Official Andre Iguodala Trade Discussion and Rumors Thread

76ciology · Post #1641 » by **76ciology** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 3:57 am

Kobblehead wrote:
Sixerscan wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:The person asking the question was an Iguodala supporter. LOL

Yea, I was talking about the people that turned it into being purely about scoring (I.E. You)

"Iguodala supporter"--- ooh more terms for the glossary.

Uggggh no. Go back and read, kid. I jumped into the conversation like 8 posts in. It was clearly 76ology who was talking about scoring.

Kobblehead · Post #1642 » by **Kobblehead** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:00 am

76ciology wrote:Anyway, to answer the mystery..

Iguodala should probably be the 4th or 5th best player in the Mavs. Behind Dirk (no doubt), Kidd (still one of the best PG), Butler (better scorer and good defensive player) and Marion (better scorer, rebounder and good defensive player). If I'm the Mavs, I would value Iggy the same with Terry and Chandler.

Iggy should probably, play off the bench next to either Marion or Caron Butler.

Just my opinion.

Agreed. Anyone that thinks that Iguodala can start at the 2 next to Butler and do anything besides coast on offense is kidding themselves.

Sixerlover · Post #1643 » by **Sixerlover** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:06 am

Before I jump 100% into the Iguodala vs CARON BUTLER argument, you guys do realize that throughout both of their careers Iguodala has been the better shooter from the field (including 3pt%) right? So Iguodala is a better SHOOTER (the main part of his offensive game that his constantly criticized) than Butler. That's ignoring other aspects of offense, and defense alike. Should I go on, or did you guys not know that Caron Butler is a bad shooter?

Post #1644 » by **tk76** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:07 am

This year's Marion and Butler are not close to Iguodala, nor have they been for the past 2 years.

sixerswillrule · Post #1645 » by **sixerswillrule** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:12 am

tk76 wrote:This year's Marion and Butler are not close to Iguodala, nor have they been for the past 2 years.

Yep. Iguodala would be the 2nd best overall player on the Mavs.

BringBackKorver · Post #1646 » by **BringBackKorver** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:16 am

Kobblehead wrote:Agreed. Anyone that thinks that Iguodala can start at the 2 next to Butler and do anything besides coast on offense is kidding themselves.

Or he could just start at the 3 over Butler since he's better...

sixerswillrule · Post #1647 » by **sixerswillrule** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:19 am

Kobblehead wrote:
76ciology wrote:Anyway, to answer the mystery..

Iguodala should probably be the 4th or 5th best player in the Mavs. Behind Dirk (no doubt), Kidd (still one of the best PG), Butler (better scorer and good defensive player) and Marion (better scorer, rebounder and good defensive player). If I'm the Mavs, I would value Iggy the same with Terry and Chandler.

Iggy should probably, play off the bench next to either Marion or Caron Butler.

Just my opinion.

Agreed. Anyone that thinks that Iguodala can start at the 2 next to Butler and do anything besides coast on offense is kidding themselves.

Yeah, Iguodala wouldn't make much sense with Butler on the team. But he's been hurt, so we're just seeing how Dallas is now without him. He's also a free agent so he may not be back with them, who knows. But he's still a better player than Butler. And Marion. And Kidd. And Terry. He'd be their 2nd best player and #3 option behind Terry.

Kobblehead · Post #1648 » by **Kobblehead** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:20 am

BringBackKorver wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:Agreed. Anyone that thinks that Iguodala can start at the 2 next to Butler and do anything besides coast on offense is kidding themselves.

Or he could just start at the 3 over Butler since he's better...

starting 3 players devoid of scoring like Kidd, Stevenson, and Iguodala and this conversation is moot because Dallas wouldn't even be a championship caliber team.

SJSF · Post #1649 » by **SJSF** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:31 am

DIrk, KIdd, Terry, and Marion > Iggy

Chandler on defense is as important as Iggy on defense.

Sixerlover · Post #1650 » by **Sixerlover** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:32 am

Kobblehead wrote:
BringBackKorver wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:Agreed. Anyone that thinks that Iguodala can start at the 2 next to Butler and do anything besides coast on offense is kidding themselves.

Or he could just start at the 3 over Butler since he's better...

starting 3 players devoid of scoring like Kidd, Stevenson, and Iguodala and this conversation is moot because Dallas wouldn't even be a championship caliber team.

Mind = Blown. Did they not just get to the championship and play half the season with Shawn Marion at the 3? Iguodala > Butler > Marion.

SJSF · Post #1651 » by **SJSF** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:34 am

Sixerscan wrote:He wasn't the number 1 shooting option

He took the 5th most FGAs
He took the 3rd most FGA per Game
He took the 7th most FGs per minute
He had the sixth highest usage rate

I think you are confusing "number 1 option" with "best player."

Brand > Iggy Brand was MVP of the team. Iggy is not the best player, get real. Iggy is one dimensional. Brand is two dimensional.

Kobblehead · Post #1652 » by **Kobblehead** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:39 am

Sixerlover wrote: Iguodala > Butler > Marion.

