2012 NBA Draft

[ScramboD8]

Davis or Drummond would be huge on this team. Get rid of McGee. I know this team have lots of needs but a solid center with Wall being this teams future would be a move forward.

I like Sullinger, Lamb, MKG, Beal, Barnes and those guys but I think if you can get a stand out big man with a great PG you have a good future.

Rivers is awesome but he's not a top-5 pick this year and even though I love his game I'd rather have a good big man on this team.

[fishercob]

Question (and I don't know the answer) - If Barnes measures as tall or taller than Robinson, does that go into the decision-making process on whether to choose Barnes or Robinson if you're picking 4th and Davis, MKG, and Drummond are off the board?

I've thought about that because they are both neck and neck to me. I think Barnes comes in at 6'7.5" w/o shoes and Robinson at 6'8.5" w/o shoes, so im not to worried about that. I need to see more of these guys going into the tourney before I can make a real judgement.
But I have said my prediction all along is that Barnes is a guy who is extremelly focused and sees the big picture. He is going with the flow of the team and trying to stay healthy. When the ACC tourney and March come around, I think the light is gonna trun on much like Kemba last year and your going to see some impressive performances from this kid.
With that said, I see much of the same in Robinson, MKG, Beal, and Davis. Any of these five guys would be welcome on ANY team i rooted for.

Agreed. Guys I like are Davis, MKG, RObinson, Sullinger, Beal. Iffy on Barnes. Very wary of Drummond. Want no part of Perry Jones.

[tontoz]

At least Barnes showed some post game and got to the line 12 times last night. Still not comfortable picking him though.

[Mizerooskie]

If you think I was hard on Barnes, I like him better than PJ III right now. I am sure Harrison Barnes is a solid shooter who can score at the rim and from deep. Perry Jones gets the least out of the most talent. He's Lamar Odom with a Kwame Brown mindset.

PJIII had 5 points in the loss to Kansas last night. Barnes has scored 6 or 8 points 4 or 5 other games this season. Jones is a very inconsistent rebounder. He's got a terrible AST/TO ratio--he doesn't get more than 1 AST per game. Jones is a poor three point shooter. PJIII is not a power player. PJIII is the single most overrated player I have seen is a long, long time.

Barnes has been in single digits 3 times this season:

6 points in 24 minutes in a 73-56 UNC win over Miami.
9 points in 21 minutes in a 50 point UNC win over Nicholls St.
9 points in 26 minutes in a 15 point UNC win over App. St. (which was a 16 point lead at half time).

He's been double digits every other game, and was only under 15 points on 2 other occasions.

Barnes catches WAY too much flak on here. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he's the second best player to come out of this draft.

[7-Day Dray]

I've been souring on Barnes as of late. He had a good game last night, being able to actually dribble the ball and subsequently put it in the rim, but his play early in the game raised some of my concerns. Harrison Barnes has shown no off the dribble game this year, not just this game. He’s too easy to defend. He has not improve his handle or ability to create for himself this year. He’s basically a passive jump shooter with size. He’s average on D, a good rebounder, but he is an unimaginative shot creator and struggles to get good shots. He got to the free throw line because he’s an instinctive rebounder who drew contact fighting for boards and getting up shots on the offensive glass.

[Ruzious]

I've been souring on Barnes as of late. He had a good game last night, being able to actually dribble the ball and subsequently put it in the rim, but his play early in the game raised some of my concerns. Harrison Barnes has shown no off the dribble game this year, not just this game. He’s too easy to defend. He has not improve his handle or ability to create for himself this year. He’s basically a passive jump shooter with size. He’s average on D, a good rebounder, but he is an unimaginative shot creator and struggles to get good shots. He got to the free throw line because he’s an instinctive rebounder who drew contact fighting for boards and getting up shots on the offensive glass.

You're ignoring that he showed a very good post-up game - thought it was against players much smaller than him. He showed a lot in the 2nd half of that game. A SF who can post up and hit 3's with such a quick release - plus he's got a very effective jab step to create space, and when he focuses - he's a really good defender - he's got a lot of value. If you look around the NBA, there's a surprising shortage of good young SF's - and he's about it in this draft. I see more focus and aggression in his game in crunch time, and I think it's a mistake to label him a passive player.

Multrie beasting tonight against Ole Miss. It's halftime, and I think he had 6 slam dunks. The way they're defending him, maybe they should call themselves Olay Miss. Renaldo Sidney's playing the wrong sport. He should either be a defensive tackle or a professional rassler.

