Trading DWilliams for Upgrade at SG or C?

rugbyrugger23 · Post #1 » by **rugbyrugger23** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 3:35 pm

Should Derrick Williams be moved to upgrade SG or C? Under the premise he holds the most trade value and odd man out of rotation deep at forward and needing balance.

I think Center needs upgrade the most. SG can be adequately (average play) filled by Wes-Webster-Ellington, even PG's like JJ and Rid playing 2 guard sets.

Who would Williams yield at C? My top 5 Choices:

1) Marc Gasol (I don't think Griz would trade him)
2) McGee
3) Hibbert
4) Jordan
5) Monroe (I would have him higher but Pistons consider him part of their core)

Purch · Post #2 » by **Purch** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 3:41 pm

I doubt Adelman's gonna let your frontoffice move D-Will. Especilly if he belives that he can learn the 3 effectively in the offseason.

Steve_Holiday · Post #3 » by **Steve_Holiday** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 3:59 pm

I don't recall Adelman hinting that Williams could play the three. He has played him there out of necessity and for purposes of experimentation. To me, he looks like more of a tweener than Beasley.

weasel · Post #4 » by **weasel** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 4:07 pm

How about we hold onto Williams and keep developing Pek. The guy only put up a double-double against Duncan while holding him without a fieldgoal the last 3 quarters of the game in his first ever start in the league.

rugbyrugger23 · Post #5 » by **rugbyrugger23** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 4:16 pm

weasel wrote:How about we hold onto Williams and keep developing Pek. The guy only put up a double-double against Duncan while holding him without a fieldgoal the last 3 quarters of the game in his first ever start in the league.

I like Pek, as a backup. Of course getting minutes stats and level of play will increase. Any player on an NBA roster has skills to hold that spot. If given the minutes and opportunity, almost any player will increase productivity.

But does he fit the roster, next to Wolves building blocks-Love and Rubio? Off the bench yes. A real nice change of pace center (strong, true post tree trunk of a big man) from the starter who should be an athletic, defensive minded player with light feet and spring in his legs.

I like Williams game, but will he ever co-exist with Love perfectly as needed to get Wolves to next level? If answer is no or even a maybe, trade him with high value now (due to potential) and get a center who can fit the bill more then Pek.

shrink · Post #6 » by **shrink** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 4:25 pm

I still believe that for marketing purposes alone, Derrick Williams has more value in PHX than any other city. If the ultimate goal is to get Marc Gasol, maybe we're talking something like

MIN GIVES: Williams + Darko + Brad Miller + Ridnour
MIN GETS: M. Gasol + ???

PHX GIVES: Nash + Gortat (+ maybe something else?)
PHX GETS: Williams + Darko + Brad Miller + Ridnour

MEM GIVES: M. Gasol + ???
MEM GETS: Nash + Gortat

Nash expires after this season, and Gortat can force his way out next year, but maybe they stay if they are on a better team. Depending on what MEM also includes, they may like this as a cheaper alternative than Gasol on his big new deal, until they need to pay Gortat. We consolidate, but get a center who I think would fit well next to Ricky and Love. Marc Gasol is the master of nothing but is good in everything.

I don't know - I'm not optimistic on getting Marc Gasol off the Grizzlies, but I can't see a better alternative.

prefuse73 · Post #7 » by **prefuse73** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 4:30 pm

Honestly, I think we keep him and see what he can do in the offseason and an entire training camp. Worst case scenario he still will be a PF with all star potential.

At that point, I would actually consider sending him to Utah for Favors. From your list, only Jordan and McGee fit what we need, but Jordan is not likely available and McGee is kinda dumb which adelman doesn't particularly like.

Kurosawa · Post #8 » by **Kurosawa** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 4:36 pm

19 games into his career and posters already are denigrating DWill and eager to dump him? I understand the fun in proposing trades incessantly, no matter how ill-considered, unwise, and improbable. But how about giving Williams a chance to develop as a well-rounded NBA player under this terrific staff of coaches instead of pawning him for spare parts without a fraction of his upside? And how about letting our young team gel and grow without blowing it up every day or two?

I swear, sometimes I think some of us need to see a shrink--the psychiatrist kind.

prefuse73 · Post #9 » by **prefuse73** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 4:48 pm

Agreed Kurosawa... Like I said, lets see what he does in the offseason. However, if he does turn out to be only a PF, he (or Love) will likely need to be moved to fill one of our holes.

To give the people on here credit, they are not nearly as bad as the people on Rube Chat. After a loss the whole team needs to be traded.

shrink · Post #10 » by **shrink** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 4:59 pm

I don't think anyone is eager to dump him, but is willing to listen if he can bring back a legitimate impact player at a position of need.

yowyOw · Post #11 » by **yowyOw** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:03 pm

shrink wrote:I still believe that for marketing purposes alone, Derrick Williams has more value in PHX than any other city. If the ultimate goal is to get Marc Gasol, maybe we're talking something like

MIN GIVES: Williams + Darko + Brad Miller + Ridnour
MIN GETS: M. Gasol + ???

PHX GIVES: Nash + Gortat (+ maybe something else?)
PHX GETS: Williams + Darko + Brad Miller + Ridnour

MEM GIVES: M. Gasol + ???
MEM GETS: Nash + Gortat

Nash expires after this season, and Gortat can force his way out next year, but maybe they stay if they are on a better team. Depending on what MEM also includes, they may like this as a cheaper alternative than Gasol on his big new deal, until they need to pay Gortat. We consolidate, but get a center who I think would fit well next to Ricky and Love. Marc Gasol is the master of nothing but is good in everything.

