OT: Question on Moderation

[triple_threat]

Mods are like referees.

Most do a decent job, but they're just meant to be hated.

Then you have your occassional Joey Crawford type mod who goes on a power trip.

[Don Draper]

I don't post often, nor do I frequent boards outside of the Raptors and Blue Jays forums here, but I do take issue with the fact that I feel certain mods seem to make up rules as they go along.

One I've noticed lately is with Little Ozzy. On more then one occasion, recently, he has warned users about not posting in English. These posters weren't insulting each other, and AS FAR AS I KNOW, there is no rule that suggests you can only post in the English language. I could understand if their use of a foreign language (is there such a thing as a 'foreign language' on the internet anyway?) was derailing the thread, but of the instances I know of- they were merely two posters from a similar location trying to understand each other without the difficulty of relying on their rudimentary understanding of the english language.

As a board, the Raptors have a wide variety of users from places like Lithuania and Italy, among others. There's no reason to scold these individuals when the action of simply communicating is absolutely harmless.

Why would you post on an English speaking board in another language?

You people can't be this silly. lol

[Jay_Hawk]

I don't post often, nor do I frequent boards outside of the Raptors and Blue Jays forums here, but I do take issue with the fact that I feel certain mods seem to make up rules as they go along.

One I've noticed lately is with Little Ozzy. On more then one occasion, recently, he has warned users about not posting in English. These posters weren't insulting each other, and AS FAR AS I KNOW, there is no rule that suggests you can only post in the English language. I could understand if their use of a foreign language (is there such a thing as a 'foreign language' on the internet anyway?) was derailing the thread, but of the instances I know of- they were merely two posters from a similar location trying to understand each other without the difficulty of relying on their rudimentary understanding of the english language.

As a board, the Raptors have a wide variety of users from places like Lithuania and Italy, among others. There's no reason to scold these individuals when the action of simply communicating is absolutely harmless.

Why would you post on an English speaking board in another language?

You people can't be this silly. lol

Your not understanding the circumstance. It involved two posters from Lithuania- both speaking English for the majority of the thread- when one couldn't properly communicate to the other, he elected to post his message in Lithuanian so the other could understand. It was simply one post, and didn't derail the thread in any way whatsoever.

And as for the line "You people can't be this silly. lol", that's a very antagonistic line. In situations such as this, maybe you shouldn't use such combative language. That's not the best way to debate, especially when you obviously don't know the situation I was referring to.

[Jay_Hawk]

I'm not trying to make a big deal out of it, for what its worth I find this forum to be incredible informative and by far one of the best I've ever been a member of. But in certain cases, I do feel like there's a tendency for some to over-moderate.

In this instance, there was no need for the Lithuanian poster to be warned. His post was harmless, wasn't repeated, and only existed so he could better communicate with a countrymen. I have no issue with that, and unless it completely took the thread in a different angle, why would anyone else?

[YogiStewart]

I'm not trying to make a big deal out of it, for what its worth I find this forum to be incredible informative and by far one of the best I've ever been a member of. But in certain cases, I do feel like there's a tendency for some to over-moderate.

In this instance, there was no need for the Lithuanian poster to be warned. His post was harmless, wasn't repeated, and only existed so he could better communicate with a countrymen. I have no issue with that, and unless it completely took the thread in a different angle, why would anyone else?

We had a past instance where a poster posted insults in Italian -some of them really racist.
Its uncalled for.
We're not here to input each post into Babel. Same idea of posting gifs to get around the swear filter.

This is an english website and in order to properly moderage activities, posts should be in English. There is little to no reason why someone should be posting in any languqge othr tha. English, since our discussions are all in english.

To debate this quite silly. There is little to no value added by having posts that are not in english.

[Evermore]

Sept 2006 and Dec 2006, you started threads that complained about moderation.

Seems like you can't get over the fact that this site is moderated.

Dude, go to Chowhound. Its my favourite example of anovermoderated oards. Threads andposts are always disappearing wih zero explanation. Here, we take the time to explain why we do what we do so that posting can be as seemless and crap free as possible.

I've seen threads locked without an explanation...

And in some instances...the Mod felt the need to take a parting shot with some kind of insult


Not always...

But it definitely happens


I'm still waiting for an explanation about why my JFK thread was locked...

