Euroleague Adj. +/- ..how good is Rubio really? Hint: Amazin

Elden Payton · Post #61 » by **Elden Payton** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 4:08 am

Rubio will be fine, we should give him the benefit of the doubt & Leeway a prospect deserves, he hasn't played an nba game yet so wait until he's played a season before we judge where he's at.

Mirotic,Biyombo,Montiejunas,Vesely & Valanciunas all get praise for being roleplaying prospects in Europe & Rubio doesn't? SMH...I know they are bigs but still...

Kayjay · Post #62 » by **Kayjay** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 4:31 am

they all don't shoot embarrassing percentages

but w/e, the nba's a faster freer game and he'll get better looks. i mean, he can't shoot any worse than brandon jennings and that guy still starts (plus is worse at playmaking). i still think his best case is 2009-2011 jason kidd

bullsnewdynasty · Post #63 » by **bullsnewdynasty** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 4:38 am

BamBam9 wrote:If the coaches would give priority to the statistics to put a player on the court, Ricky would not be a professional player.

Rose(or players who needed 25 shots to get 20 points.) in a big team in Europe, would score no more than 10pg, and probably would not play more than 25 minutes.

This is comedy. Nobody in Europe even comes close to the quickness of Rose. I highly doubt a guy could even stay in front of him over there.

Rubio is the most overhyped PG since Sebastian Telfair and I'm predicting he won't come close to living up to it.

jinxed · Post #64 » by **jinxed** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 8:18 pm

bullsnewdynasty wrote:
BamBam9 wrote:If the coaches would give priority to the statistics to put a player on the court, Ricky would not be a professional player.

Rose(or players who needed 25 shots to get 20 points.) in a big team in Europe, would score no more than 10pg, and probably would not play more than 25 minutes.

This is comedy. Nobody in Europe even comes close to the quickness of Rose. I highly doubt a guy could even stay in front of him over there.

Rubio is the most overhyped PG since Sebastian Telfair and I'm predicting he won't come close to living up to it.

Ricky Rubio vs. Derrick Rose.

Watch the first play. Rubio strips rose. Strips him again later on.

Derrrick Rose averaged 7 points, 3 assists per game during the 2010 World Championships

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XiCxEe1zo8I[/youtube]

TripleC · Post #65 » by **TripleC** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 8:23 pm

UssjTrunks wrote:It's going to be fun watching all the haters eat crow when Rubio lights up their teams. This kid will be a stud in the league.

LOl okay.

Thugonomics · Post #66 » by **Thugonomics** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 8:23 pm

Bucksfans1and2 wrote:Rubio is the most overrated player in the history of Basketball. He's surpassed Allen Iverson.

people really can't be this DUMB

Greek · Post #67 » by **Greek** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 8:45 pm

Very overrated and i am watching him since his 15...basically the same player, with little better body, no noticeable progress. If he ever be as good as Calderon i would be real happy, but i dont even see that...

Fat Kat · Post #68 » by **Fat Kat** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 8:56 pm

Today's stat line

17:30 min; 0pts (0/1FG, 0/2 3pts), 5 asists, 2reb, 2st, 4to.

NBA guards are shaking in their boots.

karolis1221 · Post #69 » by **karolis1221** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 8:57 pm

bullsnewdynasty wrote:
BamBam9 wrote:If the coaches would give priority to the statistics to put a player on the court, Ricky would not be a professional player.

Rose(or players who needed 25 shots to get 20 points.) in a big team in Europe, would score no more than 10pg, and probably would not play more than 25 minutes.

This is comedy. Nobody in Europe even comes close to the quickness of Rose. I highly doubt a guy could even stay in front of him over there.

Rubio is the most overhyped PG since Sebastian Telfair and I'm predicting he won't come close to living up to it.

i agree with you man. Rose would dominate here in europe and rubio is Elite scrub.

BamBam9 · Post #70 » by **BamBam9** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 9:06 pm

Fat Kat wrote:Today's stat line

17:30 min; 0pts (0/1FG, 0/2 3pts), 5 asists, 2reb, 2st, 4to.

NBA guards are shaking in their boots.

With 3 shots can not do anything.

Even by those numbers, has ended with positive evaluation.

BamBam9 · Post #71 » by **BamBam9** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 9:08 pm

bullsnewdynasty wrote:
BamBam9 wrote:If the coaches would give priority to the statistics to put a player on the court, Ricky would not be a professional player.

Rose(or players who needed 25 shots to get 20 points.) in a big team in Europe, would score no more than 10pg, and probably would not play more than 25 minutes.

This is comedy. Nobody in Europe even comes close to the quickness of Rose. I highly doubt a guy could even stay in front of him over there.

Rubio is the most overhyped PG since Sebastian Telfair and I'm predicting he won't come close to living up to it.

I speak of numbers, not on who is faster.

jinxed · Post #72 » by **jinxed** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 9:17 pm

Fat Kat wrote:Today's stat line

17:30 min; 0pts (0/1FG, 0/2 3pts), 5 asists, 2reb, 2st, 4to.

NBA guards are shaking in their boots.

And what was his plus/minus?

You are kind of missing the point of this thread aren't you?

Let me restate the POINT OF THIS THREAD.

Here it is..

Rubio's BOX score stats look mediocre.

His PLUS/MINUS Stats are AMAZING.

