Draft Thread Continued. 2011 part two...

[theboomking]

I didn't see any UCLA games so the tournament was the first I saw of Honeycutt but he intrigued me. Reminded me a lot of Matt Barnes, but maybe with a little more offensive skill and ready to contribute right away. I guess #18 would be too high to take a guy like that in most drafts, but it might be just right this year. He'd be an option if we went big in the lottery.

I like but don't love Honeycutt. He isn't too efficient on offense, but neither was Westbrook at UCLA. With his length and athleticism, I wonder if Honeycutt could develop into a Batum-like player.

If we drop to 5th or below, i'd happily trade the pick for Wes Johnson.

Hmmm....how high a pick would you give up for Evan Turner?


And, what's with everyone wanting Booker to be a SF? I thought he might fit there in the beginning of the season, before I saw him play. Booker was not nearly as good at SF as at PF this season, doesn't have any handle to speak of, or a mid-range shot. Outside of Wall, no position on this team couldn't use an upgrade. Draft talent first and find the fit later. BPA, BPA, BPA. Even if that is Irving, try to draft him then trade him.

There also seems to be a common sentiment that we should take safe, mature players, so we can get better faster and Wall won't want to leave at the end of his contract. There are mature, hard working players available every year in the draft and in FA. Players that have the upside to be truly elite are more rare. We need to try to draft a star, even at the risk of missing on a pick, and worry about filling in mature, role players later. This team shouldn't be racing to 40 win mediocrity. We should be aiming for a championship. How much do players like Derron Williams and possibly Dwight Howard appreciate playing on a good team every year that has little chance of winning a championship? When on a 50 win team with solid surrounding pieces, most want to leave for a potential 60 win team that has another star or two.

[hands11]

I don't see how drafting a SF (Williams or Harrison) would case a roster problem at all. We have Lewis and Booker who can play both positions. Should we draft a SF with our lottery pick we could still play Booker/Pick at SF and Blatche/Lewis at PF. Lewis effectively replaces Yi in the rotation.

Wall/Crawford/(Nolan)
NY1/Jeffers
Booker/(Williams/Harrison/Jones)
Blatche/Lewis/(Morris)
McGee/Seraphin

Alternatively, if Williams or Harrison are off the board, I'd be perfectly happy with Kanter.

Wall/Crawford/(Nolan)
NY1/Jeffers
Booker/Lewis
Blatche/(Kanter)/(Morris)
McGee/Seraphin

Still don't like the Blatche and McGee defensive combo though.

Wall/Crawford
Nick/Mo/Jeffers
Booker/Lewis
Dray/Harper/Seraphin
McGee/Enes

Hamady/Owens

I think this would be the better way to go.

We aren't far off when you compare your second scenario. The big difference I that I don't see Seraphin as a reliable/viable option at back up center yet but I think Enes can be immediately. Seraphin has value but only in spot duty and for his potential for down the road. But the combination of McGee, Enes, Seraphin and Dray gives us enough players to cover center while also giving you your post PF back ups and PF range shooters.

Then

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Marcus-Morris-5178/
or
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Justin-Harper-6341/

I would be happy with either.

Morris is more physical inside.
Harper a little taller and is the better pure shooter.

Morris reminds me of a James Worthy/Carlos Bozier type personality.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8ijqwFfL8Y&NR=1[/youtube]


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9GhIQZoa14[/youtube]


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JpQNvG1I7Hg[/youtube]

Models his game after KD with a Kobe smile and a great interview. Seems mature.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkzhW7VIm2c[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOtf2ojRKOA&feature=related[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dmyfUzYkOo[/youtube]

Looks like a 6-10 Curry. What a quick release and a pure sharp shooter.

So you want a Bozier more physical type or someone who could be like a KD like who seems to be more a camera friendly star type and maybe a little smarter, who could probably play at multiple positions.

Either combo I think would be a great draft.

