Official CBA/Labour Talks Discussion Thread III

[Ponchos]

The judge in the Minnesota case is Patrick Schiltz who once litigated for the nfl.

I am surprised the players don't have a problem with this

I know a lawyer who represented an accused child molester. The lawyer is one of the kindest people I know, I would let him babysit my niece and nephew.

[ranger001]

Check this out:-

Dave McMenamin
mcten Dave McMenamin
Was told by a source NBA player's licensing profits were withheld by NBPA to pay for lockout legal fees
20 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

Boies fee is $1,225 per hour. That's $9,800 per 8 hour day and don't forget expenses.

[Indeed]

Have you found the link where players believe owner are losing $160m?
I don't see owners are making any claim on their league wide lost, they only say they are not making enough money.

Having a hard time linking directly to the podcast interview, but here is a summary of it, with a link to it.

http://www.knicks101.com/2011/10/13/nba ... esa-today/

In the podcast itself, IIRC, Hunter says 160 million, but the summary says 150 million. But that is the source of that information.

Thanks, so the math is clear, 53% will be breakeven if owners start revenue sharing (4.6b x 4% = 184m). 51% will allow owners to have 2% profit (basketball related only with revenue sharing between owners).

I think they need a farm system, so they don't have to pay rookie that much, but retain their rights until they start playing at the pro level.

[Ponchos]

Check this out:-

Dave McMenamin
mcten Dave McMenamin
Was told by a source NBA player's licensing profits were withheld by NBPA to pay for lockout legal fees
20 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

Boies fee is $1,225 per hour. That's $9,800 per 8 hour day and don't forget expenses.

I'm not quite sure what your point is here Ranger.. They have to get paid somehow don't they?

[ranger001]

Check this out:-

Dave McMenamin
mcten Dave McMenamin
Was told by a source NBA player's licensing profits were withheld by NBPA to pay for lockout legal fees
20 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

Boies fee is $1,225 per hour. That's $9,800 per 8 hour day and don't forget expenses.

I'm not quite sure what your point is here Ranger.. They have to get paid somehow don't they?

The point is the union is shafting the players. They knew that Stern was going to come after them hard 2 years ago according to Hunter. They should have been building a war chest all that time.

If I was player in the r50% making below 2.33 million I'd be freaking annoyed right now. Hunter is still getting his 2 million, the star players are getting their endorsements. The guys who are suffering are the lower class.

[Ponchos]

Check this out:-

Dave McMenamin
mcten Dave McMenamin
Was told by a source NBA player's licensing profits were withheld by NBPA to pay for lockout legal fees
20 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

Boies fee is $1,225 per hour. That's $9,800 per 8 hour day and don't forget expenses.

I'm not quite sure what your point is here Ranger.. They have to get paid somehow don't they?

The point is the union is shafting the players. They knew that Stern was going to come after them hard 2 years ago according to Hunter. They should have been building a war chest all that time.

If I was player in the r50% making below 2.33 million I'd be freaking annoyed right now. Hunter is still getting his 2 million, the star players are getting their endorsements. The guys who are suffering are the lower class.

Whether they took money from the players 2 years ago to pay for it, or they deduct it from their licensing revenues now, it doesn't really make a huge difference.

If you divide the legal costs over 450 players, it doesn't really amount to an incredible amount.... Yet.

[Ponchos]

Just to add, I would really doubt it if Boies is spending all day every day working on this particular case (there are probably a couple full time associates from his firm on it, but they're not billed out at Boies' rate). At this stage of the game, there's some media work and some research, but basically they're just waiting.

[floppymoose]

How much does Stern get paid again?

[ranger001]

He's likely got himself, 2-3 associates, some junior associates, some paralegals and some law interns working on it.

As for the licensing fees being withheld I think it looks bad. Why don't they have a war chest?

[Ponchos]

He's likely got himself, 2-3 associates, some junior associates, some paralegals and some law interns working on it.

As for the licensing fees being withheld I think it looks bad. Why don't they have a war chest?

Perhaps the player reps decided to not increase union fees? Maybe this was talked about years ago and it was decided that any necessary expenses would be deducted from license fees.

There haven't been any twitter blow ups yet. Looks like the NBA players do not share your outrage (perhaps they appreciate it though, very thoughtful).

[C Court]

When the NBA PA doesn't hold a public player's vote, it's undemocratic and outrageous that the players are getting screwed by the union.

When the NBA doesn't hold a public owner's vote, that's okay.

