Draft Thread Continued. 2011 part two...

[fishercob]

Meh. While it's far from ideal that an already thin draft is being watered down more, I'm not too concerned that we're going to miss out on a super high pick next year. The season will be heavily truncated if it happens at all -- and we'll still suck. Barnes or Jones or Sully may yet be Wizards.

Pending what happens for us in this year's draft, I wouldn't consider that as being particularly good returns on two year's of tanking, though.

Whomever. You get my point.

[Hoopalotta]

Meh. While it's far from ideal that an already thin draft is being watered down more, I'm not too concerned that we're going to miss out on a super high pick next year. The season will be heavily truncated if it happens at all -- and we'll still suck. Barnes or Jones or Sully may yet be Wizards.

Pending what happens for us in this year's draft, I wouldn't consider that as being particularly good returns on two year's of tanking, though.

Whomever. You get my point.

As of now and assuming we're talking tank next year, a lot seems to hinge on the league's position on one-and-doners on the other side of the CBA. Ideally, they keep it, we stink and a number of freshmen assert themselves as top pic material.

If they force guys to be two year's removed from high school, it's a game changer and I'd probably endorse trying to make the playoffs next year (if there's a season) and skipping the tank as the odds and payout are just very poor if it really is just Barnes, Sully, Jones and then a drop off.

IMO, we can't be honest with ourselves and say that any and all outcomes align with our interests here. There are scenarios in which the high lottery just isn't paying out and shooting for it is doing more damage than is being recouped; in those instances, you've got to look at the peripheral spheres of trade/free agency/internal development/BOYD for the majority of the improvement

[theboomking]

Looks like we are dropping in the lotto. For us to pick 3rd, we would have to lose to Cleveland, Toronto would have to beat the Heat, and we'd have to win a coin flip against Toronto.

Furthermore, both the Nets and Kings only have one more win than us. On Wednesday, the Nets play the Bulls, the Kings play the Lakers, and as stated above, we play Cleveland. I'd say the odds are that we beat Cleveland and the Bulls and Lakers win and we have to flip a coin against Sacramento and New Jersey. Odds are that we win one coin flip and lose one.

I think we are most likely to be 5th in the lotto. Not good. We need to rest our starters against Cleveland.

[pineappleheadindc]

Looks like we are dropping in the lotto. For us to pick 3rd, we would have to lose to Cleveland, Toronto would have to beat the Heat, and we'd have to win a coin flip against Toronto.

Furthermore, both the Nets and Kings only have one more win than us. On Wednesday, the Nets play the Bulls, the Kings play the Lakers, and as stated above, we play Cleveland. I'd say the odds are that we beat Cleveland and the Bulls and Lakers win and we have to flip a coin against Sacramento and New Jersey. Odds are that we win one coin flip and lose one.

I think we are most likely to be 5th in the lotto. Not good. We need to rest our starters against Cleveland.

Okay, the part of your post I highlighted made me literally spit out my soda. Funny as heck.

[Illuminaire]

And with the 9th pick in the 2011 draft, the Washington Wizards select... an unpronounceable European stiff!

[theboomking]

I don't see how Singleton is any different from Booker. Seems like a redundant pick to me.

As I've said before, you can't make up for the lack of toughness in our primary rotation by adding a bunch of redundant tough role players. The problem is that none of Blatche, Lewis or McGee are tough. A 2nd unit of Singleton, Booker and Seraphin won't change that fact. They'll just come in and clang perimeter shots.

The difference is that Singleton is taller and longer, and in college could guard 4 positions on the floor. In the NBA, that might be 3, but Singleton is still a more versatile player than Booker. Wasn't FSU historically good with regards to opposing FG% while Singleton was uninjured? I like Booker a lot, but think we could use both players, and could even play both at the same time, though our scoring would likely suffer.

[pineappleheadindc]

.
The Wiz are 6-4 in their last 10 games, 5-2 in their last 7.

New Jersey is only 1 game ahead of us. They know how to tank, 1-9 in their last 10, losers of 4 in a row. They had a perfect tank game tonight, losing to Charlotte by 2. And they play the Bulls on Wednesday, guaranteed loss...so tank-o-licious.

I have a hunch that NJ is going to "catch" us on Wednesday while we play Cleveland. The Nets aren't even trying. If there is such a thing as lottery karma, teams that tank so obviously - like NJ and Toronto - get passed over on lottery night by teams that at least have been trying to win. Like the Wizards and the Kings, who are also 6-4 in their last 10 games.

Just sayin'.

[Hoopalotta]

Jersey doesn't even own their pick; it was traded to Utah.

They are actually this bad.

[pineappleheadindc]

Jersey doesn't even own their pick; it was traded to Utah.

They are actually this bad.

Oh my, they suck then. You can't even blame it on tanking.

[Hoopalotta]

C'est le guerre, mon chéri.

[Prestige]

Quick question. Lets say the Wizards get the 2nd pick. Cleveland picks Derrick Williams with the first pick. No Barnes, Jones, or Sullinger. What do you do? Would your team pick Irving? I guess with the intention to trade him?

