The Official 2011 Cammo Mock Draft Thread

[Cammo101]

I don't about that. You're looking for top end players at the top of the draft, at #20 your looking for more developmental players. The Wolves don't have much room for a developmental 3/4.

+1

Why not take Lucas Noqueira then with the 20th pick as he has the chance to develop into something alot greater then Vucevic (the great big stiff) can.

Singleton on the other hand has an easily identifiable and NBA ready skill in his defence. At the #20 spot you can also look for a niche player and that is singleton (or a number of much better options than Vucevic)

Make no mistake, in a vacuum, I would much rather have Singleton. But, while his defense will translate, he is kind of a tweener forward who may not be able to play either forward position full time. Vucevic is a pretty good athlete who is skilled for his size. He could play for Minnesota from day one. Singleton on the other hand will have to beat out the other 35 tweener forward on that team for minutes.

In my mock I have Minnesota taking Derrick Williams (though I expect the pick to be traded) and adding him to a team that already had Love, Rudolph, and Beasley. And you want them to then draft another tweener forward?

Nog makes some sense, but is much more of a long term project.

[princeofpalace]

Pistons are going big at 8. I dont see them drafting and keeping Alec Burks, if they found out that both CHAR and MIL loved Burks- I could see some sort of trade down scenario but aside from that- I do not envision Detroit drafting another SG at 8 unless he was clearly BPA and Burks is not.

Also, IMO Vucevic is not a 'pretty good athlete', he is terribly below average in that regard. Also, MN has not shied away from redundant draft picks so Im not sure why they'd change up their style now.

[Day_Man]

I hope your latest mock is correct.

Klay Thompson Great fit for NY

[coordinator0]

This is from Chad Ford via princeofpalace regarding the Pistons:

From Chad Ford

"If they stay at eight, there are really five guys on their radar at the moment. Most of the guys they are looking at are bigs -- Jan Vesely, Jonas Valanciunas, Bismack Biyombo and Tristan Thompson. The one lone name that's a guard is that of Kemba Walker.

Also, TT's coming in for a workout on the 21st.

Chad Ford is THE guy that you want to listen to when it comes to the Pistons.

[RTM]

^ Seconded. He's just about always right. I think he's got a good relationship with Joe, or is at least tapped in really well.

[shangrila]

Make no mistake, in a vacuum, I would much rather have Singleton. But, while his defense will translate, he is kind of a tweener forward who may not be able to play either forward position full time. Vucevic is a pretty good athlete who is skilled for his size. He could play for Minnesota from day one. Singleton on the other hand will have to beat out the other 35 tweener forward on that team for minutes.

In my mock I have Minnesota taking Derrick Williams (though I expect the pick to be traded) and adding him to a team that already had Love, Rudolph, and Beasley. And you want them to then draft another tweener forward?

Nog makes some sense, but is much more of a long term project.

Then why not Tyler Honeycutt or Iman Shumpert? The last thing the Wolves need is another freaking stiff in the front court, no matter how much you feel they don't need a tweener 3/4.

[Casperkid23]

Then why not Tyler Honeycutt or Iman Shumpert? The last thing the Wolves need is another freaking stiff in the front court, no matter how much you feel they don't need a tweener 3/4.

First, Singleton obviously can't guard three positions, it's far easier to label him a tweener Forward. Second, why draft either of those guys (or the handful of other guys worthy of that spot) when you have the Timberwolves making a nonsensical selection?

Goooooo Vucevic!

[pad300]

6/7/11


29. San Antonio - Iman Shumpert (6'5'', PG, Georgia Tech, Jr.)
...
59. San Antonio - Isaiah Thomas (5'10'', PG, Washington, Jr.)

http://www.nbadraftguru.blogspot.com

So San Antonio takes 2 PG's, when they have Parker, Hill and Ginobili (he tends to take over the point spot when playing with the 2nd unit...)?

Also, they take Shumpert with Jajuan Johnson, Keith Benson, and Kyle Singler all still on the board?

Also, have you heard anything about Julyan Stone? Can you see him ending up in the 2nd? He surely does stick out on the statistical analyses - a 6'6" PG who gets 7.5 rpg, 5.3 apg and a 2.8 A/TO?

