Oswalt says No to Jays

dagger · Post #1 » by **dagger** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 4:46 pm

http://blogs.thescore.com/mlb/2012/01/3 ... no-thanks/

tecumseh18 · Post #2 » by **tecumseh18** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:07 pm

dagger wrote:http://blogs.thescore.com/mlb/2012/01/30/roy-oswalt-thanks-but-no-thanks/

Can't knock AA for not trying. This didn't seem to be a anti-Canadian thing, more of a which end of continent he prefers to pitch in. I guess that's a relief. Sorta.

But that's exactly why going for Darvish made sense (assuming he wasn't tied to pitching on the West side of the continent). Getting US free agents to sign here is always a chore. Remember the riders (literally in his wife's case) to AJ's contract.

MGD24 · Post #3 » by **MGD24** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 7:17 pm

I'm happy he's not interested! An injury just waiting to happen

Post #4 » by **Nolan** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 7:20 pm

I'm guessing that along with playing close to home that he wants to play for a contender and Toronto is neither in the southern US or a contender.

Homer Jay · Post #5 » by **Homer Jay** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 7:58 pm

Doesn't sound too bad, as he turned down a contender like Detroit as well. If he does end up on the Sox I will be choked thou.

UN-Owen · Post #6 » by **UN-Owen** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:37 pm

tecumseh18 wrote:
dagger wrote:http://blogs.thescore.com/mlb/2012/01/30/roy-oswalt-thanks-but-no-thanks/

Can't knock AA for not trying. This didn't seem to be a anti-Canadian thing, more of a which end of continent he prefers to pitch in. I guess that's a relief. Sorta.

But that's exactly why going for Darvish made sense (assuming he wasn't tied to pitching on the West side of the continent). Getting US free agents to sign here is always a chore. Remember the riders (literally in his wife's case) to AJ's contract.

Jack Morris
Dave Winfield
Paul Molitor
Dave Stewart
Roger Clemens

Future Hall of Famers chose Toronto when the Jays were winning

tecumseh18 · Post #7 » by **tecumseh18** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:29 pm

UN-Owen wrote:
Jack Morris
Dave Winfield
Paul Molitor
Dave Stewart
Roger Clemens

Future Hall of Famers chose Toronto when the Jays were winning

We weren't winning when pre-steroids, bottomed-out in his career Clemens signed with us. And the others were definitely doing some late-career ring chasing (although Molitor actually lived here during the off-season. What a swell guy he was - on top of hitting .444 in the 93 series IIRC). Obviously we're not in a position to attract those types, which I guess Oswalt would be.

In the last five to six years, after 15 seasons of ineptitude, it's been AJ, BJ and Big Hurt-sized contracts to the big names, with not much to show for it.

Avenger · Post #8 » by **Avenger** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:33 pm

tecumseh18 wrote:
UN-Owen wrote:
Jack Morris
Dave Winfield
Paul Molitor
Dave Stewart
Roger Clemens

Future Hall of Famers chose Toronto when the Jays were winning

We weren't winning when pre-steroids, bottomed-out in his career Clemens signed with us. And the others were definitely doing some late-career ring chasing (although Molitor actually lived here during the off-season. What a swell guy he was - on top of hitting .444 in the 93 series IIRC). Obviously we're not in a position to attract those types, which I guess Oswalt would be.

In the last five to six years, after 15 seasons of ineptitude, it's been AJ, BJ and Big Hurt-sized contracts to the big names, with not much to show for it.

Maybe that has something to do with the fact that the Jays haven't made competitive offers to big name free agents? There has never been a player that has turned down the Jays because they don't like the city or playing in Canada.

Oswalt turned us down because he wants to be on a contender and more importantly he wants to pad his stats pitching in a crappy division that will help him get a big contract next summer.

The inferiority complex is ridiculous enough on the Raptors board, we don't need that nonsense here.

Secueritae · Post #9 » by **Secueritae** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:12 pm

Good, he's 34 and we don't want a stop-gap but a mid/long term reliable player.

J-Roc · Post #10 » by **J-Roc** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 12:39 am

Interesting that AA was interested in Oswalt.

Sounds like baseball is going the way of other sports.....players not just looking to play for money or a larger role, but looking to jump onto the bandwagon of a winning team.

