Lather me with blather -- DRAFT thread 4

[fishercob]

Ah ha! The plot thickens! I love this time of year.

SpearsNBAYahoo Marc J. Spears
Y! Sports: Cavs still undecided on Kyrie or @DWilluofA23 for top pick. Fourth pick & trade offers can have influence. http://yhoo.it/io0O7Z

Eight days before the NBA draft, Cleveland Cavaliers coach Byron Scott told Yahoo! Sports the franchise isn’t close to deciding whether to use the No. 1 pick on Duke guard Kyrie Irving or Arizona forward Derrick Williams.

The Cavaliers have the first and fourth picks in the June 23 draft in Newark, N.J. Who they decide to take with the top pick could be determined by whether they decide to pursue another guard like Kentucky’s Brandon Knight or Connecticut’s Kemba Walker at No. 4 – or whether they receive an enticing trade offer, league sources told Yahoo! Sports. The Cavs also have workouts scheduled for early next week that will factor in their decision.

“The main reason is we want to do our due diligence on the other guys as well,” Scott said on why a decision hasn’t been made. “We have a few more workouts we want to get in before we really want to start evaluating on who we think is the best possible pick at No. 1 and who we think is the best at No. 4. So, by no means, has anyone in our organization who has been to our workouts said, ‘Derrick Williams is our first pick’ or ‘Kyrie Irving is our first pick.’

Cleveland is letting the league know that if you want a shot at Derrick Williams, you gotta come through us! They know that if they trade Williams, there's no way Minny takes Irving second, and perhaps they could force Minny's hand by offering the 4th pick plus incentive for the second and then CLE ends up with the guy they wanted all along (Irving, at a lower pay rate) and a haul of assets for Williams.

I'd still bet on them just drafting Kyrie first, but I love the jockeying and strategy this time of year.

[TGW]

Rubio = most overrated draft pick since Darko Millicic (who coincidentally will be Rubio's teammate). Rubio was pretty bad this past year, and showed no growth in his game. I honestly don't think he turns out much better than Luke Ridnour (who also will be Rubio's teammate next year).

As for the #2 for #6 and McGee -- if we got Wes Johnson out of it, then maybe I'd consider it. But right now, there's a distinct possibility that Kanter lasts until #6, and there's no way in hell you'd convince me that Derrick Williams is worth McGee AND Kanter.

[fishercob]

Rubio = most overrated draft pick since Darko Millicic (who coincidentally will be Rubio's teammate). Rubio was pretty bad this past year, and showed no growth in his game. I honestly don't think he turns out much better than Luke Ridnour (who also will be Rubio's teammate next year).

I understand the skepticism of Rubio given his stats. But his size, vision, passing and quick hands are very Jason Kidd like. He probably doesn't have kidd's speed with the ball or lateral quickness, but go watch the highlights of him in the 2008 gold medal game and tell me he can't hold his own in the NBA.

[nate33]

If Kanter slips, I totally want to move Blatche. I'd take a 2012 1st rounder back from a team that should finish middle of the pack and an expiring/short contract for sure. And then pray for their misfortune.

I don't.

If we get Kanter, I think the Kanter/McGee/Blatche combo at PF and C has pretty good synergy. Once Kanter becomes acclimated to the NBA game, I'd like to see he and McGee start, with Blatche coming off the bench at both spots. Also, having three starting caliber bigs will force them all to work a bit harder to get minutes.

If nothing else, I wouldn't trade Blatche immediately. Kanter is probably going to take a little time to develop so we'll need Blatche for a while. I also think Blatche can improve his trade value by playing healthy.

[Hoopalotta]

^ That Givony Yahoo draft is fresh off the press. Good news as far as I'm concerned.

As for the #2 for #6 and McGee -- if we got Wes Johnson out of it, then maybe I'd consider it. But right now, there's a distinct possibility that Kanter lasts until #6, and there's no way in hell you'd convince me that Derrick Williams is worth McGee AND Kanter.

This is exactly what we should be telling the Wolves too - "Well, we feel comfortable at 6, and you know, we're super in love with Vesley too, so I guess we talk about something for the 2nd if you'd like, but...."

I like that nothing has really leaked for us other than that we like guys who are guaranteed to be there at 6.

I just hope we don't really like most of them.

[closg00]

Rubio = most overrated draft pick since Darko Millicic (who coincidentally will be Rubio's teammate). Rubio was pretty bad this past year, and showed no growth in his game. I honestly don't think he turns out much better than Luke Ridnour (who also will be Rubio's teammate next year).

