Superstars cant win alone, so they need to join forces?

[AshyLarry]

lol maybe 13 years? i dont know, thats what i would do if i was a superstar, id be like "give me 13 years, and hell if i cant do it, ill ring chase somehwere"

Who is to say you;d even be worth **** after 13 years? I don't get it really. It's okay that the teams can trade you for a bag of chips if they wished to no matter how loyal you've been and yet when the players exercise their ability to move on people go **** about how they should stay loyal and ****.

Look once again it sucks that Melo "forced" his way to New York but when you look at it as it is (i.e the fact that Denver didn't have to trade Melo to New York if they wanted to..but it was lose him for something or lose him for nothing), it's the way it's gonna be.

No salary cap in the world could force players to play in Utah if they didn't want to play there.

You got 7 years. Make the most of them and hope you win.

1) it depends on what kind of superstar you are, some superstars age real well

2) guys like melo, cp3, and lebron, are franchise players that would have been rarely traded, why do you think dan gilbert goes out of his way just to make lebron happy

3) this is just me, but my opinion would be "im a competitor, i can win this thing without going anywhere, they could come here if they want," and if cant win i could atleast say i gave my best, my career, and my everything, i need to move on. this is the reason why not a lot of people hated and instead cheered when garnett left and got his ring.

but like i said this would be my mentality on it

[TheDunc]

if you could get a job with a better company that has better co-workers, gives you more of a chance to succeed, gives you more earning potential and gives you a better city/lifestyle would you want the job?

no. no, you wouldn't...and that's because you're the typical realgm member. you're righteous, you're honorable, you're supremely intelligent. "competitive desire" (the urge do it all myself) oozes from every pore. you piss humilty and shyt virtue.

you stand triumphantly, nay, defiantly on your soapbox and say "NO! I do not want to improve my situation in every possible way! I'm far too noble to leave a mediocre franchise that's going nowhere! I do not play competitive sports to become a champion, I play sports to give me the platform to share my superior morality with the masses!"

you guys are the best.

WTF? Stop comparing our daily lives with the life of an nba player. Their is no similarities. He plays a game of basketball while we actually work to earn our living. Not only that, some of these players are making ridiculous amounts of money, 100+ million! We as fans are the reason the nba can exist, because if it wasnt for fan support the nba would not exist. So i think the players owe it to the fans to a provide a good product. Do fans want to see 5 teams with superstars and the other 25 teams with a bunch of role players? but luckily for these teams, the nba draft has stars entering the league every year. I think the nba as a whole is missing some talent,so grouping most of the best talent on a few teams seems stupid to me. This is a just from a fans perspective.

From a players perspective you'd think they would have a bit more ego. All of these players are good enough to lead there own team but instead of competing against each other they join forces. Superstar players in the past would join forces but never rivals. Magic would never join Bird. Jordan would never join malone. I have alot of respect for a guy like kevin durant sticking with his team. He has the heart of a champion.

[Sky_Knicks]

lol maybe 13 years? i dont know, thats what i would do if i was a superstar, id be like "give me 13 years, and hell if i cant do it, ill ring chase somehwere"

Whatttttt

[deNIEd]

3) this is just me, but my opinion would be "im a competitor, i can win this thing without going anywhere, they could come here if they want," and if cant win i could atleast say i gave my best, my career, and my everything, i need to move on. this is the reason why not a lot of people hated and instead cheered when garnett left and got his ring.

So Garnett would have been a greater "competitor" if he stayed with Minnesota and watch McHale, Stack, and Kahn fail to bring in enough talent to even get into the 2nd round? If so, Garnett would have essentially given up all hopes of ever winning a championship.

At what point, can you accept the fact that singlehandedly you are not good enough to win a title on your own and that you need help. What do you do if your ownership does not have the competency of ever bringing that talent to you.

[AshyLarry]

lol maybe 13 years? i dont know, thats what i would do if i was a superstar, id be like "give me 13 years, and hell if i cant do it, ill ring chase somehwere"

Wouldn't this simply show that your loyalty instincts outweigh your competitive instincts?

If MJ, Kobe, Magic, Bird, etc., were all so competitive, why they didn't they ask to play 4 v 5? That would have made things REALLY hard for them.

At some point, reality has to kick in and you have to acknowledge that you are in an unwinnable situation.

like i said this is just me, and its not loyalty thats outweighing it, its my pride thats saying i cant carry a team.

i think your misunderstanding what i was saying, to me its cool to go somehwere and form a superteam ONLY if your past your prime or on your last leg of your prime, i dont mind taking the garnett route but taking the lebron route is what bothered me

[Mik317]

Durant would leave too if when his current contract is up and his team is stuck in no mans land. He hasn't been in the league for 7 years yet.

