Who do you support?

[TheDrunkenOak]

Seriously, if they wanted to get a deal done, they should go 55%/45% BRI (in favour of the players), and guaranteed contracts are 3-4-5 years (with the 5th option being assigned to a franchise player or what Stern said in an interview recently). Lower the Cap number teams can go over and increase the amount that needs to be paid once you go over the tax. Also reduce the players salaries by a bit (not sure what's considered a bit).

That way, players still get a good percentage of revenue if the league is doing great, while owners are discouraged to overspend (and if they do, they won't be tied to a contract for too long).

If those are the glaring issues they're stuck on, I can't see why they won't agree on the BRI favouring players, while the contract length/max. amount favouring the owners. Seems to be a good compromise.

Agreed. But it looks like, after reading this ( http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_ ... fell-apart ) that the players traded the BRI for no hardcap, i'm guessing that's where the 50/50 first came up, but now the players reneged and is only willing to move down to 53/47 BRI split.

It doesn't look good for the season.

[bballsparkin]

I almost hope the idiots miss out on the whole year. Screw them all. Raptors are going to suck anyway. I got the NCAA and hockey. I don't need the NBA. They'll come back eventually anyway. Sure it sucks for the everyday worker. But this is much bigger than them. It's a millionaire thing going on.

[whoknows]

One particularly interesting aspect of Simmons' piece was his assessment of the players' intelligence.

"I don't trust the players' side to make the right choices, because they are saddled with limited intellectual capital. (Sorry, it's true.)," wrote Simmons.

---On Friday, he pointed out that Paul Pierce, Kobe Bryant and Kevin Garnett, who did some negotiating for the union, had a combined three years of college.

Read more: http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/21 ... z1bQFsHIJE



Read more: http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/21 ... z1bQFcblM2

[J-Roc]

I support those go with logic and rationale..Which side is that?

Both.

[duppyy]

You can't compare a banker to a bball player.

[Indeed]

You can't compare a banker to a bball player.

Real estate? Even garbage collectors (ok, antique collectors) could make millions if you count the top 500 ones.

The difference is, do they last for their career. Can an antique collector make that much consistently over his life span.

[40 Guzzle]

[GoRapstheoriginal]

I know there is a the Labour discussion thread, but I'm interested to see where posters stand on the issue so far. The poll is set up so you can change your vote. I think it would be interesting to see where allegiances lie now, 3 months from now, 6 months, etc.

Lock if you think it's stupid. lol.

Us the fans, were the real casualty in all this neither side gives a damn about us no matter what they say! !

[J Dilla]

This.
I support the players.

Out of all the Millions of Basketball players in the world these are the top 400.

What is the average salary of the top 400 movie actors/actresses
What is the average salary of the top 400 lawyers
What is the average salary of the top 400 doctors
What is the average salary of the top 400 accountants

For example, John Stumpf (Wells Fargo) made 18m as a banker in 2010. That being near the top for that profession, and not too far from the NBA's top earners, we can project out. The 400th banker will be making much, much more than the $473k that is the nba league minimum. The average salary at Goldman is 900k, and that's just one bank (with thousands of employees).

But don't forget. The Banker works his ass off, doing over 80 hours a week. The Doctor, can get called up any minute and has to show up that minute, and works more than the Banker. Same with accountants and Lawyers, the top earners don't get paid by sitting on their asses. They have to deal with a lot of **** Athletes and Actors wouldn't last a minute doing these jobs.

The league minimum player is getting paid 473K, sitting his ass on the bench tweeting on his blackberry.

[Ponchos]

But don't forget. The Banker works his ass off, doing over 80 hours a week. The Doctor, can get called up any minute and has to show up that minute, and works more than the Banker. Same with accountants and Lawyers, the top earners don't get paid by sitting on their asses. They have to deal with a lot of **** Athletes and Actors wouldn't last a minute doing these jobs.

The league minimum player is getting paid 473K, sitting his ass on the bench tweeting on his blackberry.

And here you have it folks, professional athletes don't work.

They got to be top 400 in a global sport by super blackness powers.

[Kordic27]

But don't forget. The Banker works his ass off, doing over 80 hours a week. The Doctor, can get called up any minute and has to show up that minute, and works more than the Banker. Same with accountants and Lawyers, the top earners don't get paid by sitting on their asses. They have to deal with a lot of **** Athletes and Actors wouldn't last a minute doing these jobs.

The league minimum player is getting paid 473K, sitting his ass on the bench tweeting on his blackberry.

And here you have it folks, professional athletes don't work.

They got to be top 400 in a global sport by super blackness powers.

In fairness, they got to be top 400 through a combination of genetics (or, if you prefer, super blackness powers) and also through work. But the 'work', is work that many many people would prefer to do over their actual jobs.

[Ponchos]

But don't forget. The Banker works his ass off, doing over 80 hours a week. The Doctor, can get called up any minute and has to show up that minute, and works more than the Banker. Same with accountants and Lawyers, the top earners don't get paid by sitting on their asses. They have to deal with a lot of **** Athletes and Actors wouldn't last a minute doing these jobs.

The league minimum player is getting paid 473K, sitting his ass on the bench tweeting on his blackberry.

And here you have it folks, professional athletes don't work.

They got to be top 400 in a global sport by super blackness powers.

In fairness, they got to be top 400 through a combination of genetics (or, if you prefer, super blackness powers) and also through work. But the 'work', is work that many many people would prefer to do over their actual jobs.

If you think that top bankers/lawyers CEO's don't have a genetic advantage you're fooling yourself. Some people are born smart, some people are born stupid.

It's easy to sit back and say that they would love to do the type of "work" that Kobe does, but I guarantee that most people wouldn't be able to hack his training schedule for a week, let alone 25 years.

