Isiah Thomas vs Steve Nash - the better player

GodDamnRobin · Post #301 » by **GodDamnRobin** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 8:11 am

Dumars and Parker over Nash too?

easiestplayfts · Post #302 » by **easiestplayfts** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 8:14 am

GodDamnRobin wrote:Dumars and Parker over Nash too?

Yep

Rapcity_11 · Post #303 » by **Rapcity_11** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 8:14 am

easiestplayfts wrote:^^^^Stupidity Rapcity_11 ..... is not being able to follow one train of thought (or thread topic). Anybody can make broad generalizations.
Topic: Isiah Thomas vs Steve Nash - the better player
For example some people might take Baron Davis, Deron Williams and Magic over Nash. And this could go on and on and on. And thats off topic...genuises.

On topic :I'll take Isiah over Nash

Uh, I am following your train of thought and applying to another situation to show how stupid it is.

Basic stuff, man.

Rapcity_11 · Post #304 » by **Rapcity_11** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 8:15 am

easiestplayfts wrote:
GodDamnRobin wrote:Dumars and Parker over Nash too?

Yep

Not that I do this, but this is sig worthy. Just brutal. I mean Tony Parker, really???

easiestplayfts · Post #305 » by **easiestplayfts** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 8:16 am

Rapcity_11 wrote:
easiestplayfts wrote:^^^^Stupidity Rapcity_11 ..... is not being able to follow one train of thought (or thread topic). Anybody can make broad generalizations.
Topic: Isiah Thomas vs Steve Nash - the better player
For example some people might take Baron Davis, Deron Williams and Magic over Nash. And this could go on and on and on. And thats off topic...genuises.

On topic :I'll take Isiah over Nash

Uh, I am following your train of thought and applying to another situation to show how stupid it is.

Basic stuff, man.

I'll still take Isiah.

easiestplayfts · Post #306 » by **easiestplayfts** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 8:18 am

Rapcity_11 wrote:
easiestplayfts wrote:
GodDamnRobin wrote:Dumars and Parker over Nash too?

Yep

Not that I do this, but his is sig worthy. Just brutal. I mean Tony Parker, really???

Make it a sig...please!!!

GodDamnRobin · Post #307 » by **GodDamnRobin** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 8:23 am

Cedric Maxwell too, right?

Brenice · Post #308 » by **Brenice** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 1:18 pm

[quote="Doctor MJ"]

Yeah we're not getting anywhere. You don't live in a rational world my friend. You want to believe that every player gets ample opportunity to win, and thus whoever wins with their team is the best player, but the reality is that by any objective standards team sports deals with small sample size mixed with a large dose of luck for individual players.[quote]

I clearly don't believe everybody has the same chance to win just like people saying Magic had this geat impact as a rookie because they won with kareem his rookie season but zeke didn't have no impact his rookie year on an inferior squad to what magic had.

Why do people only want to give Nash all the credit. No blame for anything. Its as if he is Jesus Christ.

basic21 · Post #309 » by **basic21** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 1:24 pm

Felton showed that it is more about the system. So Nash's numbers in PHX are just a joke

Put Nash on a team like the Pistons and his numbers go back to Dallas Mavericks Nash.

RocketPower23 · Post #310 » by **RocketPower23** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 4:08 pm

Well for most stars "it's just about the system". Take LeBron for example, he isn't quite having the same impact in Miami as he did in Cleveland. Is LeBron lesser of a player? No, maybe limited to an extent, but he isn't worse off as a player. Most players need a group of certain players, Nash is no different. The question isn't whether you place Nash in a different system will he be as successful, the question is could he lead a team with his style of play. I'd say yes.

And explain how Felton showed it's more about the system? During his time in New York he posted inferior numbers and on a team with Amare Stoudamire nowhere near duplicated what Nash achieved in Phoenix.

ElGee · Post #311 » by **ElGee** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 6:09 pm

Bernice, I blame Jesus Christ for a lot.

On a serious note, I'm actually wondering where you came up with the idea of "blame" on a successful team. In a league of 30 teams (or even 22), by the time you reach the final 8 or final 4 the remaining the remaining teams are doing things very right. They probably were superior over most of the competition all year. They usually lost because they run into a better team (or due to variance). What is their to blame when you're talking about overall successes? (ie why are you quick to jump to the negative?)

