Official Raptors 2011 NBA Draft Thread, Part 8

[Reignman]

The funny thing is that Bayless sounds like a nice balance between Knight/Walker and I think his court vision is better than both as well.

Thoughts?

Yeah, I agree with this. That's why I'd just rather stick with Bayless. Bayless doesn't seem to have any real real glaring weaknesses on either side of the floor.

- Can shoot the 3 as a spot up shooter off the ball at an acceptable %
- Good shooting %
- Good FT %
- Comfortable playing with the ball & playing off the ball
- Can get by his defender & get to the rim (Similar to Kemba)
- Draws fouls at a high rate (Similar to Kemba)
- Good turnover rate for an offensive PG
- Can stay in front of him man defensively (Similar to Knight & Kemba)
- Has good size/ strength for a PG (Similar to Knight)
- Intense competitor (Similar to Kemba & Knight)
- Hard worker (Similar to Knight)
- Vocal on the floor (Similar to Kemba)
- Already has NBA experience
- Already has some chemistry with teammates
- Already feels at home & likes the city

Bayless just needs to put the time in to figure out when to use his offensive capability to draw defenders/ set up teammates & when to use it to score. Knight & Walker have the same problem.

With his scoring capability, if he is able to eventually average approx 7 apg or more, I'd be very happy with that.

17-18ppg, approx 7 apg, & acceptable defensive capability = one of the better PG's this franchise has ever had.

Having said that, if we drop to 5th & it's clear that Kemba (or Knight) is the BPA, I have no problem with the Raptors drafting him, trading Calderon & letting him battle it out with Bayless for the starting PG position.

If Bayless can improve his play in the PnR I think those numbers are attainable for him.

[ghuytro]

I want to draft a defensive stud and not an offensive-minded, skilled big man - we already have one of those.

I think Biyombo is a superior prospect to Kanter for two reasons:

1. Biyombo's defensive potential and resulting impact for the team and it's future is far greater than Kanter's offensive potential and impact. We've seen what an offensive minded team with no real defensive presence looks like - it aint pretty. Why repeat that model?

2. Biyombo's offensive potential is greater than Kanter's defensive potential. I believe that from the beginning, Biyombo will be a potent scorer in transition, on the pick and roll, drive and dishes and on put backs. His post game is raw, but he's not clumsy either. He has room to grow. Kanter, defensively, is a below the rim player with decent size, but certainly not with game changing defensive impact potential - which is what this team needs. Anything the team can get from Biyombo offensively - especially if paired with Bargnani and Demar - is gravy. But the team needs defense from the center position - defense is not "gravy" for this team - it's absolutely essential.

I believe that there is a similar amount of question marks surrounding each player so I don't see those as being a deciding factor for one player over the other.

[TDotRep]

It's funny because you have no idea how kanters d is going to translate, and how biyombos offence is going to translate. Go watch his post game hoop summit interview, not the one on the podium but the one where he is talking to a reporter.

[dagger]

If you want to assess Valanciunas for yourself, the Lithuanian league best of seven final is on now. Here's a legal stream. JV plays for Rytas, Rytas faces arch-rival Zalgiris. Both are Euroleague teams.

http://www.lrytas.lt/videonews/live/

[Reignman]

I want to draft a defensive stud and not an offensive-minded, skilled big man - we already have one of those.

I think Biyombo is a superior prospect to Kanter for two reasons:

1. Biyombo's defensive potential and resulting impact for the team and it's future is far greater Kanter's offensive potential and impact. We've seen what a few years what an offensive minded team with no real defensive presence looks like. Why repeat that model?

2. Biyombo's offensive potential is greater than Kanter's defensive potential. I believe that from the beginning, Biyombo will be a potent scorer in transition, on the pick and roll, drive and dishes and on put backs. His post game is raw, but he's not clumsy either. He has room to grow. Kanter, defensively, is a below the rim player with decent size, but certainly not with game changing defensive impact potential - which is what this team needs. Anything the team can get from Biyombo offensively - especially if paired with Bargnani and Demar - is gravy. But the team needs defense from the center position - defense is not "gravy" for this team - it's absolutely essential.

I believe that there is a similar amount of question marks surrounding each player so I don't see those as being a deciding factor for one player over the other.

I think defensive IQ is the most important factor for an NBA C to have success and right now nobody seems to be really able to qualify that. I still have Kanter as my top big because of his two way potential, if his defensive IQ is anywhere near his offensive IQ (rare to see a 18/19 year old with his vast array of moves in the post all the way out to the 3) then he's going to be a special player.

With Biyombo I just find too much duplication with Davis/Amir and he's a liability offensively at this point. Also, considering he hasn't played ball for all that long I'm pretty sure his IQ on either end won't be off the charts.

