Jays acquire Sergio Santos for Nestor Molina

[RaptorGuy]

Seems to me that a lot of people are missing the big picture here....

In the last couple days it has become increasingly clear that the blue jays are not going to be a big spending team. With lost of revenue sharing the jays roster budget is going to be based on attendance and revenues.

What this deal does is solidifies a position of need with a guy on good contract for the next 4-6 years.

Not spending big money on the closer spot means more money for everything else.Molina may end up being good but that is the nature of trading...you gotta give to get.

Just because AA has robbed teams in the past doesn't mean every trade is going to be a steal.


Now lets see what AA does next.

I don't think you, me, anyone here or the BlueJays themselves know what the big picture is....

Are they trying to contend or are they trying to rebuild?

Rebuilding teams don't trade good pitching prospects for a Closer with 1 years experience
to fill a need badly....

However teams that want to contend go out and sign Free Agents and want to put solid pieces
around a 31 year old Superstar who isn't getting any younger.

If i had to take a stab at the big picture here Nadir Mohammed and Rogers are running this like
any other business and are running this like a tight ship. However the proof is out there they
can absorb more payroll and if they spend it wisely it could make a profit or at the very least
break even. If they spend it foolishly or something back fires they can get out of bad contracts....

AA is trying to run the Jays like Tampa Bay version 2 in the AL East and strike lightning in
a bottle twice which considering his restraints isn't a bad idea or he does have the money to
spend but he doesn't have the Balls big enough to take a huge gamble.

There is mass confusion from Ownership and management if were rebuilding or Rogers is
to cheap to sign someone. What AA and Beeston say to the media has to be taken with a grain
of salt.

The only way to tell is the moves they make and its hard to tell if their rebuilding when one
move points to rebuilding and the other signs of contending.

This has been a treadmill for close to 20 years....

Its time the Jays pick their posion Rebuild or Contending

Nestor Molina has moved up within the Jays system over just 1 year. He was on no one's radar over a year ago. He has played A/AA ball and is still 2-3 years away. Good prospect, still has much to prove. Santos is proven and will make the 9th inning watchable. Glad I don't have to see Rauch, Francisco (early in the season) this year and try to close a game. Santos will win us 8-10 games on his own next year, the risk of blowing saves will be greatly reduced.

[RaptorGuy]

How good do you know Molina will become? How many games have you seen him pitch again? Right. You're going by the numbers. The same way many of us go by analyzing this deal. In fact, a lot of you have probably even seen Santos pitch a few times. I have. Both were intriguing prospects before the start of last year and both had amazing years.

Based on your argument saying that Santos had one good year and came out of nowhere could be applied to Molina as well.

And of course the real reason why you're so bitter after reading your last post. You really think this is a consipracy and a move not pulled by AA but rather ownership.

AA has no balls to take a huge gamble you say? Well it certainly sounds like he did according to your crazy amount of displeasure for this trade.

This is not so much about Molina vs. Santos as it is about trading one of your better prospects
for a Closer with only one year experience. Looking at the history of closers it seems more
logical to develop your own closer or buy one then give up Assets for one considering there is
not to many reliable closers out there and a majority of them get hurt.

Apparently were on a tight budget and basically have a salary cap to abide to we can't go
out and buy a closer we have to trade assets for one.

Just like we can't go out and sign Prince Fielder or any other star if we want one like a Votto
for example we have to trade a bunch of assets for one.

As for Molina vs. Santos I heard AA's interview with Bobcat sounds like that because the
Jays have had Santos in the system and have followed him cloesly they feel they have a
better grip on him then others the White Sox were adamant about Molina and it was the Jays
who balked and the Jays reluctantly agreed after awhile. This will be an interesting trade the
Blue Jays think Santos is gonna become an elite closer and the White Sox think hes fools gold
and Molina has the better upside because it sure wasn't a salary dump on their part.

Just for the record if the trade was Molina for Andrew Bailey I wouldn't have like that
trade either because Im not a fan of giving up solid assets for closers with a low track record.

There is no closer currently available in the market that is worth signing and will be with the Jays once they start contending.

Heath Bell was not the answer, he would get destroyed in the AL. Cordero is good, but too old...maybe a 1-2 year stop gap solution. The only guy I would have made a run for was Papelbon if I was AA. I heard they were in the mix. I like Bailey and would have made a pitch for him, but like Santos more. Bailey has been injuried a lot so far and not worth the gamble. By the way, the Jays would have to give up more than Molina for Bailey and also be paying much more for their closer.

The Santos deal much a lot of sense.

[Lateral Quicks]

I think just about everyone here, including those that wouldn't have made the trade, agree that it makes the team better in 2012. AA has said for a while now it's time to start improving the big club by leveraging the strength and depth in the minor leagues. That's a pretty strong indication that he wants to compete.

Don't misjudge just how atrocious the bullpen was last year. On a net basis it cost us many games, I'd argue. Adding a Santos and a quality lefty or two could transform a .500 club into a 10 game over .500 club.

I hate to see Molina go too, but I just don't see how this trade can be seen as so lopsided in favour of the Sox.

[SharoneWright]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.ph ... d-process/

[WpgPage]

Why are we saying that this means the Jays must go for it now.
Nestor Molina age 23 season 6 years team control
Sergio Santos age 28 season 6 years team control
They can easily still be planning on building for another 2 years before really feeling ready and still have Santos on a relatively cheap salary for 4 more years.

[Strav]

Why are we saying that this means the Jays must go for it now.
Nestor Molina age 23 season 6 years team control
Sergio Santos age 28 season 6 years team control
They can easily still be planning on building for another 2 years before really feeling ready and still have Santos on a relatively cheap salary for 4 more years.

well you're trading a prospect who probably won't make the big leagues for a few years for a closer who can help this team win now. That and Jose's age.

[WpgPage]

wrong Molina lol I do get that and I understand that it is definitively a move geared toward winning sooner, however all the people saying that this move makes no sense if we don't sign Fielder are being a little short sighted I think. Maybe the team builds internally for the the next 2 years then signs Votto and goes for it, still have Santos at that point.

[Parataxis]

Why are we saying that this means the Jays must go for it now.
Nestor Molina age 23 season 6 years team control
Sergio Santos age 28 season 6 years team control
They can easily still be planning on building for another 2 years before really feeling ready and still have Santos on a relatively cheap salary for 4 more years.

Joey Bats says hello.

[WpgPage]

Yeah they are wasting his good years, how effective will be be @ 33 years old is any ones guess. He could still be an above average hitter its very possible. Non the less the team is not good enough with him as they only horse so they need to ether wait for some one to develop to hit with him or sign someone. Ether way it has no barring on the closer spot.

[wbbfan]

I personally like the deal. I think molina's stuff was heavy over rated amongst jays fans. And his exp was still 95% high A ball. If he ends up a reliever, then we win hands down. If he goes into a rotation as a 4th or 5th peak which alot of baseball scouts seem to think is his up side we still easily win.
We need a top2 maybe 3 starter but i dont think molina was going to be that any way.