What are we talking about? Overall at this stage of their careers? Butler is still a MUCH better scorer than Iguodala and Marion possess better scoring instincts than Iguodala does in his dreams. But you're right, Iguodala > 33 year old Marion and a 31 year old gimpy Butler. :-?

SJSF · Post #1653 » by **SJSF** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:45 am

Marion went 20 and 7 tonight against LeBron tonight. Not bad. But Marion stinks.

Sixerlover · Post #1654 » by **Sixerlover** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:48 am

Kobblehead wrote:
Sixerlover wrote: Iguodala > Butler > Marion.

What are we talking about? Overall at this stage of their careers? Butler is still a MUCH better scorer than Iguodala and Marion possess better scoring instincts than Iguodala does in his dreams. But you're right, Iguodala > 33 year old Marion and a 31 year old gimpy Butler.

What do you mean what are we talking about. Which of them is the best overall basketball player lol.

Good points though, I didn't realize that Butler is a MUCH better scorer than Iguodala (we both know you have no factual proof of that, the facts actually support the other side, but that's not importnat :wink:

) AND Marion has simply astonishing "scoring instincts", and completely trumps Iguodala in the "scoring instincts" category of basketball.

Man, that Iguodala guy sucks. I don't even know why I'm defending him.

phillybird · Post #1655 » by **phillybird** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:58 am

Does it really matter where Iguodala ranks on the Mavs? It's not like there's any realistic way he's gonna be on their team.

PhillyFan · Post #1656 » by **PhillyFan** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 5:34 am

LOL, Caron Butler?

What's next? Stevenson is the next Lebron?

and I don't mind Iguodala going onto another team, just so that he can get to win something while we keep going into the eternal hell of "rebuilding" through the draft and strive for greatness!

76ciology · Post #1657 » by **76ciology** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 6:50 am

I notice the word "overall" is always used when Iggy is compared to a certain player. Surely, Iggy will win most of the time since it's no question that he's one of the most versatile players in the league. For example, who's the better player between Amare, Carmelo Anthony, Rudy Gay, Steve Nash, or a prime Allen Iverson? Iggy will win most of the time when compared to a non-versatile, more superior scorer/defender, because he's more versatile than any of those all-stars/superstars/hall of famers. It's like asking which is better overall between a swiss knife and a samurai used by an ancient Ninja. LOL

I know it's not fair but most teams would prefer a scorer(samurai), who an create his own shot than a facilitator(swiss knife) on offense. Specially at the SF position. If you are a facilitator at the wing, most of the time it's because you have deficiencies(lack of size like a swiss knife) on offense. (see Kirilenko).

There's a reason why most of the time all-stars, superstars and hall of famers are scorers and not facilitators. And why guys who are called role players are guys who have deficiency with their offense. Again, it's just the way it goes. So, don't be mad and blame me for that.
(*raises white flag)

With this said, most teams (like the Mavs)would prefer a 15-17ppg scorer like Butler. And defensively, Butler is also a pretty good defensive player. And "Overall", Marion did a better job against Durant and LeBron. Marion was able to score 15-20 points efficiently with really good defense against the top two players in the entire league (eyesight).

And again, we all have our own standards and opinions. Maybe some people's standards are lower than the others. And we should respect each other for that.

P2K · Post #1658 » by **P2K** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:59 pm

PhillyFan wrote:LOL, Caron Butler?

What's next? Stevenson is the next Lebron?

and I don't mind Iguodala going onto another team, just so that he can get to win something while we keep going into the eternal hell of "rebuilding" through the draft and strive for greatness!

Wow. This is what it's come to? Hoping for Iguodala to win on another team? :lol:

You're supposed to use that line of thinking on players that actually matter like Barkley or Randall Cunningham. Too many people overrate Iguodala to lengths that are mind-boggling.

Gsraider · Post #1659 » by **Gsraider** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 5:31 pm

P2K wrote:Too many people overrate Iguodala to lengths that are mind-boggling.

And there are almost as many that under-rate what his defensive prowess means in an NBA that is becoming more and more athletic, while utilizing smaller lineups. I'm not trumpeting the horn for Iguodala or calling you out as one of those people in any way mind you. I just think this team could wind up missing Iguodala way more than they think they will if any kind of trade is made that doesn't clearly fill another existing hole in the process.

Post #1660 » by **tk76** » Fri Jun 3, 2011 6:13 pm

There was a point a few years back when I hoped AI would be traded to Minny and get paired with KG. I felt like he had done as much in Philly as he could, and both the player and the team needed to go in a different direction because things had soured here after a few years of mediocre records. And I wanted to see AI paired with an elite big while he was still in his prime.

I think we are at about that point with Iguodala. It is clear that Iguodala won't lead this team as constructed very far. And I also think that after years of being miscast a lot of fans no longer appreciate what he brings on offense, defense and leading the break. So I'm hoping he brings back good value for the Sixers... and I hope he gets to shine as a complementary star on an elite team like he should/could. That would be best for both parties at this stage.