UFC 143 (2/4): Condit vs. Diaz for interim WW title

Gold Chain · Post #1 » by **Gold Chain** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 1:39 am

http://mmajunkie.com/news/25966/carlos- ... -vegas.mma

I like it.

Condit wins this, he`s cemented a WW title shot.

Post #2 » by **spykelee** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 1:41 am

Yea I heard rumors of this fight as well. I also feel fairly confident that Condit will beat Koschek. Then finally get his weil deserved shot against GSP. Either way, this should be a good test for both guys and a good fight period.

Post #3 » by **Headliner** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 2:22 am

Where does this put Kos though if he wins?
He's had two title shots against GSP. But if he beats the #1 can he really be anything less than at least another win before he should get the shot?

To me, I'd rather Ellenburger fought Condit and Kos try his hand at MW, maybe against Maia or someone.

Post #4 » by **Headliner** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 2:23 am

If Condit loses to Kos, then if GSP beats Diaz, Fitch has to be the #1 contender right?

REDDzone · Post #5 » by **REDDzone** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 2:28 am

I just don't understand why they let Kos fight the best guy if he isn't getting a title shot regardless if he wins? I mean would they even give him a shot if Diaz beat GSP?

I'd rather see Rumble or Ellenberger in this fight. Since Rumble is moving up, make it Ellenberger imo.

Post #6 » by **spykelee** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 3:05 am

It doesn't matter what will happen if Kos wins, because he wont win...

But yea, Ellenberger vs Condit makes more sense... Maybe they just want to try and ensure that Condit wins so that he does ultimetely get his title shot... It would look bad on Dana if Condit steps aside, and then takes a tough fight and get's the piss beaten out of him, never to return to the upper echlones of the division again.

REDDzone · Post #7 » by **REDDzone** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 3:18 am

I'd be curious to know why you are so confident that Condit will win. Watch the Condit/Macdonald fight, you don't think there is any way that Kos can do that to Condit?

If this turns out to be the main event, and its 5 rounds, then yea I can see your point. But in a 3 round fight there is at least a chance that a guy like Kos with such good top control will be able to grind out Condit imo.

Posey H8er · Post #8 » by **Posey H8er** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 3:51 am

if Fitch beats Hendricks, which I think he will in boring fashion, he will still be in the WW-title picture limbo with Diaz getting the shot and likely Condit after him. I say that because I think Condit will beat Koscheck. His striking is more crisp and natural and he has the tools not to get taken down for 3 rounds.

I figure Diaz is next, then Condit (assuming a win at 143), then Ellenberger (assuming a win at his next fight), and Fitch either after or as an injury replacement for the previous guys mentioned. And quite frankly I would be interested in all those fights. Diaz for obvious reasons and Condit/Ellenberger because they are baaad dudes with serious new breed skills to go along with high speed and athleticism. They're possibly the future of the welterweight division.

Post #9 » by **spykelee** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 3:55 am

REDDzone wrote:I'd be curious to know why you are so confident that Condit will win. Watch the Condit/Macdonald fight, you don't think there is any way that Kos can do that to Condit?

If this turns out to be the main event, and its 5 rounds, then yea I can see your point. But in a 3 round fight there is at least a chance that a guy like Kos with such good top control will be able to grind out Condit imo.

Just a hunch. I think Condit is a notch above Kos in almost every category except wrestling, and ever since Kos learned how to punch, he's all but abandoned his wrestling anyways. Standing up, I feel Condit has the edge, and even if Kos did take him down, I feel that it would be but a blip on the radar screen until they where back to there feet.

Not to mention that I feel Carlos is hungry and probably feels disrespected. He'll be looking to make a statement out of a guy GSP was not able to finish. The W just means more to Condit at this stage.

REDDzone · Post #10 » by **REDDzone** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 4:03 am

I'm not necessarily picking Kos, I'm just disagreeing that the ufc matched up Kos/Condit because they want to ensure a Condit win.

This is a very close fight imo.

Post #11 » by **spykelee** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 5:18 am

I'm not sure "what" this fight is exactly... just a good fight I guess?

But it certainly isn't a # 1 contenders match, if it was, it would be Condit vs Ellenberger. I think Dana wants to get Carlos his shot at GSP, and assuming he wins, that's a reality. Kos is a tough fight, and this is a good fight, but it isn't the toughest fight that could have been made... Like I said above, Maybe it's just a good fight, to keep everybody active, Carlos wins, and it's buisness as usual, and if Kos wins, then you take it from there.

REDDzone · Post #12 » by **REDDzone** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 5:36 am

We def agree on the good fight part. I am really curious to see what the betting lines will look like on this bad boy...

