All NBA Reject Draft Discussion Thread

[-Kees-]

I might be done with my rotation, but extra specialty players can never hurt to create matchup problems.

[Snakebites]

Looks like we'll be able to start the playoff sometime this weekend.

[RiotPunch]

Just an FYI, I am a college student going to school in Madison, WI. Tomorrow is the annual, insane Halloween Freakfest. I am going to be all sorts of drunk and unavailable from late afternoon tomorrow until early afternoon Sunday.

Just a head's up.

[Snakebites]

Just an FYI, I am a college student going to school in Madison, WI. Tomorrow is the annual, insane Halloween Freakfest. I am going to be all sorts of drunk and unavailable from late afternoon tomorrow until early afternoon Sunday.

Just a head's up.

Good chance we'll give people till Monday evening to complete writeups anyway.

[Miller4ever]

Can we move writeups perhaps to Tuesday? I have a big project due that morning, and the rest of the day can be spent doing downtime activities, including writeups.

[Snakebites]

Can we move writeups perhaps to Tuesday? I have a big project due that morning, and the rest of the day can be spent doing downtime activities, including writeups.

Thats fine.

I'm not scheduling anything until we officially end this draft anyway.

[-Kees-]

Poop 2
SamBone 1
Kees 0

I'd love some explanation on this one, Luke, if you have the time.

[lukekarts]

Poop 2
SamBone 1
Kees 0

I'd love some explanation on this one, Luke, if you have the time.

Because I'm not particularly impressed with your team. Your point guard is the weakest of the three; your front court defence is comparable, but JO is inefficient and Kemp was never that smart. SamBone's team is going to play a much more fluid game and Poop's team is just more talented in all but one position.

[-Kees-]

^Thanks.

And thanks to others who posted their reasoning, it looks like I won't do well this game, but I love learning from the feedback

[CellarDoor]

You and me both. With a distinct lack of dominant front court players who are a net positive to their team, I didn't anticipate the back to the basket scoring hurting me nearly as much. Never was happy with my PF though.

[Snakebites]

You and me both. With a distinct lack of dominant front court players who are a net positive to their team, I didn't anticipate the back to the basket scoring hurting me nearly as much. Never was happy with my PF though.

I'd have taken Jack Sikma in place of Chauncey Billups. With him you could have built a rock solid front court while not really sacrificing the perimeter edge you were going for.

A lineup of Harper/Richmond/Pierce/Sikma with either Horace Grant or Maurice Lucas (both attainable in later rounds) at power forward could have, IMO, taken this competition.

I've gone a tad lukewarm on Billups in these games (ironic, I know, given I'm a Piston fan who's won with him in these games). I recall looking at him in round 2 and realizing that I wasn't even sure he'd take a matchup against the likes of Tony Parker, who was available later. Plus there are other point guards (folks like Porter and Harper) who bring that same combination of defense and range who I'm no longer convinced are really that much (if at all) worse than Billups.

[-Kees-]

^I agree with you on the Billups thing. He's a great leader, can shoot and play D, but there are a few (like Porter, Harper and even, to a less extent, current Holiday) that have a similar impact. I think in these games he loses a bit, because his leadership was a big part of his game, and in ATL's, there are usually a lot of leaders on the teams.

[CellarDoor]

Current Holiday? Harper? Yikes.

I'm not even convinced of Terry Porter's greatness.

[RiotPunch]

Disagree on Chauncey. I contemplated taking him in the 1st round. It was between him Reggie Miller and KJ for me. Chauncey in his prime in Detroit Rock City was stupid clutch and as good as anybody.

[-Kees-]

Well I'm more talking about his mold. Like Nash separates himself, because very, very few people can make an offense run off of improvisation, and come even close to what he does. Billups is overrated IMO because there are a lot of 2 way PGs that are efficient, which is essentially what Billups is.

He is clutch (I remember watching a game in the playoffs where they were up by 1 with like 4 minutes, and Billups and Hamilton together closed out the game with 3's and FT's), which separates him, but there are plenty of PG's that fit that role, like Porter and Harper. Holiday was really just an example of how his mold isn't anything special, that a normal player like Holiday plays similar to Billups, while you don't hear those comparisons to Stockton or Nash.

[Snakebites]

Disagree on Chauncey. I contemplated taking him in the 1st round. It was between him Reggie Miller and KJ for me. Chauncey in his prime in Detroit Rock City was stupid clutch and as good as anybody.

We'll just have to agree to disagree here, as someone who saw 90% of his regular season games in a Piston uniform and every single playoff game.

He was clutch at times in his peak and had 2 great playoff series that fed his legend, but ultimately his clutchness is firmly and decidedly overrated. He frequently came up short and was extremely complacent at times.

And don't get me wrong. I LOVE the guy and what he did as part of our team. But he was PART of our team, and not always even the best part of it. And he has value due to the combination of skills that he brings. But people imagine him as always being a guy who he was very occasionally.

Do I consider him better than Porter? Yeah, probably, though Porter at his peak boasted similar shooting stats and downright better playoff stats. Do I see the large gulf between the two that is characteristic of how far they are usually picked apart from one another? Honestly, I really don't.

And if those were the other guys you were considering, then be VERY glad you took KJ. I think he's the best of the 3 by a sizeable margin. I predicted Miller going early in the second round and had Billups going about where he ultimately went (though I'm not sure his value is quite that high in this game). KJ, on the other hand, I strongly considered at my pick over Lanier (those two, btw, were the guys at the top of my draft board as well).

[RiotPunch]

I have no right to question an actual Piston fan, as you must have seen 10 times more Billups film than I have. He just always struck me as a player, when the stakes were at it's highest, that imposed fear into his opponents. Sort of that "it" factor that you can't really measure statistically, I think that's what made him great. Obviously he is no Stockton or Nash, but if you are building a contender, there aren't many PG's I'd rather had leading my team than Chauncey. But that's just me.

You're right about his complacency though, I remember seeing him disappear in games at times and he doesn't really jump out at you with his style of play or anything. I don't know.

[RiotPunch]

And if those were the other guys you were considering, then be VERY glad you took KJ.

Yeah, I made my decision to go with KJ pretty quickly. The fact that I contemplated Reggie and Chauncey doesn't mean it was ever too close.

[Snakebites]

^As I said, I love Chauncey. Which is why its kind of with a heavy heart that I argue this way, because I feel like his qualities, meritorious though they are, have come to be somewhat exaggerated. Its really not just his clutchness either. His defense has also become somewhat overastated, and I attribute that to him having the best help defense system of the decade behind him throughout his time here.

He had a stretch of maybe a year or two where he was that clutch in the regular season, and he certainly brought it in spades in the Finals. And as impressive as that was, it also went a long way towards forgiving the times when it DIDN'T quite happen that way. They also earned him a respect level that he simply didn't live up to in subsequent years. Though this is a "short peak" game, I do see that as being representative of the player that he is and generally do take it into account, particuarly given people tend to choose his 05-06 year, when he certainly was NOT clutch in the playoffs.

There were 4 players on that team (heck, 5 in the later years with Tay) who could be our best player on any given night. Sure, Chauncey was that guy more frequently than any of the others, but he certainly wasn't a franchise player. He was the best player on a balanced, fundamentally sound, and well run team. And all of that is great. But I can't help but feel like people sometimes give him some mystical properties as a player that I just don't believe really capture the player he really was.