Official Speculation & Free Agency Thread (PtXI, Mods close)

[MagicFan41]

It'd be pointless to get Ellis if we didn't have Dwight...

Everyone keeps saying this with basically no reasoning. It's pointless to get a guy at the PG spot who can potentially put up 25/4/6? For only $11mil a year? Why is it "pointless"? And stop with the whole thing about him being "inefficient". He shoots a way better % than Granger, Thornton, and other elite-level guards. His shooting % and other numbers are right on par with Wade, Kobe.

Because we would be in the same position as GSW. We'd suck because we wouldn't have a second star to pair him with.

No, not exactly. Throw a C into GSW like Kaman, who gets 17-10-2blks per 36min, and they would be a tough team. We also have a better coach. GSW often holds their own against elite opponents. They have had many losses this year by only a few points, that went down to the buzzer. I also think we would be deeper than they currently are.

[Reverse_Angle]

^^ i dont think monta plays winning basketball. I would want him in orlando for one thing he does well and for the same thing we lack. we would just give him the ball and have him score some points when the system produces nothing. he would be our plan b.

there are only 2 teams he would be a decent fit; us and bulls.

[G-Heel]

I know everybody is going to jump on my throat for this, but I think it's a very interesting insta-rebuild. Let me preface this by saying this would be pursued IF Dwight made it completely known by the trade deadline that he definitely won't re-sign with the Magic:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachi ... Id=7ljhjub

Replace JJ with Baby, machine wouldn't let me.

We all know GSW has said they would be willing to "rent" Dwight for a package like this. We all know NOH is shopping Kaman and would love to get back somebody like Ryan to build around.

Just think of how deep and talented this lineup could be:

Monta/Jameer
JJ/Thompson
JRich/Q
Lee/Earl
Kaman/?

Perhaps either GSW might throw in their 1st rounder or NOH could throw in Minny pick since it won't be anywhere near as good as they probably hoped, and they are going to have their own amazing pick this summer anyways. Obviously if you could somehow keep Ryan and still get Kaman, that would be great (maybe send over JRich instead of Ryan...but then you would have the issue of which of the 3 big-men came off of the bench (not always a bad problem to have though). Perhaps you could start Ryan at the 4, Lee at the 5 and have Kaman come off the bench, and rotate the 3 guys at each position to give each like 32 min playing time, depending on the opponent matchup. I personally think a trade like that gives us a very good starting 5, and a deep bench.

I'm sorry, but HELL NO!

Is it just me or is Ellis extremely overrated on our board? Trade Dwight for him, to do what? Be 9th seed and have a miniscule chance at the 1st pick? You also want to give up our only 2 remaining assets in JJ and Ryan Anderson for an overrated and overpaid David Lee.

Ellis is not that great guys, get over him. I wouldn't want to build around him. Why not just take the New Jersey package if we're going to trade Dwight?

[MagicFan41]

I know everybody is going to jump on my throat for this, but I think it's a very interesting insta-rebuild. Let me preface this by saying this would be pursued IF Dwight made it completely known by the trade deadline that he definitely won't re-sign with the Magic:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachi ... Id=7ljhjub

Replace JJ with Baby, machine wouldn't let me.

We all know GSW has said they would be willing to "rent" Dwight for a package like this. We all know NOH is shopping Kaman and would love to get back somebody like Ryan to build around.

Just think of how deep and talented this lineup could be:

Monta/Jameer
JJ/Thompson
JRich/Q
Lee/Earl
Kaman/?

Perhaps either GSW might throw in their 1st rounder or NOH could throw in Minny pick since it won't be anywhere near as good as they probably hoped, and they are going to have their own amazing pick this summer anyways. Obviously if you could somehow keep Ryan and still get Kaman, that would be great (maybe send over JRich instead of Ryan...but then you would have the issue of which of the 3 big-men came off of the bench (not always a bad problem to have though). Perhaps you could start Ryan at the 4, Lee at the 5 and have Kaman come off the bench, and rotate the 3 guys at each position to give each like 32 min playing time, depending on the opponent matchup. I personally think a trade like that gives us a very good starting 5, and a deep bench.

I'm sorry, but HELL NO!

Is it just me or is Ellis extremely overrated on our board? Trade Dwight for him, to do what? Be 9th seed and have a miniscule chance at the 1st pick? You also want to give up our only 2 remaining assets in JJ and Ryan Anderson for an overrated and overpaid David Lee.

Ellis is not that great guys, get over him. I wouldn't want to build around him. Why not just take the New Jersey package if we're going to trade Dwight?

