Basically only one move hurt the Lakers Ariza for Artest

[LovetheNBA1]

The move made sense for two players, Mello and Paul Wheelchair.

However, it hurt the offense and the team speed. I was wrong as well. People told me how dumb it was to let Ariza go, and they should of paid him 7 million just to have an athletic wing to hide how Kobe has slowed down on defense.

But Artest was almost a 20 ppg scorer. It was just a poor move. The 09 to 2010 team dipped in scoring so much.

It hurt the Lakers margin for error. They could not lapse on defense at any time, or they would lose, because we all know they do not score over a 100 anymore.


This is why i would never make a good GM. Getting rid of youth for veterans is usually never a good move.

[hermes]

this was me for like 3 days after we traded trevor

[LovetheNBA1]

this was me for like 3 days after we traded trevor

I was bragging to people at the gym. They were like U IDIOT. Ariza helped Kobe look younger.


I will never again just look at scoring averages. I saw 19.5 ppg and 5 boards from Artest. I seriously would not make a good GM.

I thought Blake was going to be Steve kerr, and Barnes a defensive stopper.

[Shamizy]

The move made sense for two players, Mello and Paul Wheelchair.

However, it hurt the offense and the team speed. I was wrong as well. People told me how dumb it was to let Ariza go, and they should of paid him 7 million just to have an athletic wing to hide how Kobe has slowed down on defense.

But Artest was almost a 20 ppg scorer. It was just a poor move. The 09 to 2010 team dipped in scoring so much.

It hurt the Lakers margin for error. They could not lapse on defense at any time, or they would lose, because we all know they do not score over a 100 anymore.


This is why i would never make a good GM. Getting rid of youth for veterans is usually never a good move.

Pierce didn't murder us like in '08. Artest came up huge in the 1st round locking down Durant, big in the Finals guarding Pierce, and especially clutch in Game 7 when he played his best game. He more than held his own defensively in that 2010 run.

Ariza has never been a lockdown defender either. He's been good at picking off the passing lane, and with helpside pressure, but one on one he was lackluster when he played for us. That '09 run we couldn't even stick Ariza on the likes of Melo, LeBron or Pierce in the regular season. We had to use Kobe because he'd get murdered one-on-one almost every time. In the playoffs, we ended up sticking Kobe on Melo and even Turkoglu. Ariza was getting owned by Turkoglu, even off the dribble.

I would have liked to keep Ariza, but Ron Artest was not a failure. Also, Ariza was pretty damn stupid for listening to his agent and trying to get more out of the Lakers. Jerry Buss wasn't about to ripped off by David Lee again after giving Andrew that giant extension a few months back only to have him get injured again. $7 million per year is waaaaaay too much for Ariza and his agent soon found out that out when he signed in Houston for the same amount as Artest did here.

It's all on Ariza that he isn't on this team anymore. Time to move on.

[Dalakerbox]

would have been nice if we could have traded Ariza for Artest and saved our MLE and went after Bibby,Andre Miller or Kidd

[LovetheNBA1]

The move made sense for two players, Mello and Paul Wheelchair.

However, it hurt the offense and the team speed. I was wrong as well. People told me how dumb it was to let Ariza go, and they should of paid him 7 million just to have an athletic wing to hide how Kobe has slowed down on defense.

But Artest was almost a 20 ppg scorer. It was just a poor move. The 09 to 2010 team dipped in scoring so much.

It hurt the Lakers margin for error. They could not lapse on defense at any time, or they would lose, because we all know they do not score over a 100 anymore.


This is why i would never make a good GM. Getting rid of youth for veterans is usually never a good move.

Pierce didn't murder us like in '08. Artest came up huge in the 1st round locking down Durant, big in the Finals guarding Pierce, and especially clutch in Game 7 when he played his best game. He more than held his own defensively in that 2010 run.

Ariza has never been a lockdown defender either. He's been good at picking off the passing lane, and with helpside pressure, but one on one he was lackluster when he played for us. That '09 run we couldn't even stick Ariza on the likes of Melo, LeBron or Pierce in the regular season. We had to use Kobe because he'd get murdered one-on-one almost every time. In the playoffs, we ended up sticking Kobe on Melo and even Turkoglu. Ariza was getting owned by Turkoglu, even off the dribble.

