Should Derrick Favors start at center next year?

Jazzfan12 · Post #1 » by **Jazzfan12** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 12:44 am

His standing reach of 9'2 is just about average for the top ten best centers in the league (Same as LMA, Bogut, and Chandler). He's stronger than most centers in the league, strong enough to stop Aldridge and Bogut I think and he's already way bigger than Chandler and Noah. He'll struggle to hold position against Dwight and Bynum, but who doesn't? He's the best help defending big on the team already arguably and has easily the highest potential of anyone on the team for help defense and the center position is about help defense. Center is a huge influence on defense whereas PF doesn't have as much influence on defense. Should he start at center?

gonzo · Post #2 » by **gonzo** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 1:48 am

Israel, China? Your call.

Hmmm.... not Turkey tho.

carrottop12 · Post #3 » by **carrottop12** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 4:54 am

Well, he's also a fabulous pick and roll defender because he can move his feet, so having someone his size who can people from turning the corner to get into the paint is a huge skill we would lose by keeping him in the paint.

I think Jefferson is a good enough shot blocker to intimidate people down low if our other big funnels them Into him correctly, plus I think favors is quick enough to recover from outside the paint to get back and be a shot blocker.

So no, I say keep him at pf and let all patrol the paint back and forward while favors does the more athletic switches in the high paint/shallow perimeter.

erudite23 · Post #4 » by **erudite23** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 6:18 am

To best honest, the PF and C positions have become much like the two wings these days: interchangeable. Against most teams you can go either/or. I think Derrick we will want Derrick on the more mobile of the other team's bigs because he can hedge the screen better, like Bat says, but that doesn't mean he'll be out of the paint an unable to help, either.

Long term, if both he and Kanter pan out, I see Kanter playing the power player on the other team and Favors playing the guy with athleticism. Very similar to the way that the Celtics used to deploy Perkins and KG.

Reckless · Post #5 » by **Reckless** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 8:12 am

Bat wrote:Well, he's also a fabulous pick and roll defender because he can move his feet, so having someone his size who can people from turning the corner to get into the paint is a huge skill we would lose by keeping him in the paint.

I think Jefferson is a good enough shot blocker to intimidate people down low if our other big funnels them Into him correctly, plus I think favors is quick enough to recover from outside the paint to get back and be a shot blocker.

So no, I say keep him at pf and let all patrol the paint back and forward while favors does the more athletic switches in the high paint/shallow perimeter.

agree 100% with this post, pf feels like his natural position, just let him beast there
i think he develops a nice mid-range game as well
imagine if he could develop a millsap shot, would be unstoppable

Jazzfan12 · Post #6 » by **Jazzfan12** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 1:10 pm

PF is nowhere near as important defensively as center and you cover a lot of pick-and-rolls at center as well, I don't see how that's wasting his talents at all, that's maximizing his talent for wins. At C, you have rotate well to stop players from entering the paint. Outside of Bargnani, Al does that worse than any player in the league.

The59Sound · Post #7 » by **The59Sound** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 1:26 pm

Jazzfan12 wrote:PF is nowhere near as important defensively as center and you cover a lot of pick-and-rolls at center as well, I don't see how that's wasting his talents at all, that's maximizing his talent for wins. At C, you have rotate well to stop players from entering the paint. Outside of Bargnani, Al does that worse than any player in the league.

You certainly don't cover as many at center. I'm with Bat and E. Put Favors on the opponent's more mobile big man on any given night. Think of it this way: would you rather have Favors guard Brendan Haywood down low, while Jefferson tries to contain Dirk and Jason Terry on the perimeter, or the reverse?

Jazzfan12 · Post #8 » by **Jazzfan12** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 1:35 pm

I would prefer Favors guarding Haywood, because one-on-one defense in the NBA is nearly irrelevant now.

The59Sound · Post #9 » by **The59Sound** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 1:43 pm

Jazzfan12 wrote:I would prefer Favors guarding Haywood, because one-on-one defense in the NBA is nearly irrelevant now.

Well, fair enough. I heartily disagree.

Post #10 » by **jazzfan1971** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 1:44 pm

Jefferson is a better center defender than PF IMHO.
Favors is as good of a PF defender as a center defender.

Why not maximize defense?

(can you imagine if Kanter is a plus defender? It's hard to imagine such a positive situation!)

Jazzfan12 · Post #11 » by **Jazzfan12** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 1:50 pm

Jefferson can't defend PFs, but you need your center to do a lot of things defensively that he just doesn't do at all. I wasn't really talking about Jefferson though. I would prefer the team start Millsap and eventually they'll start Kanter if he turns out and Favors should be the center in both of those situations as well.