First of all, no, I didn't give up either JJ or Ryan for David Lee. Perhaps you should re-read what I said. Secondly, no, Monta, at his salary is not overrated. He is just stuck on a team with little defense and no real big man. That's a huge factor. If he were running the PG spot, he would put up 25-5-8 type numbers. Just because a guy doesn't play on a winning team doesn't mean he is "overrated". Look at Wade in Miami up until last year, or Deron in NJ this year.

For the record, that NJ trade pckg is gross. Talk about being a perennial 8th seed? THAT is what that package would net us. I would much rather try a Chicago trade of Noah+Deng+filler. Look how well Chicago has shown they can play without Rose. Throw in the fact we have much better shooting guards than them, Ryan is probably a bit better than Boozer, and maybe try to go after a PG after next year, and you could have a really solid team. Imagine a lineup of:

Monta
JRich
Deng
Ryan
Noah

Almost a perfectly constructed playoff team imo. Rose-esque PG in Monta (pretty good passer, slasher, can break down a defense and create own shot). Outside shooter in JRich. Lock-down defender, as well as good passer/scorer in Deng. Stretch-4 and awesome rebounder in Ryan. Ultra-high-energy defender/rebounder/passer in Noah.

(Keep hating on Monta, I don't care....I know he would be an amazing PG with the right pieces around him).

[G-Heel]

I know everybody is going to jump on my throat for this, but I think it's a very interesting insta-rebuild. Let me preface this by saying this would be pursued IF Dwight made it completely known by the trade deadline that he definitely won't re-sign with the Magic:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachi ... Id=7ljhjub

Replace JJ with Baby, machine wouldn't let me.

We all know GSW has said they would be willing to "rent" Dwight for a package like this. We all know NOH is shopping Kaman and would love to get back somebody like Ryan to build around.

Just think of how deep and talented this lineup could be:

Monta/Jameer
JJ/Thompson
JRich/Q
Lee/Earl
Kaman/?

Perhaps either GSW might throw in their 1st rounder or NOH could throw in Minny pick since it won't be anywhere near as good as they probably hoped, and they are going to have their own amazing pick this summer anyways. Obviously if you could somehow keep Ryan and still get Kaman, that would be great (maybe send over JRich instead of Ryan...but then you would have the issue of which of the 3 big-men came off of the bench (not always a bad problem to have though). Perhaps you could start Ryan at the 4, Lee at the 5 and have Kaman come off the bench, and rotate the 3 guys at each position to give each like 32 min playing time, depending on the opponent matchup. I personally think a trade like that gives us a very good starting 5, and a deep bench.

I'm sorry, but HELL NO!

Is it just me or is Ellis extremely overrated on our board? Trade Dwight for him, to do what? Be 9th seed and have a miniscule chance at the 1st pick? You also want to give up our only 2 remaining assets in JJ and Ryan Anderson for an overrated and overpaid David Lee.

Ellis is not that great guys, get over him. I wouldn't want to build around him. Why not just take the New Jersey package if we're going to trade Dwight?

First of all, no, I didn't give up either JJ or Ryan for David Lee. Perhaps you should re-read what I said. Secondly, no, Monta, at his salary is not overrated. He is just stuck on a team with little defense and no real big man. That's a huge factor. If he were running the PG spot, he would put up 25-5-8 type numbers. Just because a guy doesn't play on a winning team doesn't mean he is "overrated". Look at Wade in Miami up until last year, or Deron in NJ this year.

For the record, that NJ trade pckg is gross. Talk about being a perennial 8th seed? THAT is what that package would net us. I would much rather try a Chicago trade of Noah+Deng+filler. Look how well Chicago has shown they can play without Rose. Throw in the fact we have much better shooting guards than them, Ryan is probably a bit better than Boozer, and maybe try to go after a PG after next year, and you could have a really solid team. Imagine a lineup of:

Monta
JRich
Deng
Ryan
Noah

Almost a perfectly constructed playoff team imo. Rose-esque PG in Monta (pretty good passer, slasher, can break down a defense and create own shot). Outside shooter in JRich. Lock-down defender, as well as good passer/scorer in Deng. Stretch-4 and awesome rebounder in Ryan. Ultra-high-energy defender/rebounder/passer in Noah.

(Keep hating on Monta, I don't care....I know he would be an amazing PG with the right pieces around him).

How do you know that? That's like saying "I know JJ can be an all-star with more minutes". Also, how do you get Ellis, Deng, and Noah? Duplicate Dwight and trade him to both team or what?

OK, I reread your post. My mistake for not seeing the comment about replacing JJ with BBD. So, take out JJ. I still wouldn't do it. That package is crap