I would have liked to keep Ariza, but Ron Artest was not a failure. Also, Ariza was pretty damn stupid for listening to his agent and trying to get more out of the Lakers. Jerry Buss wasn't about to ripped off by David Lee again after giving Andrew that giant extension a few months back only to have him get injured again. $7 million per year is waaaaaay too much for Ariza and his agent soon found out that out when he signed in Houston for the same amount as Artest did here.

It's all on Ariza that he isn't on this team anymore. Time to move on.

You are making a mistake. Ariza did not play in the 08 finals. He attempted to come back in game 3, and got hurt again 1 quarter in.

It was Luke and Vlad Rad.

Ariza played vs the Celtics in 2009, and Wheelerchair had trouble with Ariza's speed. Ariza made key steals to help win both games. ( Remember the xmas hyped game) and the tnt night special game.

People seem to forget Ariza never lost a series starting with the Lakers.

It was a poor move. Artest was a poor move.

[LovetheNBA1]

would have been nice if we could have traded Ariza for Artest and saved our MLE and went after Bibby,Andre Miller or Kidd

Mitch is simply an average GM. The Artest deal was only suppose to be 2 to 3 years, and Mitch made it 5 last second.

It was a fans move. GMs usually look at the long haul. Its never good when a 32 15year player is the second most athletic guy on your team.

[Sedale Threatt]

I'll agree that the deal is too long -- he's going to look really bad those final two years -- but otherwise Shamizy is right.

Absolutely no way we beat the Celtics in '10 with Ariza at SF. Not only did Artest limit Pierce to a mediocre series, he outscored him each of the final two games. If that's what it took to push us over the top, then it was more than worth it.

Besides, what exactly has Ariza done since leaving? Shoot like crap, and play sub-par basketball. So it's not like we're missing much.

[Shamizy]

You are making a mistake. Ariza did not play in the 08 finals. He attempted to come back in game 3, and got hurt again 1 quarter in.

It was Luke and Vlad Rad.

Ariza played vs the Celtics in 2009, and Wheelerchair had trouble with Ariza's speed. Ariza made key steals to help win both games. ( Remember the xmas hyped game) and the tnt night special game.

People seem to forget Ariza never lost a series starting with the Lakers.

It was a poor move. Artest was a poor move.

I didn't mention Ariza playing in '08. Pierce didn't murder us like in '08 due to Ron Artest's lockdown defense. Ariza couldn't have done the same thing. Ariza has never been able to guard Pierce or give him trouble with his defense. Be it with career stats or specifically when he was on the Lakers, Ariza has never been able to stop Pierce:

Career
Pierce: 22/6/6 on 45% shooting


Vs. Ariza while on Lakers
Pierce: 25/9/4 on 47% shooting

Ariza didn't do anything special that Christmas day game. He had two points, off of that Pau block at the very end where he got a run-out. His totals while playing against the Celtics from regular season matchups were awful. 5/14 shooting total, an amazing 12 points.

Dude, that stat of never losing tells nothing. It's a cop-out like Doc Rivers' one about his starting 5 never losing a series when they're all together.

And how is Artest a poor move exactly? His contract is too long (should have been 3 instead of 5 years, but typical Mitch), but aside from that, he's more than held his own on the defensive end for us. His contributions during the '09-10 run were major to this team. There is no way we get by OKC without Ron Artest locking down on Kevin Durant and Kobe hobbled by that knee. KD would have eaten Trevor alive.

He was a good roleplayer for our team but nothing special. Yes, he made a few big steals in the playoffs and was nice in that '09 run, but he wasn't THAT much better than Ron Artest. People vastly overrate the contributions he gave to us.

[The_Trade_Seer]

NONSENSE ... we would not have beat Boston in 2010 without Artest ... it was a good trade.

[Shamizy]

On that Christmas day game, Pierce actually had 20/10/3 on 54% shooting. Ariza didn't really do much to hinder him.