[Dark Faze]

Kanter or a trade...I believe a trade would be more likely at this point.

With that said, what is the view on trading a 2012 draft pick (unprotected) for Derrick Williams?

The shock, the horror, can it be done, I know I know....

My reasoning is thus:

The draft is still happening before the outcome of the CBA. This draft is officially terrible now for a team selecting 4th or 5th and in need of starters. That's probably where we'll end up. There is a possibility of a sophmore limit being in the new CBA. If that happens we'd be looking at probably finishing at the 4th or 5th spot again next year, if not better, and looking at the same faces like Barnes and Sully who decided not to enter. It'd be the same situation and the result would be two years worth of losing while getting almost zero value. That's horrifying.

With the draft looking as bad as it does now, and with the 2012 draft looking stacked so long as fresh men can enter, I wonder if we could get away with trading a late 1st round pick (ATL) and our unprotected 2012 first round draft pick for the number 2 pick overall pick in the draft for this year.

We'd still have our #4, 5, or whatever pick we'll end up with, along with the #2. This would allow us to get Williams and potentially Kanter.

And I don't see any reason why a team like the Wolves or Cavs would be against it if that deal is offered. The Cavs still have the Clippers lottery pick for this draft, they know they will suck again next year, so being able to have two lotto picks in next years draft is great forward thinking. For the Wolves? They have too many forwards right now as it is and Rubio is (if reports are to be believed) coming over ASAP. A chance to have Rubio and Love together is probably a big enough change for them along with our pick, all while knowing they stand a chance at getting a couple of lotto picks in a better draft the year after.

I'm interested in hearing any thoughts on this. I just don't know how interested I am in going through this process all over again. I think this team needs to strike now and gather as many assets as they can in this draft and then just work through free agency.

[Dat2U]

Kanter with the 2nd pick in the draft?

No, I wouldn't dare go down that route.

Only reason half this board is even considering Kanter is because they haven't been able to watch him and critique his faults.

I'd take Kyrie Irving or even Kemba Walker and just grin and bear it until a deal comes along.

Personally I think Kemba might be able to play alongside Wall in a Ben Gordon type role. It's not ideal, but Kemba is probably the safest bet remaining in the draft in terms of his ability to score at an NBA level.

Enes is just one big **** questionmark. Everyone is going gaga over a freaking all-star game he dominated against a bunch of high schoolers a year ago. Other than that, he hasn't played a lick of competitive basketball in two years.

Man I can't believe Perry Jones went back to school, that was a real shocker right there.

This draft is officially horrible. Normally I'd say take the risk and go with the upside when it comes to a high lottery pick, but in this draft, maybe that's not the best way to go.

Trade it for a 2012 or maybe even a 2013 unprotected pick. Trade it for a young veteran that can grow with Wall. Or maybe just take the best known quantity available even though they play the same position as Wall (Irving, Walker or Knight). Wall played well with Bledsoe. Mainly b/c Bledsoe was willing to defer and had a jumper. Irving, Walker & Knight all are solid jump shooters so it could work at least in the short term. If Flip stays it would force Flip to open his offense up a bit and show more of the two guard look, which I actually prefer. Of course that means waving Nick Young goodbye, but I don't see much benefit in paying Nick Young big money anyways.

[dangermouse]

And with the 6th pick in the 2011 NBA Draft, the Washington Wizards select...... Bismack "my biatch up" Biyombo.

No Sully, No Barnes, No Jones?

If we don;t land DWill ill cry.

[Hoopalotta]

Quick question. Lets say the Wizards get the 2nd pick. Cleveland picks Derrick Williams with the first pick. No Barnes, Jones, or Sullinger. What do you do? Would your team pick Irving? I guess with the intention to trade him?

Yeah, I'd think we'd take Irving and trade him.

The draft is still happening before the outcome of the CBA. This draft is officially terrible now for a team selecting 4th or 5th and in need of starters. That's probably where we'll end up. There is a possibility of a sophmore limit being in the new CBA. If that happens we'd be looking at probably finishing at the 4th or 5th spot again next year, if not better, and looking at the same faces like Barnes and Sully who decided not to enter. It'd be the same situation and the result would be two years worth of losing while getting almost zero value. That's horrifying.

As noted, that's my thinking too; we'd be outright fools to center our plans around the 2012 draft if the CBA is going to force guys to play two seasons of college ball and it's Sullinger-Barnes-Jones-Henson and whomever developed from this past year's freshman class.

But it's too early to endorse the trade of an unprotected 1st; you'd really want some more legit inside information on the one-and-done thing before speaking on that as 2012 is probably a great draft if they maintain status quo.

I will say I'd cough up our whole 2011 draft (5th?) and Booker for the rights to Derrick Williams. I'd also consider trading the pick under the right circumstances. Beyond that I'm not really sure.

This draft is officially horrible. Normally I'd say take the risk and go with the upside when it comes to a high lottery pick, but in this draft, maybe that's not the best way to go.

Yeah, I don't even know who the upside player in our range would be to even consider.

