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The Plan - Revealed

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The Plan - Revealed 

Post#1 » by JohnVancouver » Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:38 pm

from AZCentral:

"(The FO) believes a return to being an elite team will come from better drafting, wise personnel moves via trades and free agency, and taking advantage of the significant amount of salary-cap space it will have available next season.

Sarver: "Our goal is to transition back to elite status," Sarver said, "and to get there sooner than later."

Read more: http://www.azcentral.com/sports/suns/ar ... z1mZi10W5Y


Well, I have to say I'm glad to hear that. I like the plan, too - much better than crappier drafting, bad personnel moves and blowing cap space ... alos approve of the idea that sucking for a shorter period of time is preferable to doing it longer.

Seriously - are these elements and moves not completely self-evident? Why would you announce these?
What were the plans that didn't make the cut?

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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#2 » by Scubetrolis » Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:45 pm

this will be an interesting off season.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#3 » by Miklo » Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:10 pm

Perfect post JVC...I skimmed the article, then was reading your post and thinking, "this is ridiculous...what a poor attempt at a PR spin by the Suns" - and then I got to the part where you said the same thing.

I've become convinced that Sarver just thinks all the fans are complete idiots. They did "extensive research" to find what your average RealGMer talks about every day. Different rebuilds, how they've worked out, etc. Whether good drafting is better than bad drafting, or wise personnel moves are better than stupid ones. To be quite honest the Suns' PR efforts this season have had the opposite effect on me. I don't care if my team is losing, as long as there's a plan or competent moves are being made. And it's yet another thing for moves not to seem smart. But beyond both of those is when your FO and coach are making idiotic moves, and turning around and saying they have a master plan worked out. When are these smarter moves starting? They certainly weren't in effect this offseason, or thus far this season.

And wait a minute. Full rebuilds can take 8-10 years? True, oftentimes they do. But they've just as often happened in 3-5 years, at least getting to the point where it's a playoff team. And getting stuck in mediocrity can last the entire lifetime of a franchise so again, what's the plan here?

My other thing with the FO is, why do you bring in Babby and Blanks only to keep treading water - he's basically just brought on more figureheads of a failing team. And please give Babby a permanent gag order, every article where there's not a quote from him I breathe a sigh of relief. I think the fans, or at least I, would be happier if we blew it up, brought in new management who immediately took the microphone and came right out to the fans talking about why the BS is over, what and when things will happen.

Anyway, I'll stop here because I could go on forever.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#4 » by thamadkant » Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:36 pm

Babby said same thing a few months ago hence why I'm so pro tanking this year and maybe next also depending on who is on the roster next season. We can absorb a bad contract with 2-3 years left for another lottery pick and hope that bad contract player fits well.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#5 » by RunDogGun » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:27 pm

1UPZ wrote:Babby said same thing a few months ago hence why I'm so pro tanking this year and maybe next also depending on who is on the roster next season. We can absorb a bad contract with 2-3 years left for another lottery pick and hope that bad contract player fits well.


"And hope he fits well" but has "2-3 years left"? Fits well in your "purposely lose games to get high draft picks" plan?

I seem to remember the Bobcats having a bunch of high draft picks, let's go through them and see how many of them are still on their team: Okafor #2 pick, Felton #5 pick (same year May #13 pick), Brandon Wright #7 or 8 I forget, and Adam Morrison #3 pick. Guess how many are still on their team? :lol:

I included May, because if we were to get a high pick, say the fifth spot, and grabbed another lotto pick from through trade, we could be drafting exactly the same.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#6 » by thamadkant » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:29 pm

well done RunDog

NIT PICK bad draft picks and leave out the good ones... yup well done to put forth an argument.

And Okafor is as good as Gortat stuck on a bad team.... yet you cream your pants over Gortat.
I can almost guarantee Okafor being a 15ppg 10rpg 2bpg on the Suns too, he is a work horse.


In the end it doesnt matter if YOU HATE the draft pick path.... the Suns FO will do their due diligence and make decisions that they FEEL will do well for the Suns future.... I'm sure they arent content being 9th or 10th seed which I highly share with them.... either be LEGIT or do everything to BE LEGIT.

Being stuck with old players and role players from the draft is purgatory.

I understand Suns fans hating losing.... but some of us pro-tankers are beyond getting mad at losing... we look at the ROOT cause of the reasons why we are losing... and thats because we dont have enough TALENT.