[Indeed]

And here you have it folks, professional athletes don't work.

They got to be top 400 in a global sport by super blackness powers.

In fairness, they got to be top 400 through a combination of genetics (or, if you prefer, super blackness powers) and also through work. But the 'work', is work that many many people would prefer to do over their actual jobs.

If you don't think that top bankers/lawyers CEO's don't have a genetic advantage you're fooling yourself. Some people are born smart, some people are born stupid.

It's easy to sit back and say that they would love to do the type of "work" that Kobe does, but I guarantee that most people wouldn't be able to hack his training schedule for a week, let alone 25 years.

I think NBA players need to travel as well. They play at night, play on holiday, play on Sunday (I go to church, so its a big deal for me), and etc.

Perhaps people are more frustrated how they spend their money rather than how much they made.

[40 Guzzle]

One thing that bewilders me are the people who buck the poll and choose the non-listed third option..

"Us" or the "Fans"

like we are some homogenous conglomerate of similar parts, which we are not

I have friends who have been Laker fans from the jump, and it's been obvious to me since the Raptors' inception (and even more evident during this lockout) that their vison of the ideal NBA is completely divergent from mine

Even reading this thread shows that were practically just as divided as the owners & the union

so choosing "The Fans" is a bit of a cop out to me. We are NOT all losing, trust me.

Depending on how this thing goes, certain fanbases will be much more pleased than others

Me personally, if the owners move off of their hardline stance I will go back to strictly following college ball, at least then I'll know what the deal is when the Tarheels play a non-conference game against UNC-Asheville:

A completely one-sided thrashing of a smaller school whose program needs some extra cash by purposely scheduling a televised game against a much superior opponent

At least they don't act phony & dress it up to be something that it isn't

[Kordic27]

Sorry, Ponchos and Indeed, are you guys saying that you think that basketball players are worth the money they're paid because of the amount of work they put into becoming and being basketball players? When compared to people who are at the top of their fields in other jobs? Really?

I mean, I could understand the argument that basketball players are worth their salaries because of the revenue that comes into the league, but effort and work? really? C'mon.

[Ponchos]

Sorry, Ponchos and Indeed, are you guys saying that you think that basketball players are worth the money they're paid because of the amount of work they put into becoming and being basketball players? When compared to people who are at the top of their fields in other jobs? Really?

I mean, I could understand the argument that basketball players are worth their salaries because of the revenue that comes into the league, but effort and work? really? C'mon.

So your argument is Really and C'mon?

If being a professional athlete is so easy, why aren't you one? Are you shorter than the shortest person ever in the NBA? Are you the less athletic than the least athletic person ever in the NBA?

You think these guys became the best in the world by doing no work? Really? C'mon.

[J-Roc]

One thing that bewilders me are the people who buck the poll and choose the non-listed third option..

"Us" or the "Fans"

like we are some homogenous conglomerate of similar parts, which we are not

I have friends who have been Laker fans from the jump, and it's been obvious to me since the Raptors' inception (and even more evident during this lockout) that their vison of the ideal NBA is completely divergent from mine

Even reading this thread shows that were practically just as divided as the owners & the union

so choosing "The Fans" is a bit of a cop out to me. We are NOT all losing, trust me.

Depending on how this thing goes, certain fanbases will be much more pleased than others

Me personally, if the owners move off of their hardline stance I will go back to strictly following college ball, at least then I'll know what the deal is when the Tarheels play a non-conference game against UNC-Asheville:

A completely one-sided thrashing of a smaller school whose program needs some extra cash by purposely scheduling a televised game against a much superior opponent

At least they don't act phony & dress it up to be something that it isn't

Excellent observation about fans not being on the same page.

[basketball royalty]

One thing that bewilders me are the people who buck the poll and choose the non-listed third option..

"Us" or the "Fans"

like we are some homogenous conglomerate of similar parts, which we are not

I have friends who have been Laker fans from the jump, and it's been obvious to me since the Raptors' inception (and even more evident during this lockout) that their vison of the ideal NBA is completely divergent from mine

Even reading this thread shows that were practically just as divided as the owners & the union

so choosing "The Fans" is a bit of a cop out to me. We are NOT all losing, trust me.

Depending on how this thing goes, certain fanbases will be much more pleased than others

Me personally, if the owners move off of their hardline stance I will go back to strictly following college ball, at least then I'll know what the deal is when the Tarheels play a non-conference game against UNC-Asheville:

A completely one-sided thrashing of a smaller school whose program needs some extra cash by purposely scheduling a televised game against a much superior opponent

At least they don't act phony & dress it up to be something that it isn't

Excellent observation about fans not being on the same page.

Very true. I was one of the first to say I'm on the fans side and just want this over with but more and more I am now on the players side.

I do think concessions have to be made but to me the owners want it their way or they take the ball home and are not willing to compromise at all. I mean they might get their 50/50 but don't want to discuss anything else until that is accomplished. How is that negotiation? If the players give them that then the owners will just check it off their list and demand the next thing. I also don't like that I think Billy Hunter is right and the owners had no intention of starting the season on time. They are not negotiating they are bullying.

[theSkinny]

Anyone else wish there was a "Fans" option on this poll?

[J Dilla]

But don't forget. The Banker works his ass off, doing over 80 hours a week. The Doctor, can get called up any minute and has to show up that minute, and works more than the Banker. Same with accountants and Lawyers, the top earners don't get paid by sitting on their asses. They have to deal with a lot of **** Athletes and Actors wouldn't last a minute doing these jobs.

The league minimum player is getting paid 473K, sitting his ass on the bench tweeting on his blackberry.

And here you have it folks, professional athletes don't work.

They got to be top 400 in a global sport by super blackness powers.

You honestly wanna compare a doctor's job to playing a game?