Atlanta Hawks: Tough changes need to be made

[LakerEric]

You trying to tell me If we would trade Horford and Marvin for Paul Gasol then picked up Tayshaun Prince, Yi Jianlian and chuck hayes via Free agency, you don't think we would be a better team?

Teague/ Kirk
JJ/ JC or Kirk
Smoove/ Prince
Hayes/ Yi Jianlian
Gasol/ ZaZa

Yi would be to sell tickets to the asian community in atlanta.

I don't even need to answer on the fact that this team is better or not, because what I was really trying to tell you is that you won't be able to get this team in ATL.

Horford will make 12M and Marvin 8M. Gasol will make 18.7M, so 1.3M less.
It would put us at more than 65M for next year, and it's only with Teague, Hinrich, Joe, Josh, Pau, Zaza, Sy and Rolle.
With a Tax threshold certainly around 70M, you can't even spend your full MLE before being over the threshold, and you have 5 guys to add to get a 13 players roster.

Good luck to you to sign Prince, Yi, Hayes, and other players to fill the roster, for less than 5M.
And don't count on ASG to start to pay Taxes for this roster.

Don't get me wrong, I am certainly not opposed to a trade of Horford for Gasol, I could be OK for that, but like I said, with this trade, you won't end up with the team you hoped, and in the end, I don't think you would have a better team.

What about Smith and Hinrich for Gasol and Blake? As a Laker fan, I can see this deal going down without Horford. But the Lakers will probably want Hinrich coming back, especially with Teague's emergence. Blake is a quality backup PG who can spell Teague.

[D21]

well lets see if we trade horford and marvin for pau and a 2nd this year and a 1st in 2013.with JJ, Teague, Smith, ZaZa, Pau,and kirk that is 63.4M. I am sure you can bring wilkins, rolle, sy, and the two 2011 2nd round picks for around 1M. that puts the payroll at lets just say 65M with 11 players. that leave 5M to sign two more guys but I would put one or both of the 2nd round guys in the D-league and get 3 more guys. Hayes 2M Prince 1M and tmac 1M Yi 1M

Maybe you should not be sure of that.
I don't know how you can have the 5 players for 1.5M, there is rules of minimum salaries that will make it impossible.

Then, said the values in the CBA are kept, the veteran minimum would cost $884,293 regarding Tax purpose. It allows you to sign 5 players with 5M, but guys like Prince will get easily more than the veteran minimum.

[betta1]

What about something along the lines of:

To LAL:
Marvin
Kirk

To ATL:
Lamar Kardashian
Luke Walton
2011 2nd rounder

Teague
JJ
Smoove
Lamar
Horford

Better, no?

[NeZoRiL]

What about something along the lines of:

To LAL:
Marvin
Kirk

To ATL:
Lamar Kardashian
Luke Walton
2011 2nd rounder

Teague
JJ
Smoove
Lamar
Horford
Better, no?

What does this trade do for us, really? We're better, I agree, but Lamar Odom is aging and Luke Walton is dead. Putting Josh at the small forward position is tempting, and allowing Teague to start is tempting too, but I'm in the middle of the road on this one. And heck, maybe Odom is better off the bench? Until this year, he's been pretty unpredictable. I'm not sure how he'd like Atlanta either, since he's got his own show.

[old rem]

The stupid thing is that we are talking about trading Josh or Al, but a team wanting to make the NBA Finals should need both AND a good big, but I am afraid that trading one of them for a big, even if the big is good, will never make us reaching the Finals, because even if they did not make good playoffs this year, they are both under good congtracts regarding their values and ages.

Joe even at his level of first round, will never deserves the salary he got, but it doesn't mean we should trade the two guys with good contracts. Now I hope it the last time that Al will make a ugly series like that, and that Josh continue to play smarter in playoffs like he did this series.

I would be open to trade them, but we won't be very better than now.
The improvement could come from trading expiring or nearly expiring for longer contract, or a big expiring that if has some value could be re-signed later for less money, use our MLE,... but it costs a lot.

You trying to tell me If we would trade Horford and Marvin for Paul Gasol then picked up Tayshaun Prince, Yi Jianlian and chuck hayes via Free agency, you don't think we would be a better team?

Teague/ Kirk
JJ/ JC or Kirk
Smoove/ Prince
Hayes/ Yi Jianlian
Gasol/ ZaZa

Yi would be to sell tickets to the asian community in atlanta.

Uh...you figure to take on Pau at $19 mill and then split an MLE between 3 guys who probably EACH want over $3 mill?? Good luck.