[Cammo101]

6/7/11


29. San Antonio - Iman Shumpert (6'5'', PG, Georgia Tech, Jr.)
...
59. San Antonio - Isaiah Thomas (5'10'', PG, Washington, Jr.)

http://www.nbadraftguru.blogspot.com

So San Antonio takes 2 PG's, when they have Parker, Hill and Ginobili (he tends to take over the point spot when playing with the 2nd unit...)?

Also, they take Shumpert with Jajuan Johnson, Keith Benson, and Kyle Singler all still on the board?

Also, have you heard anything about Julyan Stone? Can you see him ending up in the 2nd? He surely does stick out on the statistical analyses - a 6'6" PG who gets 7.5 rpg, 5.3 apg and a 2.8 A/TO?

I think Shumpert will likely play SG at the NBA level and actually could become kind of a Ginobili in training for the Spurs.

Stone has an intriguing skill set, but he couldn't average 10 points per game in the C-USA. Someone may fall in love with him late in the second, but he is more likely going to have to earn his NBA spot in the D-League or overseas.

[shangrila]

First, Singleton obviously can't guard three positions, it's far easier to label him a tweener Forward.

Great. What does this have to do with me?

Second, why draft either of those guys (or the handful of other guys worthy of that spot) when you have the Timberwolves making a nonsensical selection?

Goooooo Vucevic!

Personally, because guys like Shumpert or Honeycutt at least have the potential to outplay their draft position. Vucevic is what he is.

[Casperkid23]

First, Singleton obviously can't guard three positions, it's far easier to label him a tweener Forward.

Great. What does this have to do with me?

Second, why draft either of those guys (or the handful of other guys worthy of that spot) when you have the Timberwolves making a nonsensical selection?

Goooooo Vucevic!

Personally, because guys like Shumpert or Honeycutt at least have the potential to outplay their draft position. Vucevic is what he is.

You missed the heavy sarcasm. Thought I laid it on thick.

1. Was commenting on Cammo's need to label Singleton a tweener Forward when he can defend 3 positions... gives him incredibly versatility and allows whoever drafts him the ability to put quite a few different wing/forward combinations around him with ease.

2. Sarcasm.

[Cammo101]

First, Singleton obviously can't guard three positions, it's far easier to label him a tweener Forward.

Great. What does this have to do with me?

Second, why draft either of those guys (or the handful of other guys worthy of that spot) when you have the Timberwolves making a nonsensical selection?

Goooooo Vucevic!

Personally, because guys like Shumpert or Honeycutt at least have the potential to outplay their draft position. Vucevic is what he is.

You clearly made the mistake of thinking Casper was an actual poster and not a troll who comes in here once a week or so to drum up some drama.

It happens.

[Casperkid23]

You clearly made the mistake of thinking Casper was being serious... he's someone who comes in here once a month or so to completely trash some of my ridiculous takes which show that I have no idea what I'm talking about.

It happens.

Fixed your post.

[Cammo101]

You clearly made the mistake of thinking Casper was being serious... he's someone who comes in here once a month or so to completely trash some of my ridiculous takes which show that I have no idea what I'm talking about.

It happens.

Fixed your post.

You sure proved me wrong. No trolling whatsoever. You add some strong substance to this thread. Well played.

There is no bigger Chris Singleton fan on these boards than I am. But, that does not change the fact that he would not see the floor in Minnesota and he does not have the foot speed to defend shooting guards at the NBA level.

Now back under the bridge with you troll. We will see you in a few weeks when you must bravely defend the honor of another slighted prospect.

[Casperkid23]

Chris Singleton doesn't have the foot speed to defend SGs at the NBA level? What?

It appears you live in Florida and you call yourself the biggest Singleton fan on RealGM, yet you've never watched him play?

Dude has spent time defending the some of the more dangerous SGs, wings, PFs, and even some PGs in the ACC. He is quick on his feet (especially for a 6'8 230 guy), has a tremendous wingspan, and outstanding instincts/IQ. He looks just as comfortable defending on the perimeter as he does defending in the post. Hell, that's why he's a potential lottery prospect in this draft - because even though he has huge holes in his offensive game he's an incredibly versatile defender... someone who looks forward to challenges and will ask to be placed on the primary ball handler in the clutch in order to disrupt the opposing offense.