I'm calling Wizards..

As for AshyLarry, I'm not calling you out at all. I would love to see Dwight stay or Bron had of stayed.

It is a bit more manly for a lack of a better word to do it that way it's just that I understand why they would want to leave as well. If you know that you are going to be stuck with scrubs and have to carry them eventually you are going to realize that no matter how manly you are it won't amount to ****.

You think saying that I tried to win by myself is going to make the fact that you've retired without a ring any better? Nope because technically you are a failure since that's what you should try to do.

I agree that it's better to win "by yourself" (Dirk was beastly but he need the help from his "scrubs" too) but 7 years is probably enough. Hell using the Dirk example, He has an owner that show the ability to bring in talent. So he knew he could still win there. Otis got a bunch of old overpaid bums to help out Dwight that didn't work (was a gamble) and now will prevent them from improving. Paul doesn't even have an owner...why the **** would he want to stay on a sinking ship like that? Melo (and Bron..but I'm tired of talking about that) is probably the only guy who bailed for lackluster reasons...Denver was a solid team with solid pieces. So you got a point for him(and Bron) I guess.

[Ditchweed]

if you could get a job with a better company that has better co-workers, gives you more of a chance to succeed, gives you more earning potential and gives you a better city/lifestyle would you want the job?

no. no, you wouldn't...and that's because you're the typical realgm member. you're righteous, you're honorable, you're supremely intelligent. "competitive desire" (the urge do it all myself) oozes from every pore. you piss humilty and shyt virtue.

you stand triumphantly, nay, defiantly on your soapbox and say "NO! I do not want to improve my situation in every possible way! I'm far too noble to leave a mediocre franchise that's going nowhere! I do not play competitive sports to become a champion, I play sports to give me the platform to share my superior morality with the masses!"

you guys are the best.

That's a faulty comparison when you compare the movement of NBA players as similar to a normal company that has no ties to other locations.

A closer comparison is a company that delivers a branch service in 30 cities yet all the employees want to move to six different cities with a better climate. The company can't deliver its service and as a result has to shut down 24 locations since no qualified employees want to work and stay there there.

If you don't want to play where you are paid, leave the league and go elsewhere. Unfortunately a comparable league and pay doesn't exist elsewhere. Franchise tags should be brought in and if you want the big pay, live with it as a condition of employment.

If you want players to have complete free mobility to move where they want within the league, then shut down 24 locations and play with six teams and 90 players.

[Lakersmylife]

Meh. Personally I enjoy the "superstars willing to take less to win rings" ideology more-so than the old school approach of "I'll play for whoever puts the most 0s at the end of my checks" philosophy.

Same here.

[Archerbro]

if you could get a job with a better company that has better co-workers, gives you more of a chance to succeed, gives you more earning potential and gives you a better city/lifestyle would you want the job?

no. no, you wouldn't...and that's because you're the typical realgm member. you're righteous, you're honorable, you're supremely intelligent. "competitive desire" (the urge do it all myself) oozes from every pore. you piss humilty and shyt virtue.

you stand triumphantly, nay, defiantly on your soapbox and say "NO! I do not want to improve my situation in every possible way! I'm far too noble to leave a mediocre franchise that's going nowhere! I do not play competitive sports to become a champion, I play sports to give me the platform to share my superior morality with the masses!"

you guys are the best.

That's a faulty comparison when you compare the movement of NBA players as similar to a normal company that has no ties to other locations.

A closer comparison is a company that delivers a branch service in 30 cities yet all the employees want to move to six different cities with a better climate. The company can't deliver its service and as a result has to shut down 24 locations since no qualified employees want to work and stay there there.

If you don't want to play where you are paid, leave the league and go elsewhere. Unfortunately a comparable league and pay doesn't exist elsewhere. Franchise tags should be brought in and if you want the big pay, live with it as a condition of employment.

If you want players to have complete free mobility to move where they want within the league, then shut down 24 locations and play with six teams and 90 players.

a franchise tag sounds like an awful idea in the nba. WE all saw when a player quits on a team (VC holla!). A guy quitting on a team in the nfl gets cut and isn't as noticeable unless it's at the QB position or wide reciever (and even then.......not on the level in basketball)

[AshyLarry]

3) this is just me, but my opinion would be "im a competitor, i can win this thing without going anywhere, they could come here if they want," and if cant win i could atleast say i gave my best, my career, and my everything, i need to move on. this is the reason why not a lot of people hated and instead cheered when garnett left and got his ring.

So Garnett would have been a greater "competitor" if he stayed with Minnesota and watch McHale, Stack, and Kahn fail to bring in enough talent to even get into the 2nd round? If so, Garnett would have essentially given up all hopes of ever winning a championship.