I understand the skepticism of Rubio given his stats. But his size, vision, passing and quick hands are very Jason Kidd like. He probably doesn't have kidd's speed with the ball or lateral quickness, but go watch the highlights of him in the 2008 gold medal game and tell me he can't hold his own in the NBA.

+1 Rubio needs a fresh start in the NBA and the right players around him...not that Kahn has thought about that. Like Wall, Ricky is going have to develop his jump-shot also.

[nate33]

I still don't like the idea of trading McGee, even for Williams. I'd rather just draft Kanter (sacrificing the #18 to move up to #3 if necessary) and be done with it.

[Rafael122]

That's a nice batch of talent if we get Johnson and Williams in here, add Wall and Crawford, maybe a re-signed Nick Young? It's a start...we'd have no bigs though.

[nate33]

That's a nice batch of talent if we get Johnson and Williams in here, add Wall and Crawford, maybe a re-signed Nick Young? It's a start...we'd have no bigs though.

Exactly. And it's damn hard to find good bigs once you've already got a decent team. You need to find high potential upside bigs early in the draft and then develop them. We're lucky in that we have at least one high potential upside big in McGee. Let's not give him away.

[Ruzious]

Rubio = most overrated draft pick since Darko Millicic (who coincidentally will be Rubio's teammate). Rubio was pretty bad this past year, and showed no growth in his game. I honestly don't think he turns out much better than Luke Ridnour (who also will be Rubio's teammate next year).

As for the #2 for #6 and McGee -- if we got Wes Johnson out of it, then maybe I'd consider it. But right now, there's a distinct possibility that Kanter lasts until #6, and there's no way in hell you'd convince me that Derrick Williams is worth McGee AND Kanter.

I could definitely see both sides discussing Javale + 6 for 2 + Wes Johnson. I wouldn't make that trade, but I could see it happen. What I'm hoping is that the Wiz talking with Minny is just a smokescrean to get Utah off their arses and make the trade with Washington - where we swap 6 for 3 and give the Jazz some trinkets. I want Kanter over Williams, and I want to keep Javale. Size matters. <That's what she said.>

[Hoopalotta]

I still don't like the idea of trading McGee, even for Williams. I'd rather just draft Kanter (sacrificing the #18 to move up to #3 if necessary) and be done with it.

I'm not enthusiastic either, being skeptical about the "Javale=Role Player/Williams=Star" model that's been offered here, but this is still a better rumors for our side than the John Thompson show's scoop.

If nothing else, I like it better if they're calling us. The 6th and a 2012 protected pick is certainly something I could be talked into as well.

[theboomking]

Regarding all of the talk about us overpaying for Williams in terms of value, isn't the old adage that the team that wins an NBA trade is the one that gets the best player?

Almost every player in the NBA is replaceable. JaVale is replaceable. We could have signed Tyson Chandler in FA and had a better player, and we'll have a second cut at that this year. Bigs are going to want to come to Washington to play with Wall.

What we ought to figure out is, who is the absolute best player to have paired with Wall and build the franchise around. If that player is Javale, then fine, keep him. But, if that player is Williams, don't wring your hands about overpaying by adding in picks for players that are likely to be solid roleplayers at best. Trade up and get him, even if that leaves the team with Wall and Williams playing 2 on 5 for all of 2011/12. We will be better for it in 3 years. Ditto Kanter. If the FO likes him best, then wait for him to fall to 6, and if someone else picks him, try to pry him away with a trade.

If we want to be a team that can compete with the Heat, Bulls and Celtics, we need to begin our rebuild with high end talent. Fill in the role players later. They are always available in free agency, and we will be able to afford them if our stars are on rookie contracts.

[Hoopalotta]

The Givony Mock has us with Donnie Mountjoy at 18:

Motiejunas was projected as a top-10 pick not too long ago, but the emergence of other prospects, coupled with a growing concern regarding Motiejunas’ deficiencies as a defender, rebounder and all-around competitor, have dropped his stock. He didn’t do himself any favors by conducting a very poor workout in front of a huge amount of NBA executives at the adidas EuroCamp in Italy.

He later redeemed himself in a better showing in front of a much smaller crowd, including multiple front-office members of the Wizards.

This would probably be the lowest Motiejunas drops, and while not really filling much of a need, this could end up being a significant coup for the Wizards. The Lithuanian is a highly skilled and agile 7-footer with great potential as a mismatch scorer in the NBA. He is coming off a solid season playing at a high level in Europe.

Wow, just our luck; stunk in front of the big crowds and shined for us.

Imagine if we nabbed Vesley AND Mountjoy.

That was Vesley AND Mountjoy. AND. As in both.

I think I'd be 90% horrified and 10% genuinely amused.