Anyone today's game was still fairly impressive from a passing standpoint.

5 assists in 17 minutes in euroleague is pretty incredible, considering how they measure an assist.

For instance, that would translate (hollinger's method) ..to 13.8 assists per 36 minutes in an NBA game.

Mamba Venom · Post #73 » by **Mamba Venom** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 9:49 pm

Well the great thing is we don't have to adjust. Rubio can prove his NBA #s this year!

boogie-reke · Post #74 » by **boogie-reke** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 10:14 pm

Yea, let the season come and sort all this crap out.

kombayn · Post #75 » by **kombayn** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 10:28 pm

I think Rubio can be a late-bloomer, a poor-man's Rajon Rondo. It really depends, but the T'Wolves need to run a small line-up this year and just play Nellie Ball right now. R. Rubio/W. Johnson/M. Beasley/D. Williams/K. Love with L. Ridnour/M. Webster/A. Randolph/N. Pekovic/D. Milicic off the bench. Playing Nellie ball will be their best bet and could maybe win 25 games this season, 30 or over would be a success for Rambis.

Post #76 » by **TheOUTLAW** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 10:29 pm

He had no points 5 assists and 4 turnovers in 17 minutes. I don't see how you can say that is impressive in any way.

funkatron101 · Post #77 » by **funkatron101** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 10:32 pm

You got a few guys still claiming that he is going to be amazing, a whole lot of people proclaiming Bust, and a few people saying "Let's just wait and see."

I don't know how anyone can still claim that he is over-rated.

BubbaTee · Post #78 » by **BubbaTee** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 10:34 pm

jinxed wrote:1)Rubio started 17 of 20 games in Euroleague. He went to the bench in the ACB a couple weeks ago when he sprained his ankle, in the playoffs.

Are you excluding those bench games from Rubio's stats? You're the one who said starters vs bench is not comparable, not me.

Even though starters vs bench is more comparable in Europe than in the NBA, because PT is more equitably distributed in Europe.

2) This stat is EUROLEAGUE and is RAPM, so just straight +/- is kind of irrelevant. Why would you bring up straight plus/minus if you weren't confused about it being different than RAPM, and then using at as an argument for a fallacious stat?

First off, how is the straight +/- stat "fallacious"? I do not think that word means what you think it means.

Anyways, I'm more concerned about your slavish Hollinger-esque devotion to a single stat. Stats as an entire concept don't encapsulate the whole of a player's game, let alone one single stat out of all the ones available. And you're using a single stat as the sole benchmark to determine the best players in Europe? :-?

But if you want to use RAPM, fine.
Using RAPM, do you agree that Nick Collison is a top 5 NBA player?
Because he had a top 5 RAPM for 2010-11.
1. Dirk +7.2
2. Manu +6.1
3. Garnett +5.5
4. NICK COLLISON +5.0
5. Paul +4.5
http://stats-for-the-nba.appspot.com/ranking11

I guess we have our true All-NBA team, ladies and gents. Better luck next year to Dwight, Lebron, Durant, Kobe, Rose, and Wade.

At least next season (CBA willing) will have some interesting scenarios:

- Can Wade (+3.6 RAPM) finally become a better player than Luol Deng (+3.8)?

- Will Mike Conley (+3.5) remain superior to Rose (+3.4), Durant (+3.2) and Duncan (+3.2)?

- Will Kobe (+1.1) be able to achieve the status of "Best Active Laker Guard" with Derek Fisher (+2.3) still around?

- Will Blake Griffin (+1.1) Tiger Jump past Kenyon Martin (+1.6)?

BubbaTee · Post #79 » by **BubbaTee** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 10:36 pm

jinxed wrote:
bullsnewdynasty wrote:
BamBam9 wrote:If the coaches would give priority to the statistics to put a player on the court, Ricky would not be a professional player.

Rose(or players who needed 25 shots to get 20 points.) in a big team in Europe, would score no more than 10pg, and probably would not play more than 25 minutes.

This is comedy. Nobody in Europe even comes close to the quickness of Rose. I highly doubt a guy could even stay in front of him over there.

Rubio is the most overhyped PG since Sebastian Telfair and I'm predicting he won't come close to living up to it.

Ricky Rubio vs. Derrick Rose.

Watch the first play. Rubio strips rose. Strips him again later on.

Derrrick Rose averaged 7 points, 3 assists per game during the 2010 World Championships

And Patty Mills outplayed both Paul and Deron in the 2008 Olympics. Guess that explains why Mills made 1st team All-NBA this year. Hooray for tiny sample sizes in games governed by non-NBA rulesets!

BubbaTee · Post #80 » by **BubbaTee** » Thu Jun 9, 2011 10:37 pm

Johnny Firpo wrote:I know one thing, the Wolves will win more games with him, than without him. He will be an impactful quality starting PG at the very least. He may shoot 38% percent from the floor, but he won't hurt his team much with it. That's how great a passer he is. He has one elite skill, and that happens to be the most important one when it comes to a point guard. He won't be a bust, just no way.

Even if his offense is horrible he's still a better defender than Ridnour or Flynn. Though he might struggle at first in adjusting to the "breathe on him and it's a foul" rules the NBA has regarding perimeter defense. Once he gets a feel for the rules, he should be MIN's best perimeter defender.