[pancakes3]

well what's keeping me from chugging the barnes-flavored koolaid is the lack of playmaking. you take away the ability to generate 2-3 apg and you remove the difference between an all-star and just another guy in the league.

also, honestly, i don't think there's a shortage of SF's in the league who blend size and shooting. in fact, i think sf is the deepest position in the league right now, even our golden age of point guards. outside of the top 10 guys of lebron, durant, melo, etc. there's probably upwards of 20 "serviceable" sf's who can give you 12-15 pts and 5-8 rebounds ranging from guys like caron and marion to guys like outlaw, batum, and anthony randolph. there's even a bunch of white dudes. budinger, gallo, kleiza, dunleavy, korver...

i just don't think barnes is the type of talent that would even top... marvin williams much less rudy gay and much much less a top 10 sf list in his career.

now i'm depressed that we've got like 20 sf's on this team and none of them seem to be even "serviceable".

[dangermouse]

That is pretty much why I soured on Barnes quickly. We need an alpha dog like MKG. If we dont land Davis, we should just pick MKG and try to fill our other holes in free agency.

[spaceman_E]

Barnes is playing as a Sophomore at 19. He's already lights out from 3 with a lightning release, solid athleticism and defense and an improving dribble. I don't think he fits our team this draft as much as a dominant post prospect but he is still a fantastic fallback option.

[REDardWIZskin]

Good to see that the Barnes hate is tempering a little bit, while he's not first on our board i think we can all agree that he'd be a good fallback option if we are stricken with lottery misfortune which will probably happen if Curse O' Les Boulez has any say in it. smfh

[Ruzious]

well what's keeping me from chugging the barnes-flavored koolaid is the lack of playmaking. you take away the ability to generate 2-3 apg and you remove the difference between an all-star and just another guy in the league.

also, honestly, i don't think there's a shortage of SF's in the league who blend size and shooting. in fact, i think sf is the deepest position in the league right now, even our golden age of point guards. outside of the top 10 guys of lebron, durant, melo, etc. there's probably upwards of 20 "serviceable" sf's who can give you 12-15 pts and 5-8 rebounds ranging from guys like caron and marion to guys like outlaw, batum, and anthony randolph. there's even a bunch of white dudes. budinger, gallo, kleiza, dunleavy, korver...

i just don't think barnes is the type of talent that would even top... marvin williams much less rudy gay and much much less a top 10 sf list in his career.

now i'm depressed that we've got like 20 sf's on this team and none of them seem to be even "serviceable".

My point was about the lack of young SF's. When guys like Kleiza and Buddinger are among the guys you point out as among the best, you know there's a shortage. Really, the last 3 drafts have been sorely lacking. Paul George is the only guy I noticed that's looking upper echelon, and he's not a guy you think of as 1st or 2nd scoring option.

Anyway, speaking of Ind, Granger is the comp I use for Barnes (Others use Deng.). Granger's a heckuva player without being a play-maker. At his peak (He had a knee injury that took some of his athleticism away), he got 25 PPG while being one of the top wing defenders in the game. I could definitely live with that. To be clear, I think Granger in his prime is Barnes' ceiling - with no guarantee he reaches it.

[llcc25]

We need to come out of this offseason with 4 new starters that are either good or very good. At this point, I don't know that we have another starter besides Wall that can be classified in either category and that is the problem. Our 4 other starters right now are either serviceable or below that. That just won't cut it. Once we add our 4 good to very good starters, like CHI who surrounded Rose w/ good or very good players in year 3, Wall IMO can take that leap to being "franchise great". I think this is very possible given our cap flexibility and likely draft position. Here is my action plan to get this done:

1) Draft young PF stud that will be starter from Day 1 (my choice is Sullinger, Robinson 2nd)
2) Try to acquire the best avail RFA C in market in this order (HIbbert, Monroe, BLopez). If we whiff, possibly keep McGee for one year tender or get a stop gap via trade like Pekovic or Dalembert.
3) Get stud SG EGordon (i believe we'll be able to offer more than INDY and NO given their cap situation and need to sign their existing players)
4) Get a good FA SF like Batum or Chandler

This would be next year's starting lineup with how I would classify them next year in ( ):
PG-Wall (very good to great)
SG-Gordon (very good)
SF-Batum or Chandler (Good)
PF-Sullinger (Good to Very Good)
C- Range of worst case scenario of McGee (Serviceable) to best case scenario Hibbert (Very Good)

If you compare to CHI's team in Rose's 3rd yr, IMO our lineup would be close or on par with them in that year:
PG-Rose (great)
SG-Bogans/Korver (serviceable to good)
SF-Deng (good)
PF-Boozer (very good)
C-Noah (good)

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

If you think I was hard on Barnes, I like him better than PJ III right now. I am sure Harrison Barnes is a solid shooter who can score at the rim and from deep. Perry Jones gets the least out of the most talent. He's Lamar Odom with a Kwame Brown mindset.

PJIII had 5 points in the loss to Kansas last night. JONES has sored 6 or 8 points 4 or 5 other games this season. Jones is a very inconsistent rebounder. He's got a terrible AST/TO ratio--he doesn't get more than 1 AST per game. Jones is a poor three point shooter. PJIII is not a power player. PJIII is the single most overrated player I have seen is a long, long time.

