Official Trade Thread XVI: 5/3/11 - 6/29/11

[Dat2U]

Don't get me wrong. I like Williams. If we could trade up for him with slight incentive (18th pick, Seraphin or Booker) I'd probably be fine with that. But I'm not sold Williams is going to be a guy that going to be a game changer. Certainly not enough of a game changer to give up a young promising C for.

And what makes you think that McGee is more likely to be a game-changer than Williams? McGee is certainly not going to be a star offensively. McGee will probably never develop the basketball smarts to be a true gamechanger defensively. I'm sounding like a broken record, but I'm just getting the same feel about the McGee debates here as I got when I was reading the Warriors talk about Anthony Randolph. Every year, Randolph was supposed to "put it together", and every year, he didn't. I think Williams is way more likely to be that second star than anyone we can get at #6, or anyone we have on the roster.

Also, from what I can tell, the "Derrick Williams is bad on defense" idea is mostly a myth. There were games where he didn't put out much effort on that end (just like any high-usage college player), but it seems like his skillset and physical profile has people comparing him to Beasley, when they are two completely different players. And Derrick Williams meh-ish height for a PF isn't so relevant, because his length is just fine.

"There where games where he didn't put out much effort on that end"

I'd disagree. I'd say the majority of the time he didn't put forth much effort. That's troubling. He didn't rebound particularly well for a PF. That's troubling. Like I said, I like him as a prospect, I'm just not in love with him. I think he'll be better than Beasley. Williams might even make an all-star game or two in his career. But I don't see him as a top 20 player in the league. I don't see him as an ideal or viable #1 option. Unless we have LeBron & Wade defending on the perimeter, you need length & guys who can challenge/deter shots in the paint. McGee can provide that (and he did improve his defensive awareness as the season went on), Williams can't provide that.

BTW, if there's any guy we should take a flier on (like we did with Yi this past season), it's Anthony Randolph.

[LyricalRico]

More draft day madness!

Wizards trade: Lewis, McGee, 6+18
Wizards receive: 2, Jefferson, Posey, and Jones

Wolves trade: Pekovic and 2+20
Wolves receive: McGee and 12+18

Jazz trade: Jefferson, Milsap, and 12
Jazz receive: Granger, Pekovic, Rush and 6

Pacers trade: Granger, Posey, Jones, and Rush
Pacers receive: Milsap, Lewis, and 20

TRADE ID 5899576

Why for Indy? They get their PF and open up a spot for Paul George. They do take on some salary, but they would be counting on the amnesty provision.

Hibbert/Vucevic(#20?)
Milsap/Hansbrough
George/Lewis
Thompson(#15?)/FA
Collison/Price

Why for Utah? They remake their roster and trade up for Jimmer.

Kanter(#3)/Pekovic
Favors/FA
Heyward/Rush
Miles/Bell
Harris/Jimmer(#6) - at least at first

Why for Minny? They trade down to get McGee. Is he worth 10 spots in this draft?

McGee/Darko/Donut(#18?) - probably stashed overseas
Love/Randolph
Beasley/Johnson
Selby(#12)?/Webster
Ridnour/Rubio/Flynn

Why for Washington? We move up to get our guy DWill, get a post scorer, and help our cap in one feel swoop.

Jefferson/Seraphin
Blatche/Booker
Williams/Posey
Young/Crawford/Jones
Wall/FA

Not sure if everybody goes for it, but the final product for the Wiz is an improvement IMO.

[mhd]

My latest:

Edit postDelete postReport this postReply with quoteWas/Min/Cha: Wiz move to #2, Beasley to Bobcats
by mhd on Thu Jun 16, 2011 10:07 pm

Wiz trade:
1) #6
2) McGee
for:
1) #2
2) #9

Min trades:
1) #2
2) Tolliver
3) Beasley
for:
1) #6
2) Stephen Jackson
3) McGee

Bobcats trade:
1) Stephen Jackson
2) #9
for:
1) Beasley
2) Tolliver

MOCK DRAFT
1) Cle-Irving
2) Was (from Min)-Derrick Williams
3) Utah-Knight
4) Cle-Kanter
5) Tor-Walker
6) Min-Jonas V.
7) Sac-Fredette
8) Det-Vessley
9) Wiz (from Cha)-Biyombo
10) Bucks-Klay Thompson
11) GSW-Macus Morris
12) Utah-Leanord
13) Suns-Triston Thompson
14) Houston-Singleton
15) Pacers-Brooks
16) 76ers-Faried
17) Knicks-Markief Morris
18) Wiz-Motiejunas
19) Cha-Vujavic
20) Min-Burks

NEW LINEUPS:
Wiz:
PG: Wall/Crawford
SG: Young/Crawford
SF: Williams/Evans
PF: Booker/Motiejunas
C: Blatche/Biyombo/Seraphin

Min:
PG: Rubio/Ridnour/Flynn
SG: Jackson/Burks/Ellington
SF: Johnson/Webster
PF: Love/Randolph
C: McGee/Jonas V/Darko

Cha:
PG: Augustine/Livingston
SG: Henderson/Caroll
SF: Beasley/Diaw
PF: Thomas/Najera
C: Kwame/Vujavic

WHY FOR THE WIZ?
1) They get a running mate for Wall in Derrick Williams.

