Buster: Jays unlikely to increase payroll; may cut it

[flatjacket1]

This isn't the year to make a statement though. Next year there are many front of the rotation starters I can see us getting. The Angels had to face pressure from the fans last year and now I think the fans are liking that kool-aid.

Talk about putting all of your eggs in a basket that you might not even have.

Fielder isn't putting all of your eggs in one basket? Its what AL East teams need to do to compete, take risk. This is one of the thinnest FA markets in recent memory.

I'd rather wait until there are like 10 All-Stars to choose from.

[dagger]

This isn't the year to make a statement though. Next year there are many front of the rotation starters I can see us getting. The Angels had to face pressure from the fans last year and now I think the fans are liking that kool-aid.

Talk about putting all of your eggs in a basket that you might not even have.

Fielder isn't putting all of your eggs in one basket? Its what AL East teams need to do to compete, take risk. This is one of the thinnest FA markets in recent memory.

I'd rather wait until there are like 10 All-Stars to choose from.

You must be the poster Shane on drunkjaysfans because there can't be two like you in all of the GTA. You'd rather wait until there are 10 All-stars to choose from? Think they're going to want a penny less or a deal a year shorter than Fielder? Give your head a shake. You talk nonsense.

[hyper316]

Alex Anthopoulos, the Jays' general manager, is widely respected by his peers for his work, with other general managers praising him for the process he has developed, and for the decisions he has made. But in a division already inhabited by the richest teams, the Yankees and the Red Sox, the Blue Jays are spending about 35 percent of what the financial monsters are -- and Toronto's payroll seems to be going down, rather than increasing.

The year-by-year payroll, according to Cot's:
2007: $82 million
2008: $98 million
2009: $81 million
2010: $79 million
2011: $71 million

And sources say the Jays are much more likely to hold or cut their payroll than to increase it. Which means right now, Toronto is much closer to being in the same situation as the Tampa Bay Rays than they are competing financially with the big spenders of the AL East.

i think an interesting thing is comparing those annual payroll to equivalent Canadian Dollars. It is probably going to look worse on Rogers.

Easy enough to do. Let's take the rate on the Ides of March each year, just to choose a random date.

2007: C$96.4 million
2008: C$97.1 million
2009: C$104.6 million
2010: C$80.5 million
2011: C$70.0 million

It virtually neutralises the payroll increase between '07 and '08, but in the Spring of 2009, the US dollar spiked briefly.

(All data from http://www.exchange-rates.org )

Parataxis: thanks for all your work. the big league team is spending much less than before, but the front office guys is gonna say they are spending more on drafting and international signings.

even if the jays sign Fielder, they will be under the $100 mill mark which is still below the average in AL East. never mind spending $120-130 mill as promised

[Parataxis]

This isn't the year to make a statement though. Next year there are many front of the rotation starters I can see us getting. The Angels had to face pressure from the fans last year and now I think the fans are liking that kool-aid.

Talk about putting all of your eggs in a basket that you might not even have.

Fielder isn't putting all of your eggs in one basket? Its what AL East teams need to do to compete, take risk. This is one of the thinnest FA markets in recent memory.

No, it isn't. It's building the team with an eye to both the present and the future. A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush - passing up on Fielder now, doesn't mean we'll get Hamels next year, not even close.

Getting Fielder now (because he's the best hitter available now) makes our team better this year. And it also lets us sign a pitcher next year, while still staying within a reasonable and affordable payroll for the Jays.

There are good risks (sign a top player and hope he works out) and bad risks (sign nobody, and hope somebody else falls into our laps). I know which one I'd prefer.

[Kurtz]

This isn't the year to make a statement though. Next year there are many front of the rotation starters I can see us getting. The Angels had to face pressure from the fans last year and now I think the fans are liking that kool-aid.

There are 3 ace-type pitchers currently scheduled to be UFA's next year. Let's say 1-2 of them actually make it to UFA. There are probably 10-15 teams in the league that can use a front rotation guy and have cash to at least be in the conversation, Yankees and Red Sox among them.

So can you see us outbidding those teams for those 1-2 pitchers?

Yes. Its not like they actually care where they go, its whoever pays the most money. We just have to outbid teams. Its how the Fielder situation is working out right now, just because hes a Boras client its being drawn out. He has offers on the table right now, its just a matter of him choosing one which I predict will be over the next 2-3 weeks.

So we can't outbid the likes of Orioles or Mariners for Prince, but outbidding Sox and Yankees for the ace pitcher sounds realistic to you?

[torontoaces04]

Well written piece Dagger 100% on point. You can only BS a fan base for so long before it backfires. I'm all for the AA rebuilding plan but the endless "cut the fat" approach without spending money on those few key pieces that would put us over the top into contention are depressing. Your also right about the fans needing to put pressure on the ownership group instead of drinking the kool-aid year after year. Especially since the media is all in Rogers' pocket. We've been patient as it is for the past decade with Rogers as the current ownership group. Time to make a move Rogers/AA and show the fans your serious about competing.