Anes/Morris
or
Anes/Harper

[Ruzious]

Ryen Russillo on the 4/13 NBA today podcast talked for a while about the Euro prospects in the draft. He absolutely murdered Johnny Valentine. He basically said that he doesn't even consider him an NBA player. Apparently he's watched tons of film of JV on Synergy sports. It's a good listen. He was rather convincing. I wouldn't take him with the 18th pick.

Well, that doesn't sound good as I'd consider Russillo quite respectable there (I heartily applauded his calling out Whiteside as being a disaster).

I just listened to Russilo's Monday and Wednesday podcasts, he had some good nuggets:

* The lockout will have minimal impact on kids declaring. Most guys in the top of the draft can get a line of credit from their agent if need be.

* Lots of GM's are a little suspicious of Barnes. They think his stock is still high thanks to his high school hype, but his college performance so far hasn't lived up to his rep. With that the case, most scouts and GM's really think it's in his best interest to go ahead and declare right now while there's still some good vibes leftover from high school. If he waits, there's a good chance that he finds himself much lower in the next draft. That bodes well for him declaring, but maybe not so good for us if we pick him.

* Jonas sucks. He has a predictable offensive game, minimal strength, and mediocre athleticism. He is flabbergasted that DX ranks him #2.

* Kanter looks real good. Russillo really likes his basketball IQ. Said me makes great reads of the pick and knows whether to pop, roll, or slip the screen. He has some perimeter game but is also willing to mix it up down low.

* He likes Vesely a lot too. Athletic and fun to watch. Will take it to the rack against anyone. Will get pushed around a bit until he fills out, but he'll bring max effort every night. He really enjoys the game. He also says that he has a way of generating space for his jumper that it reminsicent of Dirk (though he reiterated that he is NOT saying Vesely will be the next Dirk).

* Donny Mountjoy is skinny and soft. He sucks.

* Biyombo is impressive. He liked his offense even more than his defense. Says that everyone questions his age.

Good stuff guys. I'm particularly surprised/shocked to hear he's so impressed with Biyombo's offense. And pleased to hear he likes Vesely. If we get unlucky in the lottery, we'll need options, and those 2 could be among them.

[closg00]

Anyone else here watch Biyombo vs the U.S. Team? I didn't see any offensive game, dunks against a smallish U.S. team.

[rockymac52]

If Tony Mitchell (Missouri/North Texas) declares for the draft I think he's a no brainer early second round pick. He was declared ineligible by the NCAA because a lot of his high school classes didn't transfer, so he didn't have enough classes to be considered a high school graduate. Long, complicated story, but it sounds like it wasn't his fault, and it's not a character concern.

Coming into this season Scout had him ranked 8th overall and the 2nd best SF. Rivals had him as the 12th best overall and 2nd best SF. He's 6'8" 220 lbs so he definitely can play at the 4 as well, but I suppose he's a bit of a tweener.

Anyways, he's fallen completely off the radar (hence being forced to enroll at North Texas because most power conferences had rules that wouldn't let him ever be eligible to play), but coming into the season he was projected as a lotto pick either this year or next year. Earlier nbadraft.net had him going like 5th overall in 2012. He's really, really good, and he might come for cheap. Because he hasn't played in college he's obviously going to be raw and will probably take a few years to develop, but hey, we've got a few years to spare here haha.

There's a legitimate chance Mitchell might be the best player in this draft, and his pedigree alone puts him in the discussion IMO. What do we have to lose?

[theboomking]

I think I've come up with someone whose game Williams vaguely reminds me of: Glenn "Big Dog" Robinson. Not at all saying they'll have similar career arcs, but I seem to remember Robinson just beasting at Purdue as a senior, spending a lot of time on the low block and offensive boards because of his athleticism. He transitioned to more of a perimeter forward in the pros and made a couple all-star games.

Battier's another guy who was more of a "4" in college and a SF in the pros.

Edit: there are indeed some similarities. Love the production value!

