Jeremy Tyler Should Be Drafted In The Lottery

[Dr Positivity]

Player who needs massive work to be an NBA Player + Player with character issues making massive work unlikely = bad combination!

[vincecarter4pres]

Do you think he goes higher than 18-year old Nogueira (who has even better length and defensive potential, although he's a skinny kid)?

I'll take the 262 pound 19 year old kid from Cali over the 218 pound one from Brazil all day in this scenario. When I look at the basketball hall of fame and NBA All Star games I don't see too many Brazilian big men there.

This maybe one of the stupidest things I've read on this board since KWSN-Men posted here.

[Elden Payton]

Lock Please??

Terrible terrible thread.

[JustMagic]

I like that he was coached by a former NBA head coach in Japan like Brian Hill that once coached Shaq.
I'm looking at his statistics in the Japanese pro league and they don't look bad for a 19 year old who competed against men. He played 15.4 mpg while averaging 9.9 ppg and 6.4 rpg. His free throw shooting was horrendous at 45.4% but he went to the free throw line 108 times in only 507 minutes. For comparison Nikola Mirotic went to the free throw line 84 times in 793 minutes
Donatas Motiejunas 225 times in 1290 minutes,
Jonas Valanciunas 158 times in 1142 minutes,
So as a 19 year old he shot more free throws per minute than all of the international big men in the draft that played last season.

Are you his agent or something??
I've seen Tyler in Israel and he was indeed physically gifted and ready for the pros, but just not talented enough, not willing to learn and work hard, both practice and during games.

Japanese league is horrendous. It's comparable with 2nd devision college basketball.
Same Jai Lewis who some wrote is one of the MVP's there, could barely play in the Israeli 2nd devision and I doubt he got in much much better shape when he got to Japan after he was cut here.

A team that will draft him in the 1st round is just stupid.

Worst case scenario, he becomes JaVale-like. Best case scenario, Bynum? Anyone agree?

JaVale as worst case scenario?? Mcgee is longer, more athletic and waaaay more talanted. Also, JaVale might not have the highest basketball IQ, but I don't recall hearing about him being lazy. I mean, a jumpshot and ball-handling skills like his is not something you're born with.

[Point-God]

The point is not how these guys become good

That is the point.


I don't give a damn about a 17-18 year old American prospect fizzling out in Israel, just like it didn't bother me when Brandon Jennings didn't get much playing time. It matters to me more that at 19 years of age Tyler received coaching by former NBA head coach Brian Hill who coached Shaq and that Tyler has displayed evidence of being a more emotionally mature person. That brings me back to my point about how these guys become good, he was raised playing basketball on American soil so he is acquainted with physical play, additionally he didn't waste years competing against fellow teenagers. Tyler was 17-18 getting paid to compete against men outside of his home country. That's more close to NBA life than playing for free in college against teenagers. Lucas Bebe didn't receive coaching from a former NBA head coach who coached the most dominant big man of my time. Lucas Bebe didn't grow up playing basketball on American soil, the place that still produces the best players on Earth. Lucas Bebe didn't spend his time playing in leagues (and practicing against) mostly populated by fully mature men.

Yes he did. Just FYI Jeremy Tyler's agency tried to get him a contract for the league Lucas Nogueira is playing in but no club was interested.

Post links to support both of your statements of Lucas Bebe spending his time competing against mature men and Tyler seeking a contract with that same team.

For people who don't want to wait you can click the following link to see who Lucas' teammates where in the EBA league. That's right EBA, not ACB, Eurocup or Euroleague. Lucas played in a league that's far below the NCAA.
http://www.clubestudiantes.com/frontend ... eccion=288


Look at Bebe's 2010 competition
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQBMrVwzRC8[/youtube]
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTk0TniBMe0[/youtube]

[Ruzious]

Do you think he goes higher than 18-year old Nogueira (who has even better length and defensive potential, although he's a skinny kid)?

I'll take the 262 pound 19 year old kid from Cali over the 218 pound one from Brazil all day in this scenario. When I look at the basketball hall of fame and NBA All Star games I don't see too many Brazilian big men there.

This maybe one of the stupidest things I've read on this board since KWSN-Men posted here.

+1 to his last sentence. That kind of logic is irritatingly stupid.

[droponov]

That is the point.


I don't give a damn about a 17-18 year old American prospect fizzling out in Israel, just like it didn't bother me when Brandon Jennings didn't get much playing time. It matters to me more that at 19 years of age Tyler received coaching by former NBA head coach Brian Hill who coached Shaq and that Tyler has displayed evidence of being a more emotionally mature person. That brings me back to my point about how these guys become good, he was raised playing basketball on American soil so he is acquainted with physical play, additionally he didn't waste years competing against fellow teenagers. Tyler was 17-18 getting paid to compete against men outside of his home country. That's more close to NBA life than playing for free in college against teenagers. Lucas Bebe didn't receive coaching from a former NBA head coach who coached the most dominant big man of my time. Lucas Bebe didn't grow up playing basketball on American soil, the place that still produces the best players on Earth. Lucas Bebe didn't spend his time playing in leagues (and practicing against) mostly populated by fully mature men.