I don't know - I'm not optimistic on getting Marc Gasol off the Grizzlies, but I can't see a better alternative.

Conley is one of the best PG you can find for Hollins' system. He's electric, fast, quick, steals a lot of balls and penetrates fast. So, bottom line, they don't need a PG.

Marc Gasol is better than Marcin Gortat. Period.

Any team in the league would give A LOT to get M.Gasol. Heck, I believe Orlando would give Howard straight up for M.Gasol. If he was the first scoring option, he'd be around 20-10 with ease. Plus, he is BY FAR, the second best center on the defensive end in the NBA. And no center can pass like him (except brother Pau when he plays at C). He also has the best jumpshot of all centers (in fact, he doesn't even jump. He does it in Sabonis' style).

Darko is, in my opinion, one of the worst centers in the league. He plays WAY under the rim and has ZERO energy on the offensive end. His bball IQ is also really low, compared to Marc's highest IQ among the centers.

The time to bet on Marc was this off-season. Now he is "untouchable". With Z-Bo's comeback, Grizz are the scariest team in the West in my opinion. They're the only team in the NBA I see that is able to beat OKC, Bulls and/or Heat in 7 games.

They are fine and don't need anything. Well, Z-Bo and his ~20-10's comeback.

.

jscott · Post #12 » by **jscott** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:08 pm

Purch wrote:I doubt Adelman's gonna let your frontoffice move D-Will. Especilly if he belives that he can learn the 3 effectively in the offseason.

Adelman doesn't believe he's a 3. He told Williams that he's a four and should work on that part of his game.

Post #13 » by **C.lupus** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:14 pm

Well he said he was going to keep Williams at the four for this year as to not throw too much at him in his rookie year with no offseason. I personally think he can play the three. He isn't ideal and might struggle defensively against quicker wings but he will be a major matchup problem for opposing SFs on offense.

Post #14 » by **Klomp** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:39 pm

Don't we have this discussion every week?

horaceworthy · Post #15 » by **horaceworthy** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:13 pm

shrink wrote:I don't think anyone is eager to dump him, but is willing to listen if he can bring back a legitimate impact player at a position of need.

That's true for some, but there are plenty eager to dump him.

jscott wrote:
Purch wrote:I doubt Adelman's gonna let your frontoffice move D-Will. Especilly if he belives that he can learn the 3 effectively in the offseason.

Adelman doesn't believe he's a 3. He told Williams that he's a four and should work on that part of his game.

Adelman said that he was going to let Williams focus on the 4 to start his NBA career. Since then he's spent a decent amount of time guarding and being guarded by 3's, and started two games at the position. Adelman never said he didn't believe Williams is a 3. Honestly, Williams isn't a 3 or a 4, he's just a forward. The Wolves will get the most value out of him by giving him time at each position.

People are way too quick to throw in the towel on Williams around here, which seems ridiculous to me given how much positive there's been to focus on this season. We don't quite know what we have in Williams, or at the 2 or the 5 for the most part at the moment. We're better off letting the whole thing marinate for awhile than making some kneejerk move. The Wolves are competitive now, but they're still a young team who will require patience while they grow.

guille_4 · Post #16 » by **guille_4** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:23 pm

There is no way Memphis is moving Marc Gasol. I'd go as far as saying he is the least tradable non-allstar there is in the league. He belongs there and people absolutely love him.

I would go for Marcin Gortat, IMO he is one of the top 10 Centers in the league. I also don't think DWill is enough by himself to bring any of those guys, not even Monroe.

Krapinsky · Post #17 » by **Krapinsky** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:37 pm

I'd move him for someone like Gordon or in a package for Bynum but have no interest in just dumping him for anything less than guys like that (i.e. Gortat). I'm optimistic that with an entire offseason with the team he might be able to slim down and learn the SF position, but it's definitely not going to happen this year.

yowyOw · Post #18 » by **yowyOw** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:41 pm

I think it's too early to trade D-Will. Everybody knows he has the potential to play A LOT better, and he has shown that in many games when he had self-confidence, coach's and minutes.

Unlike Beas, who has the potential to be a top5 SF in the league, D-Will has THE WILL to be a better player and help his team.

Let's wait until his value as asset is a bit higher. And if he turns out to be a machine, then we'd have no reasons to trade him.

.

NewWolvesOrder · Post #19 » by **NewWolvesOrder** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:56 pm

What if Williams stays longterm as our scorer off the bench, a tweener forward that backs up SF plus backs up Love and plays some minutes next to him as a PF. Let say 14 minutes at SF + 20 min at PF. Gives us 15-18 ppg and 6-8 rpg. Would it be a wasted 2nd pick?

Post #20 » by **C.lupus** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 7:37 pm

Turnover_21 wrote:What if Williams stays longterm as our scorer off the bench, a tweener forward that backs up SF plus backs up Love and plays some minutes next to him as a PF. Let say 14 minutes at SF + 20 min at PF. Gives us 15-18 ppg and 6-8 rpg. Would it be a wasted 2nd pick?

Not in my book. If he can produce and help the team win, that's all I care about. Is Harden a wasted #3?