He wouldn't see time on the floor in Minnesota because...? There is no reason he couldn't see time in a lineup that included Rubio, Wes, Beasley, and Love. Nor one with Rubio, Beasley, AR, and Love. Nor Rubio, Wes, AR, and Love. Nor Rubio, Beasley, Love, and Darko. Nor Rubio, Wes, Love, and Darko. Nor Rubio, Wes, Beasley, and Darko. Nor Rubio, Tolliver, Beasley, and Darko. Nor Rubio, Wes, Webster, and Darko. Nor Rubio, Wes, AR, and Pek. Nor Rubio, Webster, Tolliver, and Pek. Nor nearly whatever other combination that has Rubio/Ridnour in it.

His offensive fit is the least of Minnesota's worries - his defensive fit is the thing that matters, and they are in dire need of a defender like him. "Chris, just stand in the corner and get ready to knock down 3s if you're open and if you're not, don't force things... then defensively make up for the poor defenders Minnesota is forced to rely on. Hell, if you want variety offensively cut to the hoop and finish some lobs."

I don't add substance? You add the most generic descriptions for players whenever asked about a prospect. You spam mocks all season long, even though it's quite clear you do not have knowledge of the players you're attempting to project.

What the hell does Vucevic bring to Minnesota? Size? They have Darko and Pek tied up in contracts. Defense? Nope, he's pretty soft and has virtually no impact. Offense? Okay, yeah, Minnesota has one of those soft, no-defense bigs in Pek... except he is quite proficient in the post. Spread the floor? Awesome, another Kosta Koufos whom Minnesota didn't play. Vucevic overlaps horribly with Kevin Love. He's the guy who wouldn't see the floor.

Nice try labeling me a troll though.

[Cammo101]

Chris Singleton doesn't have the foot speed to defend SGs at the NBA level? What?

It appears you live in Florida and you call yourself the biggest Singleton fan on RealGM, yet you've never watched him play?

Dude has spent time defending the some of the more dangerous SGs, wings, PFs, and even some PGs in the ACC. He is quick on his feet (especially for a 6'8 230 guy), has a tremendous wingspan, and outstanding instincts. He looks just as comfortable defending on the perimeter as he does defending in the post. Hell, that's why he's a potential lottery prospect in this draft - because even though he has huge holes in his offensive game he's an incredibly versatile defender... someone who looks forward to challenges and will ask to be placed on the primary ball handler in the clutch in order to disrupt the opposing offense.

He wouldn't see time on the floor in Minnesota because...? There is no reason he couldn't see time in a lineup that included Rubio, Wes, Beasley, and Love. Nor one with Rubio, Beasley, AR, and Love. Nor Rubio, Wes, AR, and Love. Nor Rubio, Beasley, Love, and Darko. Nor Rubio, Wes, Love, and Darko. Nor Rubio, Wes, Beasley, and Darko. Nor Rubio, Tolliver, Beasley, and Darko. Nor Rubio, Wes, Webster, and Darko. Nor Rubio, Wes, AR, and Pek. Nor Rubio, Webster, Tolliver, and Pek. Nor nearly whatever other combination that has Rubio/Ridnour in it.

His offensive fit is the least of Minnesota's worries - his defensive fit is the thing that matters, and they are in dire need of a defender like him. "Chris, just stand in the corner and get ready to knock down 3s if you're open and if you're not, don't force things... then defensively make up for the poor defenders Minnesota is forced to rely on. Hell, if you want variety offensively cut to the hoop and finish some lobs."

I don't add substance? You add the most generic descriptions for players whenever asked about a prospect. You spam mocks all season long, even though it's quite clear you do not have knowledge of the players you're attempting to project.

What the hell does Vucevic bring to Minnesota? Size? They have Darko and Pek tied up in contracts. Defense? Nope, he's pretty soft and has virtually no impact. Offense? Okay, yeah, Minnesota has one of those soft, no-defense bigs in Pek... except he is quite proficient in the post. Spread the floor? Awesome, another Kosta Koufos whom Minnesota didn't play. Vucevic overlaps horribly with Kevin Love. He's the guy who wouldn't see the floor.

Nice try though.

I have been an FSU fan since birth and have probably seen more of him than any player in this draft. In fact, I have been hyping up Singleton as a potential lotto pick since he showed up on campus. He is an excellent defender, and could potentially be an All Defensive Team caliber defender at the NBA level. But, just because he can cover some college shooting guards does not mean he can consistently stay in front of these super quick NBA shooting guards. He certainly can cover small forwards and power forwards, but he does not have the speed or quick feet to stay in front of most starting shooting guards IMO.