[The Skyhook]

Looking back I wish we had Trevor. For the years Ron was signed Trevor would have been the better move. The energetic play Trevor brought to the Lakers still hasn't been replaced.

[LovetheNBA1]

On that Christmas day game, Pierce actually had 20/10/3 on 54% shooting. Ariza didn't really do much to hinder him.

Artest got an 2 year older Pierce. Peirce was dropped 40 something on Lebron in game 7. I do not think he dropped 40 once in 2010.


Artest is a better defender then Ariza. But we gave up too much offense. When YOU have to hold you opponent below 95 to win, you have little margin for error.

The Lakers are not good with Artest. I think the team defense improved in 2009. And in 2010 we just played at a slower pace.

[LovetheNBA1]

I'll agree that the deal is too long -- he's going to look really bad those final two years -- but otherwise Shamizy is right.

Absolutely no way we beat the Celtics in '10 with Ariza at SF. Not only did Artest limit Pierce to a mediocre series, he outscored him each of the final two games. If that's what it took to push us over the top, then it was more than worth it.

Besides, what exactly has Ariza done since leaving? Shoot like crap, and play sub-par basketball. So it's not like we're missing much.

They would of Beat Boston in 5 or 6 max. Its a dirty little secret, Boston was awful in the 2010 finals. They could not score

They did not score 70 in game 6, could not score 80 in game 7. In game 4 they only won because the Lakers could not score.



The Lakers with Ariza, simply were a 100s scoring team. In 2010 they could only play at 1 pace. Walk up the court.

[TruSkool]

artest really wasnt a poor move, it was lateral at worst.

ariza was a good defender, but he wasnt a 'lockdown' defender like artest. no way can ariza guard carmelo, atleast artest can somewhat make his life difficult...
but im sure both of them would have done fine on durant

[DEEP3CL]

First off Trev left on his on so the OP is so far off base it's ridiculous. Secondly signing Ron had absolutely nothing to do with the Laker offense having problems, third Trev was a byproduct of playing in a system with players that could cover his offensive limitations. Let's stop going goo goo gaa gaa over what Trev is doing now.

Signing Ron had EVERYTHING to do with guarding eastern opponents top players at the 3. How can the OP sit here and think Trev had a chance in hell guarding Peirce for an entire 7 game series ?

We caught a major break in 2009, who on the Magic at the 3 was physical ? That series was tailor made or Trev to have success. Of the elite 3's.....being LeBron, Melo and Peirce, Melo is the only one he can check effectively and doesn't have to worry about being in a physical battle with him.

But he can't check Paul or LeBron, they're much bigger, stronger and way more savvy offensively than Melo is. We're fine with Ron, our troubles in the playoffs had nothing to do with it offensively. Yeah we had stumbles on offense, but being in the Triangle.... a offense predicated on superior post play, we failed because we couldn't identify a reliable threat in the post. Drew was the guy we should have played through but Pau was the one we forced featured.

Bottom line is this, it's going to be about playing against the 3's that can pose problems. Trev isn't stopping, slowing down or locking up the elite 3's period.

[Dr Aki]

at the end of the day, this happened:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2LZyQl6IsQ[/youtube]

artest was MVP of game 7

[snaquille oatmeal]

I'll agree that the deal is too long -- he's going to look really bad those final two years -- but otherwise Shamizy is right.

Absolutely no way we beat the Celtics in '10 with Ariza at SF. Not only did Artest limit Pierce to a mediocre series, he outscored him each of the final two games. If that's what it took to push us over the top, then it was more than worth it.

Besides, what exactly has Ariza done since leaving? Shoot like crap, and play sub-par basketball. So it's not like we're missing much.

you said what i was going to say in more diplomatic way. the tittle of the thread ticked me off.

[Kalidogg24]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vu1zMV5j0fo[/youtube]

[tugs]

I don't get his argument. you're saying the offense was hurt because the Lakers swapped (not traded btw) Ariza for Artest? And Trevor is the more lock down defender? I'm confused.

If you ask me what one move hurt the Lakers, it's letting Turiaf go than Ariza for Artest.