Honestly, I think it was locked because the Mod(s) has a personal issue with me

[from24ft]

BTW Ozzy,

I read a lot of personal resentment from your post. How should I interpret that?

(should I watch my back?)

You really need to stop with the Mr. Innocent routine, and with the number of warnings you have on your profile you likely should watch your back. Just a matter of time before I slip.

You keep talking about challenging the Mods and their opinions, the warnings you have received have nothing to do with our opinion of you. Your last warning was for telling someone to F off, and no matter how right you feel you are in doing so to win a debate it's against the terms of service and a warn-able offense.

People have been banned for much less. Show some respect to the other members, you are not above the rules. Treat others like you want to be treated and you'll never hear from a Mod again.

Ozzy,

If it happens it happens, what am I going to do? Worry about it? If you have it on your agenda it probably will happen.

As for challenging mods and their opinions, I was under the impression that all users were equal when talking about sports. If I don't like your opinion, I will challenge it, or does having the mod tag under your name make you some power user that others must tippy toe around?

That was my point, I figure the terms of respect work both ways, from mods to users as well. If you have a goofy theory on sports I am well within my rights to challenge your opinion and debate you. This is a discussion board, after all.


I can't ban you, you can ban me, but you will have damn hard time winning a debate with me, unless you take the easy way out.

EDIT: I remember back in the day you were applying for some radio gig, I voted for you multiple times... you seemed fine then, when you become a mod. I observed a change in your strut.

[LittleOzzy]

BTW Ozzy,

I read a lot of personal resentment from your post. How should I interpret that?

(should I watch my back?)

You really need to stop with the Mr. Innocent routine, and with the number of warnings you have on your profile you likely should watch your back. Just a matter of time before I slip.

You keep talking about challenging the Mods and their opinions, the warnings you have received have nothing to do with our opinion of you. Your last warning was for telling someone to F off, and no matter how right you feel you are in doing so to win a debate it's against the terms of service and a warn-able offense.

People have been banned for much less. Show some respect to the other members, you are not above the rules. Treat others like you want to be treated and you'll never hear from a Mod again.

Ozzy,

If it happens it happens, what am I going to do? Worry about it? If you have it on your agenda it probably will happen.

As for challenging mods and their opinions, I was under the impression that all users were equal when talking about sports. If I don't like your opinion, I will challenge it, or does having the mod tag under your name make you some power user that others must tippy toe around?

That was my point, I figure the terms of respect work both ways, from mods to users as well. If you have a goofy theory on sports I am well within my rights to challenge your opinion and debate you. This is a discussion board, after all.


I can't ban you, you can ban me, but you will have damn hard time winning a debate with me, unless you take the easy way out.

EDIT: I remember back in the day you were applying for some radio gig, I voted for you multiple times... you seemed fine then, when you become a mod. I observed a change in your strut.

I think we crossed wires somewhere here, you can challenge the opinion of a Mod when it comes to sports or any other discussed topic here at any time. When it comes to a debate I'm fine with being proven wrong.

What you can not challenge us on is the basic rules of this forum which I felt this thread was originally about. You talked about rules needing to be changed and that you should have the freedom to swear towards someone and talk down to them. Those things can not happen, you may consider that censorship, but it's not. It's just real world respect.

Also to add the people talking about speaking in English on this forum, I think Yogi covered the reasoning just fine, I just wanted to add those users were not warned, nothing was put on their profile about it. I just reminded them that this is an English speaking website.

If RealGM was open to all languages I don't think anyone would be able to follow a thread. It would become way too confusing.

[from24ft]

Thanks Ozzy,


I agree, I should have not told the user to preform coitus on himself. I have a dirty mouth in life, those that know me, don't take it personally, but that may get lost in translation on this forum.

Maybe next time, I will just suggest a vacation spot.

[blkout]

I agree, I should have not told the user to preform coitus on himself.

[Courtside]

I don't lie, if you don't get that, then you have not been reading. My problem is that I am too honest.

Easy to say in the internet, that's the point. If everyone is taken at face value, then we believe Messiah's tripe about modeling, Neeraaj's relationship with Beyonce, Harry's repeated luck with port stars, etc... The internet is full of people who either lie or exaggerate.

...and yes you crossed the line, who cares what and who I am. Debate my words, which you could not do, without passing judgment on me.