Randle McMurphy · Post #11 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 1:04 am

tecumseh18 wrote:
UN-Owen wrote:
Jack Morris
Dave Winfield
Paul Molitor
Dave Stewart
Roger Clemens

Future Hall of Famers chose Toronto when the Jays were winning

We weren't winning when pre-steroids, bottomed-out in his career Clemens signed with us. And the others were definitely doing some late-career ring chasing (although Molitor actually lived here during the off-season. What a swell guy he was - on top of hitting .444 in the 93 series IIRC). Obviously we're not in a position to attract those types, which I guess Oswalt would be.

In the last five to six years, after 15 seasons of ineptitude, it's been AJ, BJ and Big Hurt-sized contracts to the big names, with not much to show for it.

I know this is irrelevant to your point, but I highly doubt Roger Clemens started using steroids in Toronto. He would have surely been exposed to them both in college and with the Sox in the 80s.

Randle McMurphy · Post #12 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 1:06 am

All I can say about this is that I'm glad that at least tried to get Oswalt. It's not surprising that he wouldn't want to pitch for a team that isn't likely to make the playoffs in a division where he would find it hard to put up good #'s.

Michael Bradley · Post #13 » by **Michael Bradley** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 1:22 am

The Jays signed Burnett and Ryan by overpaying them. In Ryan's case it was the amount of years and in Burnett's case it was practically a case of Ricciardi bending over in front of him (five year deal which was big at the time, opt-out after three years, limited no-trade clause, and free rides for his wife). That same off-season the Jays were able to convince Troy Glaus to waive his no-trade clause to come to Toronto by adding a player option to his existing deal. In other words, if the Jays, much like EVERY team in baseball, create a player friendly contract, they will be able to attract players. Ricciardi created player friendly contracts. Too friendly in some cases. Even when re-signing his own talent, outside of Aaron HIll, Ricciardi put the player in the position of power more often than not.

Contrast that with AA. Not a single contract he has signed has included anything that benefits the player. Every contract benefits the team. That is good for the long-term flexibility of the club, but that type of philosophy is not going to carry over to free agents looking for the best contract.

The Jays can sign free agents, just not under AA (unless he changes). In Oswalt's case, it was related to location and possibly difficulty of division (so he can get a better contract next year). The Jays are not the Raptors. Not even close.

hyper316 · Post #14 » by **hyper316** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 1:57 am

^ very good point. would be hard to attract top flight FA/player with no trade clause at this point. dont get me wrong, AA is doing a fine job right now. maybe once the team shows more improvement, AA can go over the top and offer a good contract to get that star FA/player with no trade clause to come to Toronto

Post #15 » by **spykelee** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 3:45 pm

10 million a season... :lol:

kelso · Post #16 » by **kelso** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 7:28 pm

tecumseh18 wrote:
UN-Owen wrote:
Jack Morris
Dave Winfield
Paul Molitor
Dave Stewart
Roger Clemens

Future Hall of Famers chose Toronto when the Jays were winning

We weren't winning when pre-steroids, bottomed-out in his career Clemens signed with us. And the others were definitely doing some late-career ring chasing (although Molitor actually lived here during the off-season. What a swell guy he was - on top of hitting .444 in the 93 series IIRC). Obviously we're not in a position to attract those types, which I guess Oswalt would be.

The Jays were 88-74 in 1998 (the 2nd year Clemens pitched here)...88 wins is the most since 99 wins in 1993 when we won the world series. The pre-steroids comment is also incorrect.

In the last five to six years, after 15 seasons of ineptitude, it's been AJ, BJ and Big Hurt-sized contracts to the big names, with not much to show for it.

tecumseh18 · Post #17 » by **tecumseh18** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 10:33 pm

kelso wrote:The Jays were 88-74 in 1998 (the 2nd year Clemens pitched here)...88 wins is the most since 99 wins in 1993 when we won the world series. The pre-steroids comment is also incorrect.

Uh, the Jays had a losing record in each of the three seasons before Clemens signed here. And then proceeded to go 76-86 in his first season. The point is how difficult is is to draw FAs (who aren't apparently on their last legs, as Clemens was) to a losing team. What's your position?

As for the steroids/PED issue, I haven't spent any time examining this issue lately, but Clemens' dramatic career resurrection (to the point where - of course - the Jays would never be able to keep him) occurred in Toronto. Apart from the testimony of the various seedy characters involved, what is the obvious inference?
'

BobbyBoy · Post #18 » by **BobbyBoy** » Wed Feb 1, 2012 2:36 am

Just read this article
http://www.yardbarker.com/mlb/articles/ ... lt/9695188
It pretty much says that if the rangers sign Oswalt then Harrison might become available and he could be a good option for jays.