Series thread: Orioles @ Blue Jays (Sept 9 - 11)

[hyper316]

I don't care where you put them on any depth chart. None of those guys have their rotation spots guaranteed and all of them have an opportunity to pitch as starters for this organization in 2012. Even if McGowan is 6th in line right now, there are always injuries and poor performance that could change that.

McGowan is on the outside looking in, he might get a spot if someone else falters like you said with injuries or poor performance. But what if things proceed well in ST and McGowan is the odd man out, what to do with him? Long reliever or closer? I'm just thinking of alternate scenarios if things dont work out for mcgowan. I'm not the only discussing this as it has on the forum and on bluejays broadcast. AA intends to give every opportunity to mcgowan as a starter, but we shall see

time spent on testing mcgowan in the rotation is time away from other pitchers higher on the totem pole.

This doesn't even make sense. With his stuff, McGowan's ceiling is just as high as anybody else's. And you do know what ST games are for, right?

i dont disagree with his ceiling. again i think he has a good variety of pitches, good fastball, getting lots of SOs. but his whip is not outstanding. to me ST games is for young pitchers to audition for a starting role. This year, Cecil was pretty much a guaranteed a spot with his performance the previous year. He had a shaky year, but not a rookie pitcher than i see would need to audition for a spot. so that leaves 2 other spots between alvarez, drabek, and mcgowan.

This has nothing to do with contending (although if you're writing off 2012 for some reason, that's even more of a reason to go with McGowan for an extended period of time). The Blue Jays owe it to themselves to find out what they still have in Dustin McGowan and I have no doubt they'll give him every opportunity here.

They're not moving him to the bullpen based on one meaningless game against Baltimore.

i wrote off 2012 because reading the extra wildcard may not be implemented next year even if Astros mvoe to AL next year.

again, i'm not only basing the move to bullpen from today's performance, but based on rotation spots. without today's performance, anyone could tell there would be a fight for a starter spot

Romero
Morrow
Cecil
Alvarez
Drabek
McGowan
FA (Wilson/Darvish)

at least 1 or up to 2 listed above will not be in a 5-man rotation unless they bump up to 6-man.

[Randle McMurphy]

AA intends to give every opportunity to mcgowan as a starter, but we shall see

If you acknowledge that fact, there's nothing left to discuss here. McGowan will have an opportunity to start for the Jays. As he should.

[hyper316]

The Jays did not spend all these years continuing to pay McGowan, and paying for his surgeries, just to write him off after one start, where he walked some guys, but didn't get hit hard at all. He's had 30-40 quality MLB starts in his career and needs the benefit of the doubt.

He's going to get a couple of more chances this year, and all of spring training next year to prove himself.

I think only Romero and Morrow are guaranteed spots next year. Alvarez has looked awesome so far, but Halladay had that great first look then one of the worst stretches by a MLB pitcher ever the year after. I would not be surprised to find out Cecil is hiding an injury either to explain his inconsistent velocity.

i dont get the argument for paying his surgeries. he got hurt playing as a player, the team/insurance should pay for his injuries. much like jobsite injury for any worker. were the bluejays not going to pay for the shoulder surgeries if they decided not to give mcgowan a second look? maybe one of the multiple surgeries was only needed if he was going to continue as a baseball pitcher. how much would that cost? $500k? plus he was making less than $500k per year i think in the past years. $2 mill + change to give a second look at a previous 1st rd draft b the club is not a high risk move even if it doesn't pan out.

[hyper316]

AA intends to give every opportunity to mcgowan as a starter, but we shall see

If you acknowledge that fact, there's nothing left to discuss here. McGowan will have an opportunity to start for the Jays. As he should.

Why does the discussion end there? McGowan getting a spot over Alvarez or Drabek would send either of them down to AAA. Alvarez is seeing early success in the MLB and it would suck to see drabek an extra year in AAA. drabek has his control issue and i hope he fixes it by ST.

the problem is not solely with mcgowan, but taking time away from others in the team. with age and risk involved, it really take some quick improvement to reach his previous form quick

[Michael Bradley]

McGowan didn't pitch at all in 2009 and 2010. This is his first season of pro pitching since 2008, and he only threw 35 innings in the minors before being called up to face the Red Sox in relief and now start against the Orioles. Forty innings in three years. Let's wait a bit before saying he is ahead or behind Drabek and Alvarez on the depth chart. He is a longs ways away from being ready to be evaluated.

Another thing to keep in mind is AA is very strict about value. He has used players far beyond their usefulness to see if they had any value both as players or trade assets (Reyes, Rivera, Patterson, etc). I'm willing to bet after three years of paying McGowan to rehab, he would rather have McGowan start in 2012 to see if he has anything left at age 30. Alvarez and Drabek still have options.

[Kurtz]

Bit of a pointless argument, given that we'll need at least 7 pitchers capable of starting going into a season. Given that two of those guys will be Drabek and Cecil, and another a rookie, we may need as many as 8 or 9. As of now, we're not nearly there, so counting out Dustin is laughable.

Spring Training will decide who starts in the majors and who starts in the minors, but Dustin is guaranteed to be in the starter's mix.