This isn't the year to make a statement though. Next year there are many front of the rotation starters I can see us getting. The Angels had to face pressure from the fans last year and now I think the fans are liking that kool-aid.

^^^ Translation:

see your PM - Yogi

[Strav]

Translation: If the Jays don't sign Fielder, payroll will likely not increase. Duhhh. There's really no other free agents that the Jays realistically would be interested in except for Edwin Jackson. Sounds like a slow news day to me.

That's a dubious argument because six weeks ago there were lots of free agents who would have improved this team.

who from this list might you be referring to exactly? http://www.baseball-reference.com/friv/ ... ents.shtml

No knees expected to play on hard turf Beltran?
254 million dollar guy playing until I'm in my 40's Pujols?
I'm rich b**ches well beyond my actual true wealth Wilson?

If you look at the remaining fa's, there is a nice list to go from still. You're a broken record duder. Chill - it's just Dec. 31st. Spring training's in mid Feb. Geez.

[reck0n3r]

Just stop watching and stop going to the games.

[wbbfan]

The drop in pay roll idea seems like its a bit of a misnomer. That could just mean we are still looking to dump mark teahen and with the switch to guys like alvarez, santos, mathis, and valbuena we dropped in pay roll. Iirc johnny mac was making more then most utility infielders as was molina. And rauch plus frank were making good money to play 1.5 piss poor seasons between the two last year. Rauch may have played 2 or 3 piss poor seasons over one year last year. So we could well be getting cheaper while getting better.

[dagger]

That could just mean we are still looking to dump mark teahen.. So we could well be getting cheaper while getting better.

First of all, Teahan at $5 million ain't going anywhere unless we pay a good chunk of his salary anyway to go play somewhere else, or take back a slightly better player with a longer, shiattier contract. As for getting cheaper while getting better, much of the rest of the American League has got better in some way, so I don't believe this cheaper Jays team, even if it looks as good as last year's team, will do any better.

[flatjacket1]

This is finished- HM

[wbbfan]

That could just mean we are still looking to dump mark teahen.. So we could well be getting cheaper while getting better.

First of all, Teahan at $5 million ain't going anywhere unless we pay a good chunk of his salary anyway to go play somewhere else, or take back a slightly better player with a longer, shiattier contract. As for getting cheaper while getting better, much of the rest of the American League has got better in some way, so I don't believe this cheaper Jays team, even if it looks as good as last year's team, will do any better.

Every one said the same thing of vernon wells. No contract is un dumpable. With the activity of AA i dont doubt that we are working to dump teahan.
With guys like kj, colby, oliver and santos we are certainly better. Not to mention what should be a healthy year from lind, lawrie starting in the mlb this year, and what should be a continued improvement from JP. Plus alvarez, mcgowan and im sure cecil wont be as troubled as he was last year. We are pretty young with a very strong minors so another year of seasoning will make for a better team. We have improved a good bit and will continue too, our improvement as a team doesnt have any thing to do with the rest of the AL. Will we win more games? maybe maybe not too soon to tell. We arent even close to Spring training yet. And the success of this season will be based on our young players and their develop ment and improving our starting pitching. We've shored up our pen our biggest weak spot last year. And our rotation doesnt have reyes in it so it by default at worst should be better.

[flatjacket1]

That could just mean we are still looking to dump mark teahen.. So we could well be getting cheaper while getting better.

First of all, Teahan at $5 million ain't going anywhere unless we pay a good chunk of his salary anyway to go play somewhere else, or take back a slightly better player with a longer, shiattier contract. As for getting cheaper while getting better, much of the rest of the American League has got better in some way, so I don't believe this cheaper Jays team, even if it looks as good as last year's team, will do any better.

I think we could include a C/D level prospect to get rid of it or even send 25% of his salary to a team with a hole at a position he plays. They would be willing to pay like 3.75M for a year of a decent player (Like Jason Nix level of player)

[Raps in 4]

There was so much positive buzz around this team, it seems like since the Darvish debacle it's completely fallen off a cliff.

All of the buzz was completely unfounded. Rogers never had the intent to spend, and never will.

[torontoaces04]

There was so much positive buzz around this team, it seems like since the Darvish debacle it's completely fallen off a cliff.

All of the buzz was completely unfounded. Rogers never had the intent to spend, and never will.

BINGO

[wbbfan]

There was so much positive buzz around this team, it seems like since the Darvish debacle it's completely fallen off a cliff.

All of the buzz was completely unfounded. Rogers never had the intent to spend, and never will.

Aside from 3 years od mediocore production with a the team spending around 100m$. Which was just before AA arrived. The positive buzz is based around the fact in such a short time from dealing the doc we built one of the best minors in the mlb, have made a bunch of amazing quality trades and have a young team poised to improve with play time. Its not based around a bottom 5 attendance team with such a bright future coming off a .500 season spending at a rate of around 20th while we get the pieces in place to build a real contender. Not just tossing money as soon as we can to build a JP richardi esq win the off season team.