Singleton's ability to play shooting guard is what hinges him as a pick to Minnesota. There are only so many forward minutes to go around, and Love, Beasley, and Randolph currently account for a giant chunk of them. I do actually agree with you that Minnesota could use his defense and SHOULD find time for him. If that means moving Beasley, I would consider that. But, they likely will not. And it is a tough sale to Minnesota fans that you spent the #20 pick on a guy you have no space for, especially considering how much help Minny actually needs.

I'm no great Vucevic fan. I would not take him at #20. Hell, I'm not totally sold on him as a first round pick. But, this is not my list of favorite players, it is a prediction. Darko and Pekovic is one of the worst center combos in basketball. The idea that they would keep Minnesota from taking a center is laughable.

It's funny that you seem to imply that I am just throwing darts at a board, when I am the one who actually puts my opinion on display to be picked apart. I might actually respect your opinions on these guys if you were a legit poster and not just a guy who comes in to troll, takes no real stance, and then bails. You have to prove to people you actually know what you are talking about. That is the part you seem to skip. Any goofball can pop into a thread, throw around some vague hate, and then bail unscathed. Because they set forth no opinion. People know who I like and don't like in this draft...and in many drafts before it. I set my opinions out to be picked apart, and have a pretty solid track record. And every year someone like you (or your last year version Sid The Squid) shows up, acts like they know everything, and then bail when what they were so sure of didn't actually happen. At least Sid, dumb as he was, had a take outside of "nu uh". The only thing we can learn about your opinions by reading this thread is that they are waaaaay better than mine. They sound exciting. When can we hear one?

[shangrila]

First, Singleton obviously can't guard three positions, it's far easier to label him a tweener Forward.

Great. What does this have to do with me?

Second, why draft either of those guys (or the handful of other guys worthy of that spot) when you have the Timberwolves making a nonsensical selection?

Goooooo Vucevic!

Personally, because guys like Shumpert or Honeycutt at least have the potential to outplay their draft position. Vucevic is what he is.

You missed the heavy sarcasm. Thought I laid it on thick.

1. Was commenting on Cammo's need to label Singleton a tweener Forward when he can defend 3 positions... gives him incredibly versatility and allows whoever drafts him the ability to put quite a few different wing/forward combinations around him with ease.

2. Sarcasm.

My mistake then.

[Casperkid23]

Who is Singleton similar to defensively in the NBA? Battier, Posey, Deng, Mbah a Moute. Now, hopefully he can translate into being the type of defender Battier is, but he possesses the same type of body/athleticism as all of those guys. Last I checked, they all spend time checking SGs/SFs/PFs.

Darko and Pekovic are one of the worst C combinations in basketball. However, Vucevic is a mid/late-1st C with little upside; he's not going to supplant either of the two in the rotation next year because he doesn't offer anything Minnesota needs. Taking Vucevic over Singleton makes absolutely no sense for the Wolves. The Wolves had what Vucevic could bring, and he was stuck as a 3rd stringer who only got time when one of the two Cs got hurt. You thinking that Vucevic would be the pick is hilarious.

I put my opinion all over Wolves boards to be picked apart. I put my opinion in this thread (hello, you quoted it) to be picked apart. Unlike you, I spend a considerable amount of time breaking down the games of prospects instead of putting up a completely useless mock early in the season. Your track record is no better than anyone else's I have come across. However, you routinely like to pump it up as something better than it is... and then when you get called out on it you backtrack or call me (or whoever did the calling out) a "troll". That seems to be your favorite word when you are criticized.

My takes are only "nu uh"? Yeah, like back when I said you were an imbecile for putting Khris Middleton anywhere near Michael Gilchrist - I only said "nu uh" there, right? And now, that long post that you JUST QUOTED, I only say "nu uh" there too, yeah?

Maybe spend more time thinking about the crap you put numbers next to and post, and less time being defensive when someone calls you out for having an uninformed opinion.

[Cammo101]

Singleton is much bulkier than Battier. He would have a harder time staying with guards.

If a tree fell on the Wolves board, would anyone hear it?

I'm fairly certain you are the only person since page one of this thread that I have called a troll.

[Casperkid23]

Singleton: 6'7.5" 230lbs
Battier: 6'8.25" 229lbs

Uninformed.

Yes, I'm definitely a "troll". Do some f***ing research.