Anyway, all of this is just us projecting off our personal biases. I know Kanter probably looks a lot better to me than for those who want BIyombo and vice versa.

[Lionel Messi]

If you want to assess Valanciunas for yourself, the Lithuanian league best of seven final is on now. Here's a legal stream. JV plays for Rytas, Rytas faces arch-rival Zalgiris. Both are Euroleague teams.

http://www.lrytas.lt/videonews/live/

Thanks. Will do.

He's gotten about 3 stops inside (one being a block) but they've also been scored on 4 times in the paint from when I started watching, a couple of them being 2nd chance points on him after he made the initial stop. He definitely needs to add weight.

[TDotRep]

val with some bargnani type defense right there.

[dagger]

val with some bargnani type defense right there.

He has a block already and has altered shots. He needs to add strength, but so does Ed Davis. Val is three years younger than Ed so you would think it's possible.

[TDotRep]

didn't see the block when i turned it on he was pushed out of the way for a lay-up.

[Lionel Messi]

He lacks size and physicality down low but he is very active at least. Nothing like Bargs in terms of effort level.
He even bends his knees and gets real low on perimeter D.

He just forced an offensive 3 seconds violation by fronting his man really really well.

[TDotRep]

i'll tell you one thing, I like their commercials.

[bboyskinnylegs]

Seems like ever year imo. But yeah It's good to see that Colangelo and the staff are overseas scouting. I do hope they get that second pick. I also hope its "NOT" in the second round. I'm not sure how many good second round talents are out there.

Let say Raps got another pick in the late lotto/second round. Who would you guys like to see on the roster?

With a late pick, I wouldn't mind taking any of Nogueira, Jeremy Tyler, Reggie Jackson, Selby, or CoJo if they're available. All of them are young, high upside guys with solid athleticism and talent. Those first three have great length as well.

[Lionel Messi]

The truth is that I'm having a hard time imagining NBA players NOT scoring on him. He's forcing misses against these guys, but they're missing a bunch of shots that NBA players have a habit of hitting.

He's definitely a long term project if we get him.

[ghuytro]

It's funny because you have no idea how kanters d is going to translate, and how biyombos offence is going to translate. Go watch his post game hoop summit interview, not the one on the podium but the one where he is talking to a reporter.

It's exactly as Reignman said above - we're all simply projecting our own personal biases or opinions.

I don't know for a fact whether what the factors that are informing my decision will come to fruition or not. They are simply the facts that given the limited information I have, I believe to be true and based on these factors, the calculus I am using that make me prefer Biyombo over Kanter.

I could be completely wrong of course

[TDotRep]

does the euro league have 3 in the key

[bboyskinnylegs]

does the euro league have 3 in the key

no

EDIT: wait do you mean on offense or defense? You can't camp out on offense, but defenders can stay in the lane.

[fredericklove]

If we do take Kanter it will be nice knowing we have our center position locked up for years (hopefully).

And get Kabongo in '12 draft and we'll be set on every position except SF.

I don't get all the hype about Kabongo. He didn't seem that good too me. Same with Austin Rivers. Overrated imo.

he's fast, quick, has good court vision, though he needs to be a better finisher, needs to play under control and limits his turnovers. Offensively he's still raw but he has some pretty good talent. Let's hope he can polish his game in college coz he seems like a pretty good prospect to me. River on the other hand is overrated for sure.

[Reignman]

TBH, if we can get a C or PG out of this draft I'd look to 2012 for a SF, that draft seems to have quite a few prospects at that position.

[bboyskinnylegs]

TBH, if we can get a C or PG out of this draft I'd look to 2012 for a SF, that draft seems to have quite a few prospects at that position.

yep... Gilchrist, Q.Miller, Barnes, and Perry Jones are solid talents at SF, with the potential to be guys you can build around. LeBryan Nash and Adonis Thomas are interesting SF prospects as well.

[God Squad]

Seems like ever year imo. But yeah It's good to see that Colangelo and the staff are overseas scouting. I do hope they get that second pick. I also hope its "NOT" in the second round. I'm not sure how many good second round talents are out there.

Let say Raps got another pick in the late lotto/second round. Who would you guys like to see on the roster?

With a late pick, I wouldn't mind taking any of Nogueira, Jeremy Tyler, Reggie Jackson, Selby, or CoJo if they're available. All of them are young, high upside guys with solid athleticism and talent. Those first three have great length as well.

I'd love to get Reggie Jackson if say we drafted Kanter/Biyombo. I'd take a chance on Selby. Although I haven't been impressed. Nogueria is a solid prospect. He needs a lot of work though.