What line? There was no debating because you proved to be a self important douchebag with your posturing about how I care so much about you, you teaching me lessons, etc... You exposed yourself as completely unwilling to hear and instead twisted things I said into entirely different things. You excuse your flawed arguments as "I was just joking" or going off on some other tangent, a common tactic when someone's argument is exposed as flawed.

(and just so you know you got rolled in the labour thread, you resorted to the personal)

No - I walked away when you kept throwing out even more incomplete numbers and talking out your ass about teaching me lessons about black and white, suckers and whatnot. That's not rational debate and it's certainly intended to be insulting, so don't sit there and play innocent. You dished it but couldn't take it back.

EDIT: that sounded cold, (my apologies) I enjoyed the debate

Cold, huh? lol. You don't debate - you shout people down and think smothering the thread with half-truth info is somehow 'winning'. All I said was that the numbers you were posting were incomplete and could not be used to support what you were saying. You want to drag me further into a debate by posting even more half-complete numbers and you think I got rolled? Whatever makes you feel better, man.

[from24ft]

I(and just so you know you got rolled in the labour thread, you resorted to the personal)

No - I walked away when you kept throwing out even more incomplete numbers and talking out your ass about teaching me lessons about black and white, suckers and whatnot. That's not rational debate and it's certainly intended to be insulting, so don't sit there and play innocent. You dished it but couldn't take it back.

LOL,

You walked away because you did not have any numbers of your own. The numbers I posted are straight forward, I posted the same assessment from multiple sources.

...and I kept coming up with more, but you kept muddying up the waters and coming up with limp stuff. Not understanding, that the only person that thinks its black and white is you. You are the one who used those words.... and you know from what? A quote that you misunderstood. Check the debate. Reread it.

Stop acting smug, when your words give away your confusion. I can break down that debate for you if you wish? Re-read it and you may see that you were just not all that bright in that exchange.

...and if you want to contest, contest it. Not a problem, but you just turned it personal and hence why I have very little respect for you.

You don't debate - you shout people down and think smothering the thread with half-truth info is somehow 'winning'. All I said was that the numbers you were posting were incomplete and could not be used to support what you were saying. You want to drag me further into a debate by posting even more half-complete numbers and you think I got rolled? Whatever makes you feel better, man.

There was nothing incomplete about those aggregate numbers. You show a serious lack of basic understanding, analysis and education. If you do some reading about what is happening you may see that my opinion is not unique and shared by those that have analyzed the situation based on numbers. I also posted a historic comparison. I can flood the crap out of relagm with sources, but I figured that the 15 I posted would be good enough for you, after all its a basketball board. You can't just watch sitcoms all day and come to realgm, complaining that your lens sees black and white, and yes its in the eye of the beholder.

BTW, its okay to say you don't understand something, instead of acting smug and challenging a user for his/her credentials, than going weak at the knees when provided it and asked for your own. I still think those kinds of tactics should be a clear violation of realgm policy. Calling someone out for their personal info is not cool. Kids come to this board, and no one needs to tell you their age. It's part of policy. Debate the words, if the words were so weak, it's an easy counter without asking for age and experience. After all, if your opinion is so superior its easy to show the contrast without resorting to the personal, so nothing you say makes sense, and you are only coming back to save face.

[LLcoleJ]

I didn't demand anything, I just asked for opinions... and I was content after Kohanz posted, and that would have been it.

...but I felt the post by Ozzy was personal, and hence me taking it up a notch.


At the same time, I respect your opinion, and I don't want to make this a personal discussion, however I do feel strongly about polarity issues and bias in moderation. I don't respond well to the heavy hand, you will have a problem if you try to intimidate me.

The rules of the board are to respect others and sometimes I feel moderation crosses the lines of respect.

Am I allowed to argue against MOD X's opinion, without worrying about him having a magnifying glass because I showed him up in an unrelated thread?


EDIT: I am cool with not being liked, I learned long ago to stop worrying about what others think... I don't owe anyone anything... I just want to be me, and I feel I have a perspective to add. I just don't want to keep looking over my shoulder because I told the officer he has no right to search my car. I think some mods are cool with ethics, and others respond with heavy hand when challenged.

Aren't you, in fact responding with a heavy hand when challenged?

[Howard Mass]

I appreciate all of the Moderators who have been answering questions.

For the record, our Moderators are great and are always fair with users. They have my full support.

It's always great when issues can be resolved.