Barnes has been in single digits 3 times this season:

6 points in 24 minutes in a 73-56 UNC win over Miami.
9 points in 21 minutes in a 50 point UNC win over Nicholls St.
9 points in 26 minutes in a 15 point UNC win over App. St. (which was a 16 point lead at half time).

He's been double digits every other game, and was only under 15 points on 2 other occasions.

Barnes catches WAY too much flak on here. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he's the second best player to come out of this draft.

Fixed.

[dobrojim]

quick suggestion re the draft discussion

if there is a player you are discussing and you have some
knowledge of when they might next be on TV, post that info.

For instance Kentucky is playing Vandy on Sat night IIRC.
This would be a good opportunity to see all the UK guys
and this Jenkins kid also being mentioned.

some of us old guys need reminders as we suffer from CRS.

[Ruzious]

quick suggestion re the draft discussion

if there is a player you are discussing and you have some
knowledge of when they might next be on TV, post that info.

For instance Kentucky is playing Vandy on Sat night IIRC.
This would be a good opportunity to see all the UK guys
and this Jenkins kid also being mentioned.

some of us old guys need reminders as we suffer from CRS.

Heads up when you watch Vandy - also watch for Jeff Taylor - a more athletic and bigger wing than Jenkins who's greatly improved his jump shot - which used to be considered a major weakness of his. But he's a bit over-aged, so I'd rather have Jenkins..

[fishercob]

quick suggestion re the draft discussion

if there is a player you are discussing and you have some
knowledge of when they might next be on TV, post that info.

For instance Kentucky is playing Vandy on Sat night IIRC.
This would be a good opportunity to see all the UK guys
and this Jenkins kid also being mentioned.

some of us old guys need reminders as we suffer from CRS.

Jimmy, this is the best year in recent memory to scout lotto talent because so much of it is condensed on marquee, oft-televised college teams and there are no Euro prospects. Here's who you should try to catch if you have time:

UConn (Drummond, Lamb)
Ohio State (Sullinger)
Baylor (Jones, Q Miller)
Carolina (Barnes, Zeller, Henson)
Kentucky (Davis, Kidd-Gilchrist, T Jones)
Duke (Rivers)
Florida, (Beal)
Kansas (Robinson)

Illinois, Washington and Mississippt St, Vandy and Mizzou are worth watching too.

[REDardWIZskin]

quick suggestion re the draft discussion

if there is a player you are discussing and you have some
knowledge of when they might next be on TV, post that info.

For instance Kentucky is playing Vandy on Sat night IIRC.
This would be a good opportunity to see all the UK guys
and this Jenkins kid also being mentioned.

some of us old guys need reminders as we suffer from CRS.

Heads up when you watch Vandy - also watch for Jeff Taylor - a more athletic and bigger wing than Jenkins who's greatly improved his jump shot - which used to be considered a major weakness of his. But he's a bit over-aged, so I'd rather have Jenkins..

Jeff Taylor seems like a "Spurs Pick" if we get another 1st rounder we need a shooter, whether its Taylor, Lamb or Jenkins.

Did anyone realize that Adonis Thomas is shooting 41% from 3? I need to see him play. I saw him early in the maui invitational against GTOWN but that was his first week of college bball. He may be playing better now

[The Consiglieri]

That is pretty much why I soured on Barnes quickly. We need an alpha dog like MKG. If we dont land Davis, we should just pick MKG and try to fill our other holes in free agency.

The fact that MKG is as young as he is and yet that mature, that he (and Davis for that matter) are that coachable, that motivated, that hard working, have motors like that, and are genuine students of the game tells me that both won't suddenly stop learning and growing after the draft in June (if they both declare for it). I think MKG will develop the skills to play a complete offensive game, and if he does, he makes a lot more sense than Barnes because he brings far far far more to the table than Barnes. I wonder what our draft board will look like come April/May. MKG is definitely atop mine save for Davis. I just think he offers us everything we need and in the worst way save for the offensive game which considering his work habits and BBIQ, is something I have a hard time believing won't improve with time.

[REDardWIZskin]

at first I struggled to understand the love for MKG because he seemed like a corey brewer to me but When i hear the Scottie Pippen comparisons it kind of makes me see how soo many have him so highly regarded.

[The Consiglieri]

Good to see that the Barnes hate is tempering a little bit, while he's not first on our board i think we can all agree that he'd be a good fallback option if we are stricken with lottery misfortune which will probably happen if Curse O' Les Boulez has any say in it. smfh

Barnes is like Sully to me, if we got completely hosed in the draft, Barnes would be an option, but if we have a top 5 pick, i would not be picking him at any of those top 5 slots period. Of course the GM's and scouts appear to disagree in their evals. Not really sure why. Know that Ford said there are comparison's to Pierce which is something i don't see at all, but maybe I should have my glasses on?