Mail_Man123 · Post #12 » by **Mail_Man123** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 3:14 pm

I'm pretty sure the coaching staff knows what they are doing, they got their jobs for a reason. If they thought putting Favors at C and AJ at PF was the right move they would have at least tried it. The only time Favors will play C is when Millsap is in at PF and maybe when Kanter is in. IMO AJ reminds me alot of Horford, as they would both really thrive at PF if they played alongside a legit C, much like Gasol and Duncan.

But back to comparing Favors vs AJ at the C, like someone said the PF an C positions are pretty interchangeable anyway. On defense Favors will guard the more athletic big man and AJ will guard the more powerful/bigger big man. (He is 280lbs, vs Favors at 240)

and I have to disagree with jazzfan12 who said one on one defense is irrelevent. Look at the finals, when it was clutch time and dirk had the ball, it was haslem or bosh on him. One on One. Yes help defense was there, but for the most part they couldn't leave all those shooters open. Not to mention Man Defense is the primary type of D in the NBA. The Mavs won because they were one of the few teams to use the zone quite a bit, as it worked well vs the Heat. But most nights you can't play zone vs nba teams because everyone can hit an open J. Thats the reason college uses it alot more.

Jazzfan12 · Post #13 » by **Jazzfan12** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 3:22 pm

Tyson Chandler and Joakim Noah are two of the worst one-on-one post defenders in the league and their teams are consistently great defensively and it's because of their help defense. Favors is stronger than Al as well. And the team has had the worst defensive scheme in the NBA the last few years so I don't think it's that outlandish to call out defensive decisions. Favors needs to develop more on help defense than man defense as well and playing center will help that since he'll have fewer man defense responsibilities.

Mail_Man123 · Post #14 » by **Mail_Man123** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 3:40 pm

That is true about Noah and Chandler. But Favors is not that type of player. AJ is better suited, he did avg nearly 2 blocks a game.

Like you said, favors needs to develop his help defense, as well as the rest of his game. Maybe in a few years he will be capable of starting at C. However since he needs to still develop, he should not start right away. As of right now, AJ is the better C. Favors can and will play C when Aj is out. He will get plenty of mins at C. However starting him at C wouldn't be the best move.

In a few years I can see AJ being let go, and Favors being our starting C with Kanter at PF. But for right now, I think you have to start AJ at C

DBJAZZ2 · Post #15 » by **DBJAZZ2** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 5:19 pm

Opposing teams realize that Favors is the better defender on the pick and roll, so a huge majority of the time we will see them putting whoever Al is guarding in the pick and roll. They are gonna consistently try and exploit that weakness. And if that's the case Favors will be there to protect he paint.

So like it has been mentioned here, it makes no difference really what position you call them because on D Al will have to be better defending on the perimeter a lot of the time, and Favors will have to learn to defend the paint without fouling. For the Jazz to become better defensively both guys have to improve in areas they will be challenged most often.

The59Sound · Post #16 » by **The59Sound** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 5:28 pm

DBJAZZ2 wrote:Opposing teams realize that Favors is the better defender on the pick and roll, so a huge majority of the time we will see them putting whoever Al is guarding in the pick and roll. They are gonna consistently try and exploit that weakness. And if that's the case Favors will be there to protect he paint.

So like it has been mentioned here, it makes no difference really what position you call them because on D Al will have to be better defending on the perimeter a lot of the time, and Favors will have to learn to defend the paint without fouling. For the Jazz to become better defensively both guys have to improve in areas they will be challenged most often.

That may be true in some situations, but if you're talking about a star or high-quality PF, they're not going to go away from them just to exploit Jefferson. Using the Dallas example again, would the Mavs opt to run non-stop pick-and-rolls with Haywood instead of Dirk, just because Jefferson's on him?

Your theory could certainly play out against some teams (e.g. the Lakers), but I'm not sure it makes sense as a general rule.

Post #17 » by **StocktonShorts** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 5:36 pm

After we trade Al Jefferson then I'd like to see either Favors or Kanter start at center.

Mail_Man123 · Post #18 » by **Mail_Man123** » Tue Jul 5, 2011 5:53 pm

The59Sound wrote:
DBJAZZ2 wrote:Opposing teams realize that Favors is the better defender on the pick and roll, so a huge majority of the time we will see them putting whoever Al is guarding in the pick and roll. They are gonna consistently try and exploit that weakness. And if that's the case Favors will be there to protect he paint.

So like it has been mentioned here, it makes no difference really what position you call them because on D Al will have to be better defending on the perimeter a lot of the time, and Favors will have to learn to defend the paint without fouling. For the Jazz to become better defensively both guys have to improve in areas they will be challenged most often.

That may be true in some situations, but if you're talking about a star or high-quality PF, they're not going to go away from them just to exploit Jefferson. Using the Dallas example again, would the Mavs opt to run non-stop pick-and-rolls with Haywood instead of Dirk, just because Jefferson's on him?

Your theory could certainly play out against some teams (e.g. the Lakers), but I'm not sure it makes sense as a general rule.

+1