Official CBA/Labour Talks Discussion Thread II

[S.W.A.N]

These are the same owners that signed off on 57% for the last 12 years. Get your collective heads out of your ass. When things are good the owners have proven to be extremely fair.

They didn't rob me yesterday, so they must not be robbing me today. I should just ignore the loaded gun they point at me and the request for a "wallet inspection".

I've been pretty pro players thus far, but do you really think robbery is whats going on?

Whether its 300 million or 200 million, the nba owners lost a significant chunk of money when they should not of. Last year had solid league attendance, great tv ratings all the things necessary for a banner year. Yet even this was not enough to even come close to making money.

Personally I think that while the owners are trying to get every penny out of the players possible and I hate the dishonesty that comes with the negotiation process I really don't blame the owners for making a stand about the necessity to re-adjust the payscale.

Another reality is that by the end of the next cba players will be making more money than they are today, as revenues are projected to continue rising.

I do not like all the system changes that the owners are trying to push down the players throats as they really don't chance parity and if your already getting the money from the players you should capitulate on the system side...

[knickerbocker2k2]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/Mich ... yal-110411

Jordan sellout? Pretty hard article which I agree with. Never being fan of Jordan so I'm biased here but this guy is ultimate product of marketing. Forgetting about his on court performance, not the most model athlete/person.

Also I think this is all sterns plan. First use Paul Allen who has being reckless owner to show the owners being business about reducing players share. Than use someone like Holt of the Spurs that the current model doesn't work despite the Spurs being one of the dominate teams of the past decade and how small market teams can succeed. And for the closer use Jordan to hammer the players about the realities when he was on the opposite team arguing for the opposite just 5 years ago.

[MEDIC]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/Michael-Jordan-siding-with-David-Stern-in-NBA-lockout-a-selfish-betrayal-110411

Jordan sellout? Pretty hard article which I agree with. Never being fan of Jordan so I'm biased here but this guy is ultimate product of marketing. Forgetting about his on court performance, not the most model athlete/person.

Whitlock is an idiot. Everything is always about race. WTF is with this quote?

Michael Jeffrey Jordan finally found a cause he can get behind off the court: being an obstacle for any black kid dreaming of matching or exceeding Jordan’s wealth.

He should have written the same article about Mario Lemieux during the NHL lockout:

Mario Lemiuex has finally found a cause he can get behind off the ice: being an obstacle for any white french canadian kid dreaming of matching or exceeding Lemieux's wealth.

LOL.

[40 Guzzle]

whitlock is his own worst enemy, he really comes up with good angles on his stories.... then completely ruins it by going off the deepend

[knickerbocker2k2]

Whitlock is an idiot. Everything is always about race. WTF is with this quote?

Michael Jeffrey Jordan finally found a cause he can get behind off the court: being an obstacle for any black kid dreaming of matching or exceeding Jordan’s wealth.

He should have written the same article about Mario Lemieux during the NHL lockout:

Well this is what MJ had to say about when players where lockout out not to too long ago.

"I can see Clyde Drexler, I can see Charles Barkley, I can see David Robinson and I can see all these stars saying, `Great, it's a good deal,' " he said. "Yeah, it's a good deal for us--for the superstars. But for these young players who are going to move forward and make this league and make the game of basketball as popular as it is today, it's not a good deal for them. That's why we're making this stand."

So he is not far off when he says that what MJ is selling out those who look up to him the most. You have to remember majority of NBA players are black and from the inner cities. I would guess majority if not all dream of not becoming MJ. So his actions will have the most impact on the African american community, of which he is from, thus the reason it is selling out. In another words burning the bridge that you cross and not letting other people follow in your footsteps.