Post #13 » by **CPT** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 8:41 am

Weird fight. Pretty good one, but still weird.

I kind of wonder why this didn't just happen at UFC 137 though. Koscheck was willing to fight Condit then. Did Condit turn it down, or did the UFC? I think at that point Condit was told he would retain his shot, but you have to wonder...if Condit fought Koscheck at 137 and won, would he have kept his shot? He probably would have had a better chance at that point, since he was training for GSP, and Koscheck wasn't training for a fight.

I kind of like Koscheck in this fight on paper, but both guys have paths to victory. Koscheck has abandoned his wrestling in some fights, but two of his biggest recent wins (Rumble and Daley) were largely won by his wrestling. I think he abandons his wrestling in fights where he truly believes he has an advantage standing, or his wrestling advantage is negligible. I don't think that will be the case in this fight. I think if Koscheck fights to his abilities, he wins this fight, with it looking like the rough parts of the Ellenberger and MacDonald fights (though those are two fights Condit eventually won).

Condit could win by picking Koscheck apart on the feet, and attacking from the bottom, should Koscheck get him there. He would be well served to use kicks offensively to stay away from Kos' power, but he might be reluctant to do so because of Kos' takedowns.

I think there were better fights to make, but this one is pretty damn good, and we can worry about the fallout afterward.

Post #14 » by **Headliner** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 12:55 pm

Writing off Kos is crazy.
He might not be the favourite to win, but he definitely has the ability to win this fight and act as spoiler.

Post #15 » by **Shaazzam** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 3:13 pm

spykelee wrote:
REDDzone wrote:I'd be curious to know why you are so confident that Condit will win. Watch the Condit/Macdonald fight, you don't think there is any way that Kos can do that to Condit?

If this turns out to be the main event, and its 5 rounds, then yea I can see your point. But in a 3 round fight there is at least a chance that a guy like Kos with such good top control will be able to grind out Condit imo.

Just a hunch. I think Condit is a notch above Kos in almost every category except wrestling, and ever since Kos learned how to punch, he's all but abandoned his wrestling anyways. Standing up, I feel Condit has the edge, and even if Kos did take him down, I feel that it would be but a blip on the radar screen until they where back to there feet.

Not to mention that I feel Carlos is hungry and probably feels disrespected. He'll be looking to make a statement out of a guy GSP was not able to finish. The W just means more to Condit at this stage.

Wasn't it Kos' wrestling that led to Daley getting thrown out of the UFC?

Gold Chain · Post #16 » by **Gold Chain** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 4:11 pm

Just an FYI, this fight is still in works.

They could easily drop it, but all signs point to it as a go-down.

I think whoever said it above was on the money, what does Koscheck get out of this if he wins?
Wasn't he supposed to be going to 18 before Twitter-bombing Condit after GSP`s injury pull-outÉ

REDDzone · Post #17 » by **REDDzone** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 4:27 pm

Not necessarily here, but I also think people are either underrating Kos on the feet or overrating Condit. Condit is far from some technician on the feet, he is a versatile guy who likes to mix it up, but its not like if Kos spends more than 30 seconds on the feet with this guy he's for sure asleep or anything. Condit was dropped by Ellenberger 3-4 times in their fight and Ellenberger was/is probably less technical than Kos, he's supremely powerful but obviously he was connecting well.

The more I think on this the more I think Kos plays the spoiler role. He won't be submitted I don't think.

Gold Chain · Post #18 » by **Gold Chain** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 4:37 pm

Which is why I see this fight getting trashed in favour of something more relevant.

Koschek, like BJ, has zero to gain from fighting in WW, apart from a paycheque.

Post #19 » by **Headliner** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 5:54 pm

Gold Chain wrote:Which is why I see this fight getting trashed in favour of something more relevant.

Koschek, like BJ, has zero to gain from fighting in WW, apart from a paycheque.

And that's it.
Where does he go from here? If I were the UFC I would be putting him in at 180, or putting him up against Fitch, hoping he beats Fitch, so they don't have to give him a shot anytime soon.

But 180 is where he should be testing himself right now. Give him Maia or Stann and see what happens. Gauge where he is in that division.

Nemesis21 · Post #20 » by **Nemesis21** » Sun Nov 6, 2011 9:32 pm

Headliner wrote:Where does this put Kos though if he wins?
He's had two title shots against GSP. But if he beats the #1 can he really be anything less than at least another win before he should get the shot?

To me, I'd rather Ellenburger fought Condit and Kos try his hand at MW, maybe against Maia or someone.

He's had 1 title shot vs GSP, GSP was not the champ during their first fight.