At what point, can you accept the fact that singlehandedly you are not good enough to win a title on your own and that you need help. What do you do if your ownership does not have the competency of ever bringing that talent to you.

i dont think your comprehending what i said, im trying to say there was nothing wrong with what garnett did, he gave minny 12 years, at that point yes he can say i gave it my all and i do need help or im getting out. theres nothing wrong with the garnett route! the lebron route is where i think is not cool!

[AshyLarry]

Durant would leave too if when his current contract is up and his team is stuck in no mans land. He hasn't been in the league for 7 years yet.

I'm calling Wizards..

As for AshyLarry, I'm not calling you out at all. I would love to see Dwight stay or Bron had of stayed.

It is a bit more manly for a lack of a better word to do it that way it's just that I understand why they would want to leave as well. If you know that you are going to be stuck with scrubs and have to carry them eventually you are going to realize that no matter how manly you are it won't amount to ****.

You think saying that I tried to win by myself is going to make the fact that you've retired without a ring any better? Nope because technically you are a failure since that's what you should try to do.

I agree that it's better to win "by yourself" (Dirk was beastly but he need the help from his "scrubs" too) but 7 years is probably enough. Hell using the Dirk example, He has an owner that show the ability to bring in talent. So he knew he could still win there. Otis got a bunch of old overpaid bums to help out Dwight that didn't work (was a gamble) and now will prevent them from improving. Paul doesn't even have an owner...why the **** would he want to stay on a sinking ship like that? Melo (and Bron..but I'm tired of talking about that) is probably the only guy who bailed for lackluster reasons...Denver was a solid team with solid pieces. So you got a point for him(and Bron) I guess.

well like i said, each their own, ,

[deNIEd]

like i said this is just me, and its not loyalty thats outweighing it, its my pride thats saying i cant carry a team.

i think your misunderstanding what i was saying, to me its cool to go somehwere and form a superteam ONLY if your past your prime or on your last leg of your prime, i dont mind taking the garnett route but taking the lebron route is what bothered me

Eh, I guess between us it's just personal preference then. I feel at some point everyone has to realize they are after all just a single human being and cannot carry everyone (Kobe realized this really quickly once Shaq left).

I don't fault Lebron for leaving Cleveland (I would have left that organization stuck in "no man's land"), but I do fault him for the exhibition he turned the entire situation into.


For me, I believe a player owes a portion of his prime to the organization that drafted him. However, if a he is 3-4 years well into his prime and it is clear the team cannot improve enough to win a title, at no fault of the player, then the player has the freedom to leave.

Players owe a portion of their prime to their organization.
But, the organization owes putting together a contending team to that player as well.

You say it's okay to leave after 10-12 years, I think it's okay to leave after 6-7.

[deNIEd]

i dont think your comprehending what i said, im trying to say there was nothing wrong with what garnett did, he gave minny 12 years, at that point yes he can say i gave it my all and i do need help or im getting out. theres nothing wrong with the garnett route! the lebron route is where i think is not cool!

Apologies. Read your post wrong. I thought you said people still hated KG after he won.

[RutgersBJJ]

If you were married to someone and things went great at the beginning, but out of no-where she started beating the crap out of you with a tire iron for 5 out of the 7 years of your marriage (similar to what Otis Smith has done to Dwight with his transactions or what the Cavs did with Lebron), would you stay with her out of loyalty or would you divorce her and move on?

No one is leaving good teams, everyone is leaving teams they had to carry to wherever they got. Durant isn't leaving, he's surrounded by the best young core that has been assembled since the Bulls in the early 2000s. But Dwight, Lebron, and Melo were abused by their franchises and taken advantage of. Denver trades away Camby for no reason other than luxury tax savings because they care more about the bottom line than winning. Then Denver is forced to face LA in the WCF and has no answer for Bynum or Gasol. I wonder if having Camby would have helped? So Melo decides he wants to play for a team with good players around him and with an ownership that isn't afraid to spend money to win a championship. Orlando we don't even need to list their moves, each one progressively gets funnier. Cavs drafted a white guy just because he ran fast and jumped high, and let Boozer walk because they got outsmarted by his agent, and then they sign Larry Hughes to a double digit million per year deal.

So once again, wife is beating you with a tire iron, do you divorce her, or are you loyal and say hey these 7 years have sucked, but I'll give you 5 more years and if things still suck, I'll divorce you.

[AshyLarry]

i dont think your comprehending what i said, im trying to say there was nothing wrong with what garnett did, he gave minny 12 years, at that point yes he can say i gave it my all and i do need help or im getting out. theres nothing wrong with the garnett route! the lebron route is where i think is not cool!