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJ_sIJnn86Y[/youtube]

I actually also see some similarities with Glenn robinson. Glenn was listed at 6'7" on the ESPN site. Williams might be a little bigger and more explosive. I also expect that Williams might be a little more efficient than Robinson, since efficiency was really Williams' calling card in the NCAA. I'm starting to come around on Williams as our top pick, but still worry that he is a bit of a tweener. He wouldn't be trying to lose weight to play the 3 if he already had the ideal offensive and defensive skill sets at that spot. It's not like Williams can say, "I'm going to try to grow 3 inches to play the 4."

I know the below video was already posted, but I'm reposting it because it is awesome. At least one head at the level of the rim dunk in this clip. The between the legs and reverse dunks are also just sick.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KfE-fOB-9I&feature=fvsr[/youtube]

How much would it cost us to go from the 4th to the 2nd pick to get Williams? Would it be worth our first in 2011 and 2012?

[Hoopalotta]

I just listened to Russilo's Monday and Wednesday podcasts, he had some good nuggets:

* The lockout will have minimal impact on kids declaring. Most guys in the top of the draft can get a line of credit from their agent if need be.

* Lots of GM's are a little suspicious of Barnes. They think his stock is still high thanks to his high school hype, but his college performance so far hasn't lived up to his rep. With that the case, most scouts and GM's really think it's in his best interest to go ahead and declare right now while there's still some good vibes leftover from high school. If he waits, there's a good chance that he finds himself much lower in the next draft. That bodes well for him declaring, but maybe not so good for us if we pick him.

* Jonas sucks. He has a predictable offensive game, minimal strength, and mediocre athleticism. He is flabbergasted that DX ranks him #2.

* Kanter looks real good. Russillo really likes his basketball IQ. Said me makes great reads of the pick and knows whether to pop, roll, or slip the screen. He has some perimeter game but is also willing to mix it up down low.

* He likes Vesely a lot too. Athletic and fun to watch. Will take it to the rack against anyone. Will get pushed around a bit until he fills out, but he'll bring max effort every night. He really enjoys the game. He also says that he has a way of generating space for his jumper that it reminsicent of Dirk (though he reiterated that he is NOT saying Vesely will be the next Dirk).

* Donny Mountjoy is skinny and soft. He sucks.

* Biyombo is impressive. He liked his offense even more than his defense. Says that everyone questions his age.

Good stuff guys. I'm particularly surprised/shocked to hear he's so impressed with Biyombo's offense. And pleased to hear he likes Vesely. If we get unlucky in the lottery, we'll need options, and those 2 could be among them.

It seems like there's a law that the only Jan Vesley footage that can be uploaded is highlight dunk reels that tell you little. I have some concerns with what he did this year statistically (like, on the boards and from the line/field in particular), but it would be good to actually see him play.

Mountjoy I came to a similar conclusion on quite quickly. Look at his arms...



I guess I'll have to listen to the podcast and see what his main concern with Jonas was. I agree with the athleticism point, though I'm not worried about "minimal strength" as of yet.

[hands11]

I asked the same question early about what would a trade up look like.
We do have two firsts and a second so you would think there is something that could get done.

And Williams does seem to be all that. Star power. Explosive drunker.

vs.

Would you get more by going Anes and Harper. Morris worries me. Short arms. 6-8 or 6-9. The part of his game that was inside is going to be tougher in the NBA. Why not go for the taller kid that has a better outside game who has longer arms and can add some inside game ?

Williams and Harper
or
Anes and Harper

That would be a solid solid draft.

[Hoopalotta]

I could swear I read somewhere that Markief Morris has a much better wingspan than his brother. I believe it was respectable, though I don't know what that means for his actual standing reach.

[Ed Wood]

edit: No, I don't think so. From what I've read neither twin has an easy time touching his toes. ^^^

The strength thing is obviously true. Valanciunas does get shoved around at times, for instance in his matchup with Stanko "One Chromosome Better than Darko" Barac, but that's something that goes on with every young big man who isn't either a wunderkind athlete, in which case he doesn't know how to play basketball, or fat, in which case the guy has conditioning concerns and needs to slim down. Plus it's a way to doubletalk your way through your personal preferences, Ves "needs to fill out" and Jonas "has minimal strength". Vesely is probably further along strengh-wise than Valanciunas but he's also older and has probably been on a professional S&C program for longer.

