Moving down a spot

carrottop12 · Post #1 » by **carrottop12** » Sat Jun 4, 2011 1:16 pm

So usually I'm opposed to moving down in a draft, but if ever there was a time to do it this could be it.

Assuming jazz love knight, I could see the jazz looking to trade spots with Cleveland in order to get the fourth pick, knowing that if Cleveland had the 3 pick they wouldn't take knight, this is of course assuming they take Irving at number 1.

Cleveland would have insentive to do this if they feel like knight and walker are the fourth and fifth best players in the draft. If they do feel that way, and they stayed at 4, they'd be stuck drafting the sixth best player in the draft at the four spot. If they feel like there is a significant drop off from kanter to the 6th bpa, I could see them being very willing dealers to move up.

So, I was thinking about a deal that looked like this...

Okur and the 3

For

Anderson varejao and the 4.

For the jazz, not only do we get the guy we want in knight for a lower contract than we would have gotten him at 3, we add a potential starting center to the team who would be locked up for the next 4 years and have a contract that never climbs above 9 million dollars. Also, we save 3 million dollars next season by getting out of okurs deal a year early.

Th cavs get their guy in kanter who not only replaces varejao as a scoring threat down low, but he's also a good fit next to Irving. They also get a big expiring contract in okur that frees up a ton of cap space come next offseason. Team that up with baron davis' deal that will be coming off the books soon and they could make a good splash in free agency to build a complete team around Irving and kanter.

I actually think it's a deal that could help both teams, and if the jazz are looking to save money, and Cleveland wants to boost their rebuild, it would make a lot of sense IMO.

What do you think?

babyjax13 · Post #2 » by **babyjax13** » Sat Jun 4, 2011 2:25 pm

Anderson has some pretty big injury concerns himself. I'd rather see if we could just move Memo + some smaller incentive like CJ Miles if we really wanted him (and realistically a Memo+Miles+2012 2nd should easily get the job done).

MeestR · Post #3 » by **MeestR** » Sat Jun 4, 2011 4:30 pm

I have been thinking a lot about the draftees and their order too. Irving, Williams, Kanter knight seems to be the popular order. Cleveland has the 1 and 4. Jazz drafting knight at 3 would really be a favor for Cleveland and enable them to take Kanter at 4. Jazz need to take Kanter at 3 if he is available. If Cleveland notices the conundrum they are in, they might take Kanter at 1 knowing knight would still be available at 4.

Jazz could try to make a trade, or they could play off of Cleveland and perhaps luck out with Irving or Williams falling to 3.

hoops4life · Post #4 » by **hoops4life** » Sat Jun 4, 2011 4:43 pm

babyjax13 wrote:Anderson has some pretty big injury concerns himself. I'd rather see if we could just move Memo + some smaller incentive like CJ Miles if we really wanted him (and realistically a Memo+Miles+2012 2nd should easily get the job done).

Are you saying Memo+Miles+2012 2nd rounder for #4 or Anderson? If I was Cleveland, I don't think I would do either.

blackham9258 · Post #5 » by **blackham9258** » Sat Jun 4, 2011 4:49 pm

If we are going to trade down with Cleveland, it will have to include their #2 pick this year and their two Miami picks. However, I only do this if we believe Knight is the BPA for us. You don't pass up a legit center if he is available.

What would be very much more interesting is if Williams slips. Now I love Williams but, I am much more worried about his game translating to the NBA than Kanter's, and if he ends up truly being a 4 we have a better player/players there already. But, whats nice about Williams is that he will command more in a trade. I truly think if he fell to us Cleveland/Washington and others perhaps would be willing to give a top 3 protected 1 rounder next year for him plus their pick this year.

Cleveland offers Top 3 protected with the right to swap with our own pick or GSW pick (lesser of), and this years #4. This way we pick up Knight and get a pick from 4-6 next year that we can package with our GSW pick to move up and grab Barnes.

If the trade was with Washington we would need to really hope Knight gets past Toronto, but if he does they would have to give us their pick next year without swapping, and this years #18. With that we could take Marshon Brooks and trade it to Chicago for their future Charlotte pick. Or many other scenarios that land us cash, and future picks.

Basically, Williams allows us a lot of opportunity to stock pile picks which will be future assets to get better players in trades or to move up in the draft. Extra picks are what got us Jefferson and Deron Williams, and in a weak draft like this KOC should be hoping this happens so that we can build up our warchest of assets and options!

Post #6 » by **jazzfan1971** » Sat Jun 4, 2011 6:10 pm

I don't think you ever trade down one slot. Just not enough leverage. You can move down 2 though. Knight is probably still there at #5.

cavsfan58 · Post #7 » by **cavsfan58** » Sat Jun 4, 2011 9:10 pm

coming from a cavs fan I like it really nice trade

Post #8 » by **Rise Against** » Sun Jun 5, 2011 12:05 am

As a Cavs fan, I would love this trade. Oh and there is a very slim chance that the Cavs will not pick Irving with the first pick.

babyjax13 · Post #9 » by **babyjax13** » Sun Jun 5, 2011 12:25 am

hoops4life wrote:
babyjax13 wrote:Anderson has some pretty big injury concerns himself. I'd rather see if we could just move Memo + some smaller incentive like CJ Miles if we really wanted him (and realistically a Memo+Miles+2012 2nd should easily get the job done).

Are you saying Memo+Miles+2012 2nd rounder for #4 or Anderson? If I was Cleveland, I don't think I would do either.

Not including the fourth pick.

erudite23 · Post #10 » by **erudite23** » Sun Jun 5, 2011 1:56 am

Well thought out and presented, Bat, as usual. I like it, though my concern is that Favors and Varejao together would be a bad fit long term. I loved Varejao for us, though, and like his price tag even more. I dont think his injury concerns make him unattractive in any way, not with how reasonable his salary is. With him next to Favors, though, you don't have enough versatility offensively, and he doesn't present enough of a threat to keep guys off of doubling Derrick in the post (assuming he ever becomes worthy of a double).

But for next year its a great trade, assuming we can also package Millsap for an attractive asset. He would be excellent next to Big Al, and would erase his weaknesses on the defensive side to a large extent.

Also, this is obviously ONLY a deal to do if the Jazz brass determine that Knight is the better player than Kanter. You don't do a deal like this to take an inferior player. You only do it to take advantage of the dispersion of talent and the fact that Cleveland would never take another PG at 3 after taking Irving. But you don't do it until you've seen how the first two picks play out. So it would have to be on the day of the draft.