[Laowai]

Ownership in Toronto,Denver and Washington have been through the NHL lockout that lost a year and they know the benefits from it. Boston has stated they want major adjustments in the CBA were in favor of a hard cap,

I think as much as BRI the lack of a hard cap is a major problem while many of you think its just about money I think many owners do want a competitive league. Why the hell would you invest 250 plus million in a team in a small & mid market and basically have no chance at winning a title.

http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball ... alary_cap/

[DreamTeam09]

Without even reading an article, anything that calls jordan a sellout is whack and just stupid. Even if he's taken a hard stance against the players, he would be right in doing so. Jordan never made the kind of money these guys are making, infact none of the past legends did. Jordan used the game of basketball to build his brand. Carried Nike on his back for yrs and yrs untill he got too big and then they had to do a deal with him. He never signed no 7 yr 120 mill deal. He never signed 3yrd 90mill extension. He got paid at the end of his career more as a we owe u thing.... Its not like the money isn't out there, its just that now they gotta get creative to get it, its tough economic times now, get wit it. The gravu train is over a la rob ford lol

[knickerbocker2k2]

Without even reading an article, anything that calls jordan a sellout is whack and just stupid.

How can you call whitlock article "whack" and "stupid" if you haven't read it? If you don't want to read it, then don't comment.

Even if he's taken a hard stance against the players, he would be right in doing so.

I don't think anyone could rational expect Jordan to take players side. But by holding hard-line stance, he is essentially selling out the players. You can't argue that. When he was a player he was telling people to stand strong/think about future generation, and telling owners like himself now that they should sell if they can't make profit. All of sudden he is singing a different tune. That is selling out for $$$.

Jordan never made the kind of money these guys are making, infact none of the past legends did.

He made lot more than those that came before him. In fact those before he laid the foundation so he can make what he made. He and other players have allowed the current generation to make what they are making. This generation is trying to do the same thing for the next. Even as bad as the owners offer is, they technically wouldn't be taking pay cut. This would be coming from the next generation..

[Homer Jay]

Without even reading an article, anything that calls jordan a sellout is whack and just stupid.

How can you call whitlock article "whack" and "stupid" if you haven't read it? If you don't want to read it, then don't comment.

Even if he's taken a hard stance against the players, he would be right in doing so.

I don't think anyone could rational expect Jordan to take players side. But by holding hard-line stance, he is essentially selling out the players. You can't argue that. When he was a player he was telling people to stand strong/think about future generation, and telling owners like himself now that they should sell if they can't make profit. All of sudden he is singing a different tune. That is selling out for $$$.

Jordan never made the kind of money these guys are making, infact none of the past legends did.

He made lot more than those that came before him. In fact those before he laid the foundation so he can make what he made. He and other players have allowed the current generation to make what they are making. This generation is trying to do the same thing for the next. Even as bad as the owners offer is, they technically wouldn't be taking pay cut. This would be coming from the next generation..

Oh My Stars... Jordan is not a "sell-out". He advanced in life.

He's not a player anymore. There is absolutely no reason he should be easy on the players because he "once" was one. He is owner of a team, and he is on the owner's side now. Why should he owe something to LBJ or DWade and then be lenient in negotiations?

And what is with this writer's racist crap about Jordan destroying the dreams of young black kids? That is complete B.S. Jordan owes nothing to anybody. Really maybe Whitlock should write how Windows should be really cheap because Bill Gates owes it to all the nerdy little white kids. I'm sure Jordan is quite generous with his time and money for charities, and saying he should give some millionaires even more millions to play a friggin sport or he is destroying Black America shows the writer has some real issues he needs to see somebody about! How dare this idiot write that Jordan's ego means he has to destroy the earnings of all black basketball players so they don't earn more than him.

Maybe Jordan's concerns about income lie more in the fact he has the hardest time making money of any team in Charlotte, not some petty b.s.

I expect this kind of hatchet job in maybe a blog. But on a major media channel's website it is muckraking. Since Fox has no involvement with the NBA but lots of involvement with NCAA they are ecstatic at the lockout.

[jrsmith]

Jordan wanting the possibility of making money, or much more realistically losing less money is an absolute monster. How dare he display such selfish, agonizingly malevolent motives. Classless, immoral individual.

The nbpa deserve every single penny for their golden, pure motives to cure all diseases and achieve world peace.

**** man, Jordan... How could you? You own a business and you don't want to lose millions???????????? What has this world come to???? To make it even worse you played basketball man... You are telling me you played basketball and now you own a business, and you have a problem with losing money??? The humanity!!!! **** that man.