[Kanyewest]

Enes is just one big **** questionmark. Everyone is going gaga over a freaking all-star game he dominated against a bunch of high schoolers a year ago. Other than that, he hasn't played a lick of competitive basketball in two years.

Kanter did look good in that all star game though where he scored 34 points. The previous record for an international with the most points was Dirk Nowitzki with 33 points. Kanter does have some range on his jumper which would make him an interesting player at the 4 or 5. Then again, his athleticism doesn't seem great which may prevent him from playing effective defense although he does seem like a decent rebounder.

BTW, interesting to note that Kanter has been practicing with that Kentucky team- he practiced against Harrelson which may be a big reason why Harrelson developed his strength this season (although by that logic one think he would have developed it working in practice against Cousins, Orton and Patterson). Agree, taking Kanter is a huge risk because no one has seen him play but I wouldn't rule out taking him either especially since he probably learned a great deal practicing with that Kentucky team.

That being said, I'm intrigued by Irving and Kemba Walker. Wizards do need a backup point guard- but that doesn't seem like the best plan of attack when using your #5 pick. Then again, not sure what the Wizards other options are if Derrick Williams is off the board.

[Dat2U]

TIER I - Superstar talent
None
TIER II - Potential All-star or solid starter
SF Derrick Williams
PG Kyrie Irving
PG Kemba Walker
TIER III - Potential starter or solid role player
CE Jonas Valanciunas
CE Enes Kanter
CE Bismack Biyombo
PF Jan Vesely
PF Donatas Motiejunas
PF Marcus Morris
PF Markieff Morris
SF Terrence Jones
SF Jordan Hamilton
SF Chris Singleton
PG Brandon Knight
TIER IV - Potential role player or bench depth
PF Kenneth Faried
PF Nikola Mirotic
PF Trey Thompkins
PF Justin Harper
PF Tobias Harris
SF Kawhi Leonard
SF Tyler Honeycutt
SF Jeff Taylor
SG Travis Leslie
SG Alec Burks
SG Nolan Smith
PG Jimmer Fredette
TIER V - Deep bench depth or NBDL types
CE Jordan Williams
CE Rick Jackson
PF Nikola Vucevic
PF JuJuan Johnson
SF Gilbert Brown
SF Bogan Bodganovic
SF Kyle Singler
SF Jereme Richmond
SG Shelvin Mack
SG David Lighty
SG Marshon Brooks
SG E'Twuan Moore
SG Josh Shelby
SG Malcolm Lee
PG Reggie Jackson
PG Norris Cole
PG Iman Shumpert
PG Ben Hansbrough
PG Charles Jenkins

This is just a brutal draft IMO. No stars whatsoever and only 3 guys I'd classified as sure fire solid NBA players on the next level. And two of them play our best player's position. Yikes. The worst thing to me in this draft is for us to have the 3rd or 4th pick and have to choose from either Kemba Walker or reach for one of the Euro bigs. At that point I'd just prefer a trade.

The order above is based on position and need, not rank. I have no idea who's the 4th best prospect in this draft. Valanciunas? A best case scenario for him would be Biedrins with better hands. Doesn't look like much of a defender in Euro competition to me from what I saw. Long, rangy, not exceedingly athletic but works hard. Biyombo? An freak of nature in terms of length but very little skill. I guess his effort & energy grades out high. So that would put him ahead of Thabeet I guess. Moves better than Sene but real age is a concern. I don't think I could take him with our 1st pick. If his best case scenario is Ibaka, that's okay. I wouldn't mind an Ibaka from this draft, but he screams 'flash in the pan' to me. I don't know who scares me more. Kanter or Biyombo.

Guys I'm not a fan of:
Terrence Jones - Incredibly inconsistent. Not a great athlete. Wonder if ball skills will be neutralized by suspect athleticism. What position is he?
Kawhi Leonard - looks like a PF masquerading in a SFs body. Reminds me of Joey Graham.
Alec Burks - I'm leery of SG's who can't shoot. Could be underrating him though.
Nolan Smith - Does nothing exceedingly well. Not one skill or physical trait he can rely on.
Kyle Singler - Unathletic scorer who's shooting is overrated.
Charles Jenkins - Reminds me of Lester Hudson. Not a great athlete, don't think he can finish on the NBA level.

[doclinkin]

I'd add 3pt bomber PG Andrew Goudelock to the Tier IV roleplayers.

[dangermouse]

Whos the next best SF prospect after DWill?

[Ruzious]

Quick question. Lets say the Wizards get the 2nd pick. Cleveland picks Derrick Williams with the first pick. No Barnes, Jones, or Sullinger. What do you do? Would your team pick Irving? I guess with the intention to trade him?

Kanter. Obviously, if I was a GM, I'd have to look at him with a fine toothed comb - both his game and his knees. But speaking as a poster who doesn't have access to all the info that NBA people will have, he is the pick - unless the pick is traded. Then I could see Irving in the picture. Walker is definitely not in the picture. I think he can eventually be a good NBA starting point guard, but it'd make no sense for the Zards to pick him.

DM, I think Terrence Jones is the next best 3. He's definitely unorthodox as a 3 and needs to work on his jump shot, but I like his style of play.