Yes he did. Just FYI Jeremy Tyler's agency tried to get him a contract for the league Lucas Nogueira is playing in but no club was interested.

Post links to support both of your statements of Lucas Bebe spending his time competing against mature men and Tyler seeking a contract with that same team.

For people who don't want to wait you can click the following link to see who Lucas' teammates where in the EBA league. That's right EBA, not ACB, Eurocup or Euroleague. Lucas played in a league that's far below the NCAA.
http://www.clubestudiantes.com/frontend ... eccion=288


Look at Bebe's 2010 competition

The EBA is a professional league where mature men compete. It's not below the NCAA and it's on a similar level to the JBL. If you consider the top teams in both competitions, I'd say the EBA easily offers a higher level of competition. More than 80 teams compete in EBA and there's a large disparity between the best and worst ones.

My take on the level of competition Nogueira faced:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1075224#p27503007

I went from being acused of underrating the level of competition on EBA to overrating it in a month. Yet, I'm fairly sure I know the EBA better than anyone here and by a large distance. Why do people need to be so radical? About issues they don't even know anything about?

[droponov]

Player who needs massive work to be an NBA Player + Player with character issues making massive work unlikely = bad combination!

I tend to agree. On the other hand, Nogueira was a 18 years old living on a completely different country for the first time in his life and playing professional basketball. Even though I wouldn't discard the passiveness he showed, it's a very different situation from, say, a college senior who displays the same traits. Higher probability of change.

[Ca]

Point God just stop. You're saying just because he's an American citizen he'll be good. That's awful, awful logic.

Plus, he left America when he was 17 and by all accounts was just a big body with no skills or BBIQ. So judging by your logic, he spent his last two years trying to form skills NOT AT ALL ON AMERICAN SOIL. FURTHERMORE, one example of him NOT gaining any skills is that atrocious free throw percentage. He is a surefire bust if he can't get his head together.

[Point-God]

FURTHERMORE, one example of him NOT gaining any skills is that atrocious free throw percentage.

That's part of the flawed reasoning behind Deandre Jordan falling to the 2nd round because people correlated his poor college free throw shooting to him not being able able to produce on the NBA level. Look at him today, he's still a poor free throw shooter but he's a 3rd year player with complete bird rights that stands to receive a huge payday in free agency this summer.

Clearly Jeremy Tyler's American style of basketball is what allowed him to draw so many fouls sending him to the free throw line. He averaged 10ppg in 15mpg against physically mature professional basketball players, some of which having logged NBA minutes.

BTW I don't see a single person in the NCAA during the 2010-11 season who averaged anything close to 10ppg in 15mpg.

[LithuanianOne]

FURTHERMORE, one example of him NOT gaining any skills is that atrocious free throw percentage.

That's part of the flawed reasoning behind Deandre Jordan falling to the 2nd round because people correlated his poor college free throw shooting to him not being able able to produce on the NBA level. Look at him today, he's still a poor free throw shooter but he's a 3rd year player with complete bird rights that stands to receive a huge payday in free agency this summer.

Clearly Jeremy Tyler's American style of basketball is what allowed him to draw so many fouls sending him to the free throw line. He averaged 10ppg in 15mpg against physically mature professional basketball players, some of which having logged NBA minutes.

BTW I don't see a single person in the NCAA during the 2010-11 season who averaged anything close to 10ppg in 15mpg.

Look we are talking about some league in Japan... JAPAN... FFS. I'm pretty sure any other prospect would light it up there aswell.

[Ca]

Your logic is bananas.

You claimed, You'd rather have an American Player than a Brazilian.

Someone retorted, Well, Nene is clearly better than Drew Gooden, an American picked before a Brazilian.
You said, "Well, I'd rather have Amare than both"
So what? That doesn't negate the fact that Nene, a Brazilian born big man is significantly better than Drew Gooden, an American.

Moving on,

In retort to Jeremy Tyler, a 17 year old at the time of his export, being immature and unskilled,
you replied "WELL EVERYONE SAID DEANDRE JORDAN WAS UNSKILLED"

Fair enough, they might have, but DeAndre Jordan didn't get cut from his pro team.
He picked up skills in the NBA,
And we can speculate, but not definitely presume, he was humbled by his draft fall and WORKED his way to where he is. By all accounts Jeremy Tyler is not a hard worker.