If your content fighting for 8th spot and doing nothing else then be free to do that... its a free world.

But I'm sure Suns FO and many other fans can understand my stance on drafting a new franchise player.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#7 » by RunDogGun » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:52 pm

I've never said I hate the "draft path", I have said over and over that it needs to be all three (draft, trade, and FAs). I am surprised you haven't got that yet. :roll: I just think it is funny that the same people that don't trust our FO to make good decisions, expect them to make good choices come draft day.

Okafor does work hard, but he went number two, while Gortat works just as hard and he went number fifty-seven. You sort of proved my point for me. Oh, and Gortat cost less. I didn't leave out guys, I mentioned all their top eight picks, because that is the number picks you want us to be drafting 1-8, right?

Felton left them for nothing, Wright they traded for JRich, who they traded to us for Diaw, or Bell, however you want to look at it. Morrison was a throw in to LA for Rad, who isn't on their squad. Okafor was had for an injured Chandler, who at the time sucked. And now they are back on this cycle of sucking for another high draft pick. How long do you predict they will come out of this cycle? When they get their next #2,3,5,8?
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#8 » by 7Insomniac » Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:03 am

» Steve Nash isn't going anywhere, unless he chooses to leave.


Nash hasn't said a damn word about returning. He keeps on saying that he'll "honor his contract". They're taking a massive gamble on building around a guy that most likely won't even be in the league in 3 years.

» The organization has no interest in a full-scale "blowing up" of the team, because its research shows that process can take from eight to 10 years and it has no interest in waiting that long.


Every teams rebuilding period and front office is different. Some teams have a guy to build around, others don't. We have a ****** front office, and nobody to build around. It certainly doesn't look good.

» It believes a return to being an elite team will come from better drafting, wise personnel moves via trades and free agency, and taking advantage of the significant amount of salary-cap space it will have available next season.


Well no ****.

After much research into rebuilding fazes, I've come to the conclusion that the front office is clinging to any hope they have that they will make the playoffs in the next 3 years. They're hoping that they can mask the fact that this team is going nowhere long enough to get good players through the draft and free agency. The problem with this is that we'll be drafting nothing but role players, and it's going to be a while until a big name free agent is going to be available or is willing to come here. We'd be heading down the road of the Denver Nuggets, and that's the optimistic scenario in 3 years. Not good enough the win a championship, but good enough to make the playoffs every year. We'd be stuck in mediocrity AGAIN without a star player. They're just delaying the inevitable.

I'd rather have this team get stomped on and hope for a savior through the draft than be the 4-6 seed and lose in the playoffs every year and repeat the same damn process year after year.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#9 » by RaisingArizona » Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:46 am

Hopefully we can all say this next year

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKp8mYzsQzo[/youtube]
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#10 » by Kerrsed » Fri Feb 17, 2012 1:09 am

This article is fluffy trash. Where do they say ANYTHING about a plan besides the "better drafting, wise personnel moves via trades and free agency, and taking advantage of the significant amount of salary-cap space it will have available next season" rabble that EVERY TEAM SAYS. Did Babby just read the NBA GMing For Dummys book?

Hell, they have been telling us the same thing every year, "We will draft a decent player, will make smart FA moves and gain some good players in trades". EVERY YEAR! EVERY TEAM!

No talking about who we are looking at in FA, who we are looking at in the draft, who we would like to acquire in trade. Nothing.

Their so called plan is just PR spin that is said year in and year out. Only thing they really said is that we wont blow it up, and that makes sense, as we cant get rid of Warrick or Childress, and will not use the amnesty on either of them. It will just expire. So, thats 2 people that we are stuck with long term.

I serious read the article and Laughed out loud. It says absolutely nothing about our plans, and just shows me that our FO really doesnt have one yet.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#11 » by Cutter » Fri Feb 17, 2012 2:22 am

Article just restated what most people on these boards already know.

- Suns aren't trading Nash.
- Tanking for draft picks is too risky so Suns aren't going that route.
- Suns will rebuild through draft, trades, FA aquisitions.
- Suns want to be competitive and go back to "elite status".