WHY FOR THE T'Wolves?
1) They get a needed athletic center to pair with Love, and still get the 6th pick. They also get a needed vet scorer in SJax. Considering they don't have their 1st rounder for 2012, they want to win right away. SJax's deal only runs for 2 more years, so his contract is not burdensome. They balance out their roster with this move as well.

WHY FOR THE BOBCATS?
1) They save money by unloading SJAX for Beasley, while getting younger. Beasley will outperform anyone they pick at #9. Moreover, he'll be given the freedom to be the clear cut #1 scorer for the team.

[LyricalRico]

^ As I said on the trade board, I think CHA needs more. I don't think Beasley is worth Jackson+9, regardless of what stats he put up on a losing team. Maybe send Johnson to Charlotte? But then maybe Minny gives up too much.

[Silvie Lysandra]

I'd disagree. I'd say the majority of the time he didn't put forth much effort. That's troubling. He didn't rebound particularly well for a PF.

I think that's perception on the first point. Williams got a decent # of boards despite not being fundamentally sound at all, so I don't think that's a horrible deal.

If he can get 8-9 per 36, that's fine.

That's troubling. Like I said, I like him as a prospect, I'm just not in love with him. I think he'll be better than Beasley. Williams might even make an all-star game or two in his career.

Imo, that's all we need from him. And I think his upside is higher than that - if you use David West as a comparison, David West was a consistent 20 PER player (even without CP3) and Williams has WAY more upside than West.

But I don't see him as a top 20 player in the league. I don't see him as an ideal or viable #1 option.

Again, we don't need him to be. Dirk didn't have any other top 20 players on his team. The Celtics arguably didn't have any top 20 players in 2008. You can win with one superstar (Wall) with a deep, well balanced team.

If he can become a top 10 player at his position, averaging say, 20/9 alongside Wall, then we're good.

Unless we have LeBron & Wade defending on the perimeter, you need length & guys who can challenge/deter shots in the paint. McGee can provide that (and he did improve his defensive awareness as the season went on), Williams can't provide that.

You also need a legitimate #2 option. Not a superstar #2 option, but a legitimate one. McGee can't provide that; he didn't become efficient offensively until his usage dropped 4 percentage points. Williams CAN provide that.

You can get length in free agency/trade. You can get height in free agency/trade. It's harder to find that #2 there, and often times teams go bust trying to find that option in FA.

[Dark Faze]

Rumors of phx trying to get Williams for something as cheap as the #12 and Gortat.

I'll hate our front office forever if we miss this.

[Wizardspride]

Rumors of phx trying to get Williams for something as cheap as the #12 and Gortat.

I'll hate our front office forever if we miss this.

I'll hate our front office forever if we DON'T miss this.

[LyricalRico]

^ Shoot, if that PHX offer interests Minny, we can easily counter with McGee+18. No need to even bring up the 6. If we can get Wiliams at 2 and Kanter at 6...

[Dark Faze]

I don't think we'll need to include the #6 at this point...looking forward to draft day.

[Wizardspride]

^ Shoot, if that PHX offer interests Minny, we can easily counter with McGee+18. No need to even bring up the 6. If we can get Wiliams at 2 and Kanter at 6...

I don't want to trade McGee but I would be down if your scenario came to fruition.

[Silvie Lysandra]

#18 + Crawford + McGee should get it done in our case. Maybe we toss in a lottery protected 1st somewhere down the line?

[7-Day Dray]

Vesely to work out for five teams (including Wiz) Sunday

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2011/6/16/2 ... umors-2011

If Kanter isn't available at #6, I'm fine with Vesely.

[Illuminaire]

#18 + Crawford + McGee should get it done in our case. Maybe we toss in a lottery protected 1st somewhere down the line?

I would love to play poker with you, Rev.

[Illuminaire]

Fun random board observation:

Everyone who likes Vesely at six is also a passionate Blatche supporter.

Make of that what you will.

[Jay81]

Milsap on the block

http://bit.ly/lUND1n

[Wizardspride]

Fun random board observation:

Everyone who likes Vesely at six is also a passionate Blatche supporter.

Make of that what you will.

Count me in that group.

[LyricalRico]

Milsap on the block

http://bit.ly/lUND1n

Milsap+Harris for Granger+filler? Not sure how we can get in on that, but it would seem to work for both teams.

[TGW]

I would do Milsapp and #12 for the 6. Take Morris at #12 and maybe Thompson or Burks at #18.

[Hoopalotta]

I would do Milsapp and #12 for the 6. Take Morris at #12 and maybe Thompson or Burks at #18.

Realistically, we'd have to send some salary out to get it done on draft night and the only thing we have to come close to matching is Blatche and one of our 2010 rookies.

The problem is that, at least according to what we know as outsiders, there are still scenarios with the CBA coming down where we wouldn't have enough 2012 cap space to absorb Milsap. If there's no rollbacks, the super-amnesty is in some way limited and the cap comes in at $55 million or so, we won't be able to swing it.

Hypothetically, it would be good value as a package, though if one of Valentine or Kanter fell I'd probably just rather stay put.

[verbal8]

I would do Milsapp and #12 for the 6. Take Morris at #12 and maybe Thompson or Burks at #18.

Realistically, we'd have to send some salary out to get it done on draft night and the only thing we have to come close to matching is Blatche and one of our 2010 rookies.

I wonder if a team like CLE or TOR with a TPE might go for that deal? Maybe they even send a small incentive to Utah.