But the facts are thus: DeAndre Jordan DID fall, and it took him 3 years to establish himself as an NBA Player.

If you're willing to wait 3 years on a total gamble then by all means advocate throwing guaranteed money at a Junior Headcase.

Lastly, unless he came out of the womb 6'11'' he only had at most 2 years of American basketball experience, unless you're going to say he was taught how to play gritty in elementary school, the same as the amount of years he was in a FOREIGN COUNTRY learning to play ball. The same foreign countries, you say produce bad big men.

[Point-God]

If you're willing to wait 3 years on a total gamble

Jeremy Tyler is a 19 soon to be 20 year old basketball player. If a team drafts him outside of the lottery and aren't willing to wait 3 years on him reaching Deandre Jordan's current level then they are complete morons.

Where does this line of thinking come from that has me drafting Drew Gooden over Amare? I would have drafted Amare over both Drew Gooden and Nene. I would have selected Tough Juice over Nene as well. Not only would I draft Jeremy Tyler over Bebe but there are some American perimeter players that I would draft over Bebe (Klay Thompson), just like I would have drafted Caron Butler over Nene in that draft.

Missing on drafting Nene is no franchise altering move. He's no superstar, all star, never made an all NBA team and certainly isn't headed for the hall of fame. He's a guy that averages 6.9 rebounds over his career. The only person that loses sleep at night regarding drafting Nene is the moron that selected him over Amare.

[Cammo101]

You keep bringing up DeAndre Jordan, but Jordan was a much better athlete in a much better draft. I do not see them as comparable prospects.

[theboomking]

You keep bringing up DeAndre Jordan, but Jordan was a much better athlete in a much better draft. I do not see them as comparable prospects.

I don't think Jordan was a better athlete. Certainly, Tyler is more vertically explosive. Lets look at the numbers once they are posted.

The problem with Tyler is that he is a player that seems to be less than the sum of his parts. He should be dominant, but he is mediocre. In Japan. Tyler is the classic Ernie Grunfeld pick. All physical ability, little basketball IQ between the ears and possibly a head case. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Wizards pick him.

[Rockice_8]

it's bob hill who has been coaching him...not brian hill

There goes half your argument. I love when people get owned. Not that it was a good argument to begin with.

I'm actually interested in Tyler, in the 2nd round though. I wouldn't mind my team buying up a middle of the pack 2nd and taking a fly on him.

[Cammo101]

it's bob hill who has been coaching him...not brian hill

There goes half your argument. I love when people get owned. Not that it was a good argument to begin with.

I'm actually interested in Tyler, in the 2nd round though. I wouldn't mind my team buying up a middle of the pack 2nd and taking a fly on him.

Any team should be interested in Tyler in the second round. He has a lot of upside at that point. The concern is giving him a bunch of guaranteed money.

[Elden Payton]

Obvious troll is obvious.

[WizarDynasty]

You call Jeremy Tyler a classic Grunfeld case yet his last pick of mcGee is now turning out to be the best bigman in his draft class?
Clearly Tyler was immature and was regarded as the number one player in the nation and how all of the top basketball school stalking him so they can win their next championship and rake in hundred of million of revenue of free labor.
He goes to Israel expecting to get experience and does't even get to play. The number one highschool player in the best land country of basketball can't even get minutes in a israel league that hasn't produced any nba stars. Something doesn't hold up. He goes to japanese league and after two weeks is getting more minutes than he did in Israel.
Grunfeld took a blatche with the 46 pick and blatche average a double double. HE got shot and picked up a few prostitutes and has low stamina but he clearly has shown that he belongs in the nba.
Tyler needs a young superstar point guard to get him the ball and we have that with John Wall.
Tyler showed in his limited minutes in the Japanese league why he is wonderful fit running with wall and why he is a better overall player and shot blocker than Biyombo and having a point guard like John Wall feed him the post will make all of you question how you could not see that Tyler was rated the number overall basketball prospect in the most powerful basketball country in the world for a reason. He is in the perfect position to be snatched up just as LA snatched up Bynum and now LA won't even trade injured Bynum for your favorite player.
Wizards look forward to watching Tyler transform into one of the most dominant post players of his generation. The wizards have alot of experience developing young bigman talent and the structure for tyler is there making the wizards an ideal place after Enes and Tyler there is a huge drop off in bigman talent.
If cousin was worthy of lottery selection, I don't see how Tyler doesn't deserve to be selected at an even higher slot than D. Cousins. Tyler is a top 8 pick for sure and I would love to see what player past number 6 is better than him skill wise.

[Kirsten19]

Tyler is never a better shotblocker than Biyombo.

Biyombo is one of the most athletic players I've ever seen, super long arms and he's already a leading shotblocker in the 2nd best Basketball league in the planet.

Biyombo is Dwight Howard 2.0