Brenice · Post #312 » by **Brenice** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 7:48 pm

I like Nash. He has some great positives. I'm not going to say he is better than zeke. But the suns are nash's team. Not amare's team. They were built to highlight his strengths. A one dimensional team.

GodDamnRobin · Post #313 » by **GodDamnRobin** » Thu Dec 8, 2011 8:01 pm

You've got no good evidence for your position though... the other side of the argument? Does.

To quote Ari Gold schooling Turtle; "come back when you can prove it"

Brenice · Post #314 » by **Brenice** » Fri Dec 9, 2011 12:25 am

What evidence on Nash? Stats? Are you kidding me? Come back when you compare stats under identical circumstances.

Post #315 » by **rrravenred** » Fri Dec 9, 2011 1:34 am

What evidence on Isiah? Anecdotes? Are you kidding me? Come back when you compare anecdotes under identical circumstances.

Post #316 » by **Doctor MJ** » Fri Dec 9, 2011 2:50 am

easiestplayfts wrote:^^^^Stupidity Rapcity_11 ..... is not being able to follow one train of thought (or thread topic). Anybody can make broad generalizations.
Topic: Isiah Thomas vs Steve Nash - the better player
For example some people might take Baron Davis, Deron Williams and Magic over Nash. And this could go on and on and on. And thats off topic...genuises.

On topic :I'll take Isiah over Nash

You've got some issues dude.

First off, my duty as a mod: tread carefully when implying others are stupid if you want to make sure you don't get a warning.

Beyond that though, you are the one who to the rest of us appears incapable of understanding why using ultra-simplistic arguments to support opinion and rejecting those same arguments when they don't support your opinion makes you lose all credibility.

Ballings7 · Post #317 » by **Ballings7** » Fri Dec 9, 2011 2:55 am

Brenice wrote:I like Nash. He has some great positives. I'm not going to say he is better than zeke. But the suns are nash's team. Not amare's team. They were built to highlight his strengths. A one dimensional team.

Well said... Phoenix couldn't defend, or score enough in the half-court... plus they usually had "eh" benches. Usually need depth with a bit of diversity in skill on a contender...

Rapcity_11 · Post #318 » by **Rapcity_11** » Fri Dec 9, 2011 2:56 am

Ballings7 wrote:
Brenice wrote:I like Nash. He has some great positives. I'm not going to say he is better than zeke. But the suns are nash's team. Not amare's team. They were built to highlight his strengths. A one dimensional team.

Well said... Phoenix couldn't defend, or score enough in the half-court... plus they usually had "eh" benches. Usually need depth with a bit of diversity in skill on a contender...

Phoenix couldn't score enough in the half-court?

Uh, what?

Post #319 » by **Doctor MJ** » Fri Dec 9, 2011 2:58 am

basic21 wrote:Felton showed that it is more about the system. So Nash's numbers in PHX are just a joke

Put Nash on a team like the Pistons and his numbers go back to Dallas Mavericks Nash.

See this is why it's so frustrating to argue with people about Nash. People look for the slightest bit of evidence supporting their beliefs, and then shout them as if they are definitive proof...without even having done the slightest bit of research themselves.

Nash won MVPs because he was the primary force in the single greatest offensive turnaround of all-time, not because he had big individual numbers. Felton showed slight volume stat improvement, the Knicks offense only got a little bit better despite also adding some guy named Amare and later Carmelo, and Felton managed to not even last a year in New York before they dumped his ass. By any normal standards that "meh" improvement. To compare it to what happened with Nash is completely without basis.

Post #320 » by **Doctor MJ** » Fri Dec 9, 2011 3:01 am

Ballings7 wrote:
Brenice wrote:I like Nash. He has some great positives. I'm not going to say he is better than zeke. But the suns are nash's team. Not amare's team. They were built to highlight his strengths. A one dimensional team.

Well said... Phoenix couldn't defend, or score enough in the half-court... plus they usually had "eh" benches. Usually need depth with a bit of diversity in skill on a contender...

The Suns were fantastic in the half-court. You don't have ridiculous ORtg without that, which is why Jason Kidd led offenses were never impressive despite being good in transition.

I also don't understand how "no depth" is somehow something you do to build around Nash. Would sure seem to me like "no depth" is a symptom of one of the worst run franchises in the league, and the franchise most known for selling lottery picks for money (which I still can't believe actually still happens in this day and age).