The thing about Vesely is that most of the footage of him doing things involves either dunks or standing around and waiting for a perimeter shot. He's not that bad, based on my limited and entirely subjective observations, when he actually tries to do something offensively (honestly his physical abilities alone allow him to be more creative and aggressive than a lot of players on his team and I wonder if he doesn't deserve, based on ability, more offensive opportunities than he gets) but he doesn't very often.

Defensively I wouldn't say effort is the issue but for whatever reason both he and Valanciunas spaz out whenever they have to guard out on the perimeter and suffer for it. Ves is a better athlete, not much question there. Really I liked both guys a lot more when they were mid to late lottery picks and there was a chance that by trading back you could get one or the other and another reasonably high pick, or both. As the one guy to carry a draft I doubt early returns will be especially good, though Vesely will probably be much better out of the gate.

[dangermouse]

If we drop to 5th or below, i'd happily trade the pick for Wes Johnson.

Hmmm....how high a pick would you give up for Evan Turner?

I proposed this on the trade board, and I think I said 5th or below again. I'd probably go 4th or below, but it depends who is available. When it was proposed I got a dressing down though, apparently because Turner is only effective with the ball in his hands, and we dont need players who take the ball out of Wall's hands. I have a feeling he will become much better this year though, and start to look more like a 2nd pick, or at least a top 5 pick anyway. And we could find a way to make it work i'm sure, if anything he strengthens our bench heaps anyway.

[arterimal]

Would love to see the wiz pick one of the Morris twins, great fundamentals, crash the boards, pick and pop/roll.. little bit of tweeners but nba is full of them anyway. Our frontcourt needs some serious love.

[Inliten1]

Winning Draft:
SF Derrick Williams (not much to argue)

PF/SF Justin Harper (stretch 4, a young Rashard Lewis, needs to add muscle, has some post game, best case scenario a Danny Granger/Kevin Durant lite, worst case Robert Horry)

C/PF Keith Benson (developmental big more ready than Seraphine, at the very least a solid backup center on a cheap contract)

Each player provides the flexibility to trade guys on the current roster who don't make a leap this summer and next season.

[20MexicanosIn1Van]

Which teams pick Irving instead of D-Will if they pick first?

Sac - Williams
Cavs - ?
T'Wolves - Irving
Toronto - Irving

[theboomking]

Someone pointed out in the main forum draft thread that the Jordan Brand Classic is tonight. I have set my DVR. The roster looks beast. I posted the roster and the link to the website below.

East Team

Name Pos Hgt Wgt High School (School Location) College
Khem Birch C 6-9 210 Notre Dame Prep (Fitchburg, MA) Pittsburgh
Michael Carter-Williams SG 6-5 175 St. Andrew’s School (Providence, RI) Syracuse
Rakeem Christmas C 6-9 222 Academy of New Church (Bryn Athyn, PA) Syracuse
Mike Gbinije SF 6-6 194 Benedictine High School (Richmond, VA) Duke
Michael Gilchrist SF 6-7 210 St. Patrick High School (Elizabeth, NJ) Kentucky
P.J. Hairston SG 6-6 220 Hargrave Military Academy (Chatham, VA) North Carolina
James McAdoo PF 6-8 216 Norfolk Christian School (Norfolk, VA) North Carolina
Quincy Miller PF 6-9 210 Westchester Country Day (High Point, NC) Baylor
Austin Rivers SG 6-4 189 Winter Park High School (Winter Park, FL) Duke
Shannon Scott PG 6-2 170 Milton High School (Alpharetta, GA) Ohio State
Marquis Teague PG 6-2 175 Pike High School (Indianapolis, IN) Kentucky
West Team