Apologies. Read your post wrong. I thought you said people still hated KG after he won.

its cool , yup, yur right its just personal preferences, thats all. but IMO i think if lebron would have stayed he would eventually have won, hes only a single piece missing from winning one, also dan gilbert is willing to pay money for lebron and even spoiled him so i think he would have won if he would have been patient but i think he wanted to win more rings instead.
but imo (my opinion again), 1 ring with the only team youve ever been on, plus being the guy that brought the franchise its first championship = 3 rings

[Ditchweed]

if you could get a job with a better company that has better co-workers, gives you more of a chance to succeed, gives you more earning potential and gives you a better city/lifestyle would you want the job?

no. no, you wouldn't...and that's because you're the typical realgm member. you're righteous, you're honorable, you're supremely intelligent. "competitive desire" (the urge do it all myself) oozes from every pore. you piss humilty and shyt virtue.

you stand triumphantly, nay, defiantly on your soapbox and say "NO! I do not want to improve my situation in every possible way! I'm far too noble to leave a mediocre franchise that's going nowhere! I do not play competitive sports to become a champion, I play sports to give me the platform to share my superior morality with the masses!"

you guys are the best.

That's a faulty comparison when you compare the movement of NBA players as similar to a normal company that has no ties to other locations.

A closer comparison is a company that delivers a branch service in 30 cities yet all the employees want to move to six different cities with a better climate. The company can't deliver its service and as a result has to shut down 24 locations since no qualified employees want to work and stay there there.

If you don't want to play where you are paid, leave the league and go elsewhere. Unfortunately a comparable league and pay doesn't exist elsewhere. Franchise tags should be brought in and if you want the big pay, live with it as a condition of employment.

If you want players to have complete free mobility to move where they want within the league, then shut down 24 locations and play with six teams and 90 players.

a franchise tag sounds like an awful idea in the nba. WE all saw when a player quits on a team (VC holla!). A guy quitting on a team in the nfl gets cut and isn't as noticeable unless it's at the QB position or wide reciever (and even then.......not on the level in basketball)

The franchise tag was more of a point in response to Prop's misguided comparison. Unfortunately, the league has the dubious quality in that players control the league, or at least think they can, and act accordingly in prima donna unprofessional manners when they don't get what they want. Franchise tags and non guaranteed contracts together would help somewhat but yes it is still no guarantee that a player will whine and cry and stop playing. I would like to see teams be able to send these players to the D league, or at least have the wherewithall to bench the player like NY did to Stephon Marbury.

There are 450 players but if all 450 want to move to one of six locations, it doesn't add up and doesn't work for a league. Unless the problem is fixed with some harsher system changes, the league of 30 teams becomes dysfunctional.

[picc]

if you could get a job with a better company that has better co-workers, gives you more of a chance to succeed, gives you more earning potential and gives you a better city/lifestyle would you want the job?

no. no, you wouldn't...and that's because you're the typical realgm member. you're righteous, you're honorable, you're supremely intelligent. "competitive desire" (the urge do it all myself) oozes from every pore. you piss humilty and shyt virtue.

you stand triumphantly, nay, defiantly on your soapbox and say "NO! I do not want to improve my situation in every possible way! I'm far too noble to leave a mediocre franchise that's going nowhere! I do not play competitive sports to become a champion, I play sports to give me the platform to share my superior morality with the masses!"

you guys are the best.

Wish I could rep.

[Tim_Hardawayy]

you piss humilty and shyt virtue.

I can't stop laughing

[Mik317]

Not everyone wants to move to 6 spots...and even if they wanted to...they couldn't.

If the Knicks get Paul or Howard that's it for them. The Heat can't add anyone else either. So we are looking at 3 at the most superteams.

There are other players in the league and great talent on the way.

Also Wade isn't getting any younger...Stat has bad knees...Dwight can't get the ball in the clutch...Paul statwise has been regressing...LeBron has no balls...Bosh is a Ostrich...

It's not guranteed that these teams win.

Chill out with the end of the world stuff guys...it's gonna be okay

[AshyLarry]

Not everyone wants to move to 6 spots...and even if they wanted to...they couldn't.

If the Knicks get Paul or Howard that's it for them. The Heat can't add anyone else either. So we are looking at 3 at the most superteams.

There are other players in the league and great talent on the way.

Also Wade isn't getting any younger...Stat has bad knees...Dwight can't get the ball in the clutch...Paul statwise has been regressing...LeBron has no balls...Bosh is a Ostrich...

It's not guranteed that these teams win.

Chill out with the end of the world stuff guys...it's gonna be okay