Stuff most already know and have endlessly debated.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#12 » by RunSunRun » Fri Feb 17, 2012 3:59 am

Yes, nothing says wanting to be elite again like Sebastian Telfair and Shannon Brown :lol:

Smart free agent moves, you mean like severely overpaying roleplayers like Hakim Warrick, Channing Frye, and Josh Childress, instead of just resigning the all star we already had? :lol:

And being smarter with draft picks? You mean like maybe not trading a 2nd round draft pick in a loaded draft away while giving up a viable backup PG in Dragic for a rental of Aaron Brooks, :lol:

I can't help but laugh how ridiculous that article is. Maybe I'm overly cynical, but that article was just insulting to my intelligence. I'm just glad others feel the same.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#13 » by thamadkant » Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:11 am

I can almost guarantee that atleast several teams are planning to do the same as Babby and Suns FO.... that plan by FO is indeed not some sort of secret plan that no one else has though of.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#14 » by RunDogGun » Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:39 am

RunSunRun wrote:Yes, nothing says wanting to be elite again like Sebastian Telfair and Shannon Brown :lol:

Smart free agent moves, you mean like severely overpaying roleplayers like Hakim Warrick, Channing Frye, and Josh Childress, instead of just resigning the all star we already had? :lol:

And being smarter with draft picks? You mean like maybe not trading a 2nd round draft pick in a loaded draft away while giving up a viable backup PG in Dragic for a rental of Aaron Brooks, :lol:

I can't help but laugh how ridiculous that article is. Maybe I'm overly cynical, but that article was just insulting to my intelligence. I'm just glad others feel the same.


We gave a first last year with Goran for a rental on Brooks. :D The second was for Chilldress. :( It was the right thing to do, not re-signing Amare, but it wasn't our current FO that did it, it was Sarver. But they did drop the ball on all of the other stuff. We could have signed a bunch of undrafted guys to fill out the roster and play them if we sucked. Oh well, nothing we can do about that. Sarver will still own this team.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#15 » by Azsports77 » Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:41 am

That article shows just how big of an idiot Robert Sarver really is and the best plan Sarver if you really care is you selling the team asap. You really seriously think fans are stupid enough to buy into this trash you have yes men in the gm spot and you think an article is going to make people believe your trying to get this team back to elite status bs is what it is. You don't have the iq to rebuild this team and its showing your two yes men are dummies and don't help with that problem at all. If anything Suns fans this article reeks of we don't know what the hell we are doing but somehow we will get the team back to elite status only an idiot would believe that this front office could do that .
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#16 » by RunDogGun » Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:50 am

Too much debt, not enough assets to sell the team. You have no idea if the next owner would be even worse, more frugal, or even keep the team in Arizona. Grass is always greener.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#17 » by lilfishi22 » Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:54 am

Kerrsed wrote:This article is fluffy trash. Where do they say ANYTHING about a plan besides the "better drafting, wise personnel moves via trades and free agency, and taking advantage of the significant amount of salary-cap space it will have available next season" rabble that EVERY TEAM SAYS. Did Babby just read the NBA GMing For Dummys book?

Hell, they have been telling us the same thing every year, "We will draft a decent player, will make smart FA moves and gain some good players in trades". EVERY YEAR! EVERY TEAM!

No talking about who we are looking at in FA, who we are looking at in the draft, who we would like to acquire in trade. Nothing.

Their so called plan is just PR spin that is said year in and year out. Only thing they really said is that we wont blow it up, and that makes sense, as we cant get rid of Warrick or Childress, and will not use the amnesty on either of them. It will just expire. So, thats 2 people that we are stuck with long term.

I serious read the article and Laughed out loud. It says absolutely nothing about our plans, and just shows me that our FO really doesnt have one yet.

Exactly my thoughts. Got absolutely nothing from this article. Basically Rebuilding for Dummys as you mentioned.
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#18 » by King Of Wang » Fri Feb 17, 2012 6:09 am

RunDogGun wrote:Too much debt, not enough assets to sell the team. You have no idea if the next owner would be even worse, more frugal, or even keep the team in Arizona. Grass is always greener.

nothing can be worse than sarver....period. worst owner in professional sports history. he makes donald sterling and michael jordan look like God owners
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#19 » by RunDogGun » Fri Feb 17, 2012 6:35 am

I take it that you don't know Bill Bidwill. Sarver isn't even the worst owner in Arizona. :lol:
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Re: The Plan - Revealed 

Post#20 » by MathiasPW » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:36 am

This must be the first thread in the season where most - if not all - of the posts agree on the main reasoning
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