[Indeed]

Ownership in Toronto,Denver and Washington have been through the NHL lockout that lost a year and they know the benefits from it. Boston has stated they want major adjustments in the CBA were in favor of a hard cap,

I think as much as BRI the lack of a hard cap is a major problem while many of you think its just about money I think many owners do want a competitive league. Why the hell would you invest 250 plus million in a team in a small & mid market and basically have no chance at winning a title.

http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball ... alary_cap/

The rich teams want a hard cap, the poor team wants revenue sharing.
Don't just look at one side, and only compare the benefits of one, compare everything. NHL has revenue sharing in place, and you think Boston wants that? They only want a hard cap to make more.

It is MONEY, and they do NOT want a competitive league.

[Indeed]

LOL @ some of you.

These are the same owners that signed off on 57% for the last 12 years. Get your collective heads out of your ass. When things are good the owners have proven to be extremely fair. Things are now bad in a down economy and they are making adjustments.

The owners aren't the evil greedy bastards you guys make them out to be, just look at the last CBA (that they extended) for proof.

The players are going to have to eat it (and by eat it I mean taking a paycut that keeps them amongst the highest paid athletes in the world) this time and once things are better they can negotiate a deal like they had for the last 12 years.

Suck it up, the players will lose and you guys need to come to grips with that.

Lol @ you

Who are the same owners? One forth of them are new owners, and over paid the team.
Now of course they are in financial trouble, because the previous one cashed one and gone, leaving tons of loans to the new owner.

Who is the leading objective leader? Jordan. And yes, he was the same guy, but on the players side 12 years ago.

The owners aren't the total evil greedy bastards, but before they purchase the team, they should know this is a tough business. And they should ask for revenue sharing, instead of asking the players, because the total amount of money IS ENOUGH!

[MEDIC]

Jordan wanting the possibility of making money, or much more realistically losing less money is an absolute monster. How dare he display such selfish, agonizingly malevolent motives. Classless, immoral individual.

The nbpa deserve every single penny for their golden, pure motives to cure all diseases and achieve world peace.

**** man, Jordan... How could you? You own a business and you don't want to lose millions???????????? What has this world come to???? To make it even worse you played basketball man... You are telling me you played basketball and now you own a business, and you have a problem with losing money??? The humanity!!!! **** that man.

LOL. Exactly.

Jordan is no longer part of the union & he owes them nothing. Jordan built his own legacy through hard work & by maintaning an advantage over his competition. It had nothing to do with the NBPA. The league & the major sponsors did more for Jordan than the NBPA ever did.

It's no different than any other union job. Once you leave the union & become management, you're on the other side of the fence & you have to fend for yourself.

If Jordan wants to be a successful owner, he has to use the same principles that made him the most successful basketball player in the world. He's a fierce competitor that will do whatever it takes to dominate you & take you out of the competition.

[Orsk]

Can someone explain to me why the union is holding out hoping for a better deal? Do they not realize they won't get a better deal as every day longer they hold off the more spiteful the owners will get and the more money the owners lose? What exactly do they hope to accomplish? Either just decertify and go to court already or accept the current offer. Why would the owners make their offer better exactly, surely they would of made their best offer at the start in the hope to avoid this...

[Tofubeque]

If Jordan wants to be a successful owner, he should sell the Bobcats and get in on a franchise that's actually in a decent NBA market

[Orsk]

Here's what I think this comes down to by Wednesday for the Players Association: Accept deal, or decertify union and blow up season.

That's exactly my thoughts.

[Ponchos]

Seems like a decent compromise to me. I don't think the players or owners will get a better deal than this.

[S.W.A.N]

Seems like a decent compromise to me. I don't think the players or owners will get a better deal than this.

+1

[Orsk]

Seems like a decent compromise to me. I don't think the players or owners will get a better deal than this.

Agree. While I am skeptical that the players will accept (I think they have pumped themselves up too much now and they won't accept anything put on the table with less than 52% BRI etc) I think this seems like a good compromise, and the owners adopted 5/6 of what Cohen suggested so they aren't the only ones who think it is fair. I will be ecstatic if they accept, but I see them blowing it up in the near future.

[Orsk]

Fisher: "We did not get sense that they came here with intent to get this deal done..."

This is really becoming a joke. What did he want them to do? Did Fisher want Stern to promise to feed him hand made cookies and rub viks vapor rub on his chest when he tucks him in every night? They need to blow this up already, the NBPA is in too deep!