[LyricalRico]

I still don't like the idea of trading McGee, even for Williams. I'd rather just draft Kanter (sacrificing the #18 to move up to #3 if necessary) and be done with it.

I'm not enthusiastic either, being skeptical about the "Javale=Role Player/Williams=Star" model that's been offered here, but this is still a better rumors for our side than the John Thompson show's scoop.

If nothing else, I like it better if they're calling us. The 6th and a 2012 protected pick is certainly something I could be talked into as well.

I agree that Minny calling us and potentially offering additional value bodes well. Here are the options I'm looking at:

Option 1 - Cleveland takes Irving at #1 and we trade up to #2 for Williams (hopefully not using McGee, but I'm not opposed to including him)
Option 2 - Cleveland take Williams at #1 and works to get the #2 from Minny so they can also take Irving. We then trade up to #3 to make sure we get Kanter.
Option 3 - We sit tight and see if Kanter falls to us.
Option 4 - If Kanter doesn't fall to us and one of the guards is left, we trade down with Charlotte and take Singleton at #9.

Can't wait for draft night!

[Hoopalotta]

Option 1 - Cleveland takes Irving at #1 and we trade up to #2 for Williams (hopefully not using McGee, but I'm not opposed to including him)
Option 2 - Cleveland take Williams at #1 and works to get the #2 from Minny so they can also take Irving. We then trade up to #3 to make sure we get Kanter.
Option 3 - We sit tight and see if Kanter falls to us.
Option 4 - If Kanter doesn't fall to us and one of the guards is left, we trade down with Charlotte and take Singleton at #9.

Option 5 - Utah trades us #3 & #12 for #6 & #18.



Everbody wins!

Well, maybe not "everybody", but close enough from my perspective.

[NbdyBeatsTheWiz]

TheHoopsReport Ryan Feldman
A source at the Jazz workout today said Jimmer Fredette was the best player there and that Kemba Walker had trouble guarding him. The source also said that Fredette shot the ball really well and Walker didn't shoot well at all.

Hopefully this adds fuel to the fire and they are more inclined to trade from 3 to 6, scooping the Jimmer before Sactown can get him at 7.

They can't just take him at 3........... can they?

[tontoz]

Intersting take on Leonard from NBA.com

Mock Draft: San Diego State's Leonard could shape lottery

Posted Jun 14 2011 11:28PM

The Kawhi Leonard landing spot would have been one of the interesting outcomes no matter what, the way some teams think he is worthy of being picked around the midpoint of the lottery and others don't think he is good enough to deserve to be taken at the midpoint of the entire first round. Opinions from front offices are that wildly split.

Only now, Leonard has emerged as such a game changer that his possible early selection, if it happens, becomes an intersection moment next Thursday. He's a possibility as soon as No. 6 to the Wizards, which could drop Brandon Knight or Jan Vesely to the delighted Kings. Or, the San Diego State star is an option for Sacramento at 7, which is a good moment for teams going later in the lottery that didn't have Leonard going so high. (Maybe the Kings take Leonard over Kemba Walker, with small forward a pressing issue. But going Leonard over Vesely is impossible to imagine.)

No other successful college player generates such disagreement. One team rated Leonard the 18th-best player in the draft after San Diego State was eliminated from the tournament, a strong statement even if he moved up since by attrition when several likely lottery picks stayed in school. Another executive, though he had not done his club's mock draft yet, said he wouldn't take Leonard in the mid-teens, the cost of not being a standout shooter or a plus-athlete. And now he could become a central figure in the selection process.

http://www.nba.com/2011/news/features/s ... ef:nbahpt1

[theboomking]

I know there were some fluff videos posted, but has anyone heard any word about who excelled during our workout with Harris, Marcus Morris, Chris Singleton, Honeycutt, et all?

[Rafael122]

Ford came out with his tier groups. No one in Tier 1, Williams in and Irving in Tier 2.

[Wizardspride]

I'm hearing the Utah Jazz really like Brandon Knight but aren't sure if they want him at No. 3 or to trade down. The interest may not be mutual from Brandon Knight, but he will reportedly be in Utah on Thursday for a private workout. We'll see how Knight and the Jazz feel about each other after that.

Even though the Jazz like Knight, they still might draft Enes Kanter as the best player available and look to trade.

The Jazz are actively looking for a trade partner at No. 4, No. 5 or No. 6. The problem is that those teams aren't sure Kanter will be gone before then if the Jazz pass on him.

A Wizards trade makes sense with the Jazz, but the Wizards think Kanter may slip to them and they'd still be happy with a few other guys.

http://thehoopsreport.com/article.aspx?id=746