant pull a minny. You don't draft a role player after a 21 to 22 win season, you draft a building block, even a building block with risk. Im from the bay area and watched the warriors pull those draft day moves for more than a decade after the twin immaturity debacles of Webber and later Spreewell. It gutted the team and gave them no future, they missed out on Garnett, and Kobe and many other superstuds because of that mindset, i get it, but its not the way to go in my view.

You have to take the chance. We aren't winning titles with a mediocre role player being the best we get out of this draft, you have to shoot for the stars, if we end up in the gutter, so what? At least we tried and we can try again, much better than the ashes in your mouth feeling warriors fans experienced for the last 18 years, and what we experienced with the Sheed, and Webber trades and just the general horrors of the last 30 years. Better to try and fail, then knowingly go for the safe, and sure to win you nothing pick, in my view. We'll have plenty picks to land role players in future years, and we already have the ammo due to the Hirich trade anyway, to balance a risk lotto pick with a more conservative role player pick (though i think singleton if he comes out, will go too high for us to get a sniff w/o a trade up).

[LyricalRico]

He sounds a bit like Blatche, but with less length and quicker feet.

I was about to post the same thing. Yeah - I'm not touching this guy with a 10 foot pole. Next prospect, please.

[Liverbird]

If we're in the top 4 of the lottery I think we're positioned nicely to draft an impact player. Presuming Barnes declares, I anticipate the top four picks being:

1) Irving
2) Williams
3) Kanter/Barnes
4) Barnes/Kanter

Now the Wiz Kids could use either one of Williams, Kanter, or Barnes and I'd be perfectly happy. I think the scenario that's more interesting is if we fall outside of the top 4. Like many here, I really don't want a project. If Ted's suddenly has a rush of poor luck and we finish 5th in the lottery, would you trade the ATL pick and the 5th to move up 2 or 3 slots or perhaps more? For example:

Cleveland - Irving
Minnesota - Williams
Sacramento - Kanter
Toronto - Harrison
Washington - ???

What would be reasonable trades for the Wiz to get into the top 4?