New CBA? Ring a bell? Owners wanted a hard cap at $45 mill......Pau,JJ and Hinrich put you beyond that.

[Ruhiel]

Bogut/ Sanders / Smith (still has trade value maybe granger)
Pachulia/ Gooden / Collins?? can we get Erden for a 2nd rounder, Pape Sy and cash?

Teague/Joe Johnson/
John Salmons/pg-sg/sg-sf Al Thornton

Depth:

Teague/Salmons/Johnson
Johnson/Thornton/Salmons
Smith/Johnson/Thornton
Sanders/Gooden/Smith
Bogut/Pachulia/Sanders-Gooden

Crawford is gone and Teague must be developed in time for next playoffs. This summer and next season is crucial.

Seeing as how there is likely a lockout next season, ATL can win in the playoffs and have fresh bigs. Or they can play small and get beat down on the boards in the playoffs next season.

The days of us thinking we can overload the wings with shooters are gone. We will never be as talented as New York (swept), Miami (blow out loss going small, -19 off boards).

If Chicago is not setting a blueprint in the East. I don't know who is. Horford is not a DPOY candidate or post scorer with elite length like Dwight. He's a bootleg Amare.
Trade him, Marvin, and Hinrich for Bogut, Salmons, Sanders, and Gooden. Gives the roster size and balance to compete with Chicago.
If Smith doesn't work out at the 3 or comes in at 245 again (ideal at 230) trade him for Granger or Iguodala.

Tough changes are realizing All NBA 3rd Team and 2 time backup All Star is a dud, you overpaid Marvin Williams and JJ, and Joe Johnson needs defensive help and a point guard (Teague) to create for him.

Heck after we get Bogut/Sanders we could trade Smith and Teague for Chris Paul if you really want a superstar.

Ball is in your court Atlanta.

[myrak433]

The stupid thing is that we are talking about trading Josh or Al, but a team wanting to make the NBA Finals should need both AND a good big, but I am afraid that trading one of them for a big, even if the big is good, will never make us reaching the Finals, because even if they did not make good playoffs this year, they are both under good congtracts regarding their values and ages.

Joe even at his level of first round, will never deserves the salary he got, but it doesn't mean we should trade the two guys with good contracts. Now I hope it the last time that Al will make a ugly series like that, and that Josh continue to play smarter in playoffs like he did this series.

I would be open to trade them, but we won't be very better than now.
The improvement could come from trading expiring or nearly expiring for longer contract, or a big expiring that if has some value could be re-signed later for less money, use our MLE,... but it costs a lot.

You trying to tell me If we would trade Horford and Marvin for Paul Gasol then picked up Tayshaun Prince, Yi Jianlian and chuck hayes via Free agency, you don't think we would be a better team?

Teague/ Kirk
JJ/ JC or Kirk
Smoove/ Prince
Hayes/ Yi Jianlian
Gasol/ ZaZa

Yi would be to sell tickets to the asian community in atlanta.

Uh...you figure to take on Pau at $19 mill and then split an MLE between 3 guys who probably EACH want over $3 mill?? Good luck.

New CBA? Ring a bell? Owners wanted a hard cap at $45 mill......Pau,JJ and Hinrich put you beyond that.

that is want the owners may want but it will not happen. every team would be in trouble then.

[Geaux_Hawks]

Hey, if you added Jordan Hill in that Thabeet trade, then that's an even bigger win for Atlanta if they can bring in Mutumbo to hone Thabeet into a defensive force he should be.

[Ruhiel]

What about something along the lines of:

To LAL:
Marvin
Kirk

To ATL:
Lamar Kardashian
Luke Walton
2011 2nd rounder

Teague
JJ
Smoove
Lamar
Horford
Better, no?

What does this trade do for us, really? We're better, I agree, but Lamar Odom is aging and Luke Walton is dead. Putting Josh at the small forward position is tempting, and allowing Teague to start is tempting too, but I'm in the middle of the road on this one. And heck, maybe Odom is better off the bench? Until this year, he's been pretty unpredictable. I'm not sure how he'd like Atlanta either, since he's got his own show.

I like this trade but Odom is aging. Lamar is not an impact player but is a upgrade over Marvin, but for how long? Also still no center.

I firmly believe the Milwaukee trade with Sanders and Bogut is best. Sanders has upside while Odom has downside. Would be an excellent backup. I doubt we could flip Horford and Walton for Bogut and Sanders, unless the Bucks draft a PF and like him more than LS.

maybe they get Kanter and want to unload Sanders.