When NBA PA lawyers and execs get paid, that's outrageous and the players are getting screwed by the union.

When NBA lawyers and execs get paid, that's okay.

[Ponchos]

When the NBA PA doesn't hold a public player's vote, it's undemocratic and outrageous that the players are getting screwed by the union.

When the NBA doesn't hold a public owner's vote, that's okay.

When NBA PA lawyers and execs get paid, that's outrageous and the players are getting screwed by the union.

When NBA lawyers and execs get paid, that's okay.

Clearly you're not an objective thinker.

[Reignman]

Boies, Kessler and Hunter have made this negotiation very profitable for themselves. The players are going to look really stupid if they don't get a better off than the last owner proposal.

[Ponchos]

Good thing for Boies and Kessler the NBA lockout happened. Otherwise they would probably be sitting in their offices, with no cases, twiddling their thumbs and making no money.

[Laowai]

When the NBA PA doesn't hold a public player's vote, it's undemocratic and outrageous that the players are getting screwed by the union.

When the NBA doesn't hold a public owner's vote, that's okay.

When NBA PA lawyers and execs get paid, that's outrageous and the players are getting screwed by the union.

When NBA lawyers and execs get paid, that's okay.

You are right in what you say but any union/association prepares for a lockout/strike and has a built up war chest. They plan to be able to pay all the costs in advance to help out some of the members in dire straits.

Plus who exactly is allowed to vote for the players?

Are the newly drafted players who haven't signed contracts.
Are the players who signed a full year contract overseas like Sonny Weems.
Are players who announced there retirement.

[tecumseh18]

Good thing for Boies and Kessler the NBA lockout happened. Otherwise they would probably be sitting in their offices, with no cases, twiddling their thumbs and making no money.

Are you suggesting that those two are not motivated by money on behalf of themselves and their respective law firms? Don't kid yourself. They are expected to bring in as much business as possible, and the firm will hire the associates to do the grunt work. In other words, they are extremely motivated to drag this process out as long as possible.

And in doing so, make themselves even more attractive to future clients who want to scare an opponent into settling.

[edit] Admittedly, a lawyer has a professional duty to settle. In a class action with contingency fee remuneration (it would be interesting to know the compensation formula in this case), it's not so important how much or how little time was spent on the file. The lawyers will get paid under the settlement.

[Ponchos]

Good thing for Boies and Kessler the NBA lockout happened. Otherwise they would probably be sitting in their offices, with no cases, twiddling their thumbs and making no money.

Are you suggesting that those two are not motivated by money on behalf of themselves and their respective law firms? Don't kid yourself. They are expected to bring in as much business as possible, and the firm will hire the associates to do the grunt work. In other words, they are extremely motivated to drag this process out as long as possible.

And in doing so, make themselves even more attractive to future clients who want to scare an opponent into settling.

They are not simply motivated to "bring in as much business as they can". Big time lawyers in big time firms turn down cases all the time. Call whatever the most prominent law firm in your home town is, talk to a partner and ask him if he/she ever had to turn away business based on other commitments.

If the NBA lockout was not happening right now there would be very little impact to either of those guys bottom lines.

[tecumseh18]

Call whatever the most prominent law firm in your home town is, talk to a partner and ask him if he/she ever had to turn away business based on other commitments.

If the NBA lockout was not happening right now there would be very little impact to either of those guys bottom lines.

I think you may be confusing "conflict of interest" - a legimate excuse to turn down a file "based on other commitments" - with "sorry, too busy".

The expression "sorry too busy" does not exist in the legal vernacular, at least not in the large downtown factories where they schedule meetings at 2 am. Out in the sticks, lawyers may value quality of life more and could conceivably say "no".

And, um, more business = more money. That's just the way it is.

[Ponchos]

Call whatever the most prominent law firm in your home town is, talk to a partner and ask him if he/she ever had to turn away business based on other commitments.

If the NBA lockout was not happening right now there would be very little impact to either of those guys bottom lines.

I think you may be confusing "conflict of interest" - a legimate excuse to turn down a file "based on other commitments" - with "sorry, too busy".

The expression "sorry too busy" does not exist in the legal vernacular.

I'm aware of what a conflict of interest is.

As I said. Call the most prominent firm in your city, talk to a partner and ask if they have ever refused business based on being too busy.

[tecumseh18]

Call the most prominent firm in your city, talk to a partner and ask if they have ever refused business based on being too busy.

I talk to senior partners of downtown Toronto law firms all the time. I would be embarrassed to ask such a stupid question.