Name Pos Hgt Wgt High School (School Location) College
Bradley Beal SG 6-4 177 Chaminade College Prep (St. Louis, MO) Florida
Jabari Brown SG 6-3 200 Oakland High School (Oakland, CA) Oregon
Kentavious Caldwell-Pope SG 6-4 190 Greenville High School (Greenville, GA) Georgia
Anthony Davis PF 6-10 200 Perspectives Charter School (Chicago, IL) Kentucky
Myck Kabongo PG 6-2 170 Findlay College Prep (Henderson, NV) Texas
Johnny O’Bryant PF 6-10 245 East Side High School (Cleveland, MS) LSU
Sir’Dominic Pointer SF 6-6 195 Quality Education Acad. (Winston-Salem, NC) St. John’s
Otto Porter, Jr. SF 6-9 200 Scott County Central (Sikeston, MO) Undecided
Adonis Thomas SF 6-6 210 Melrose High School (Memphis, TN) Memphis
Kyle Wiltjer PF 6-9 221 Jesuit High School (Portland, OR) Kentucky
Tony Wroten, Jr. SG 6-4 206 Garfield High School (Seattle, WA) Washington

http://www.jordanbrandclassic.com/News/ ... unced.html

[Rafael122]

Which teams pick Irving instead of D-Will if they pick first?

Sac - Williams
Cavs - ?
T'Wolves - Irving
Toronto - Irving

If we were to believe Chad Ford, all those teams would pick Irving over Williams.

[thinker07]

Chad Ford currently has 1) Min, 2) Clev, 3) Tor, 5) Utah, and maybe 6) Sac as having Irving at the top of their draft board. Cleveland and Utah both have 2 lottery picks. Few scenarios envision a different top 3 with Irving first and then Williams and Barnes in some order. This presents some interesting opportunities for the Wiz:

If any of these teams win the lottery and the Wiz come in 2nd OR 3rd - then the Wiz likely will still be able to pick Williams or Barnes.

If the Wiz WIN the lottery and either or both of Cleveland and Utah end up in the 2nd or 3rd spots the Wiz could really force one of them to give the Wiz both of their lottery picks to jump ahead of the other for Irving and still end up with either Williams or Barnes.

If EG likes Kanter about as much as Williams or Barnes then the above scenario would still work if the Wiz got the 1st pick and Cleveland/Utah ended up with the 2nd and 4th spots.

In either of the 2 above scenarios, the Wiz could end up with Williams, Barnes, or Kanter AND the 8th pick (Cleveland) or 12th pick (Utah). With that pick the Wiz could pick their preferred of the other 3 Euros, Bismark, Terrence Jones, or the better of the Morris twins. Then the Wiz would still have the 18th pick for a guy like Honeycutt, Hamilton, Singleton, Faried, Nolan Smith, etc.

I guess the absolute dream scenario would for the lottery to finish Wash, Cleve, Utah and then force Cleveland to give us their 8th pick to avoid a trade with Utah to jump over them for Irving. I think these kinds of trades are made more possible in a draft that's very weak at the top.

[kirubel94]

I really hope that harrison is smart enough to realize he'll be a top 5 pick this year and not next year, and come's out.

[miller31time]

I really hope that harrison is smart enough to realize he'll be a top 5 pick this year and not next year, and come's out.

I do like the theory that the longer he waits, the more likely the chance he declares for the draft.

And yeah, I think he'd be ideal for the Wizards (as I've said on many occasions). A great 2nd option who is also a good defender, clearly wants to get better and hasn't really grazed his full potential. Yes please.

Also, he's a legitimate small forward, not a tweener like Williams. That's not to say I don't like Williams or wouldn't take him before Barnes but there's something to be said for someone with a defined position rather than one the player has to grow into.

[tsvqt]

If I absolutely fall in love with a draft prospect, I'm normally spot on. I have fell in love with BRANDON ROY, DERRICK ROSE, and BLAKE GRIFFIN in the past. I have that same love for DERRICK WILLIAMS this year. I pray we get this guy!!
*side note*.....I would be in love with JORDAN WILLIAMS next year, if he stayed at Maryland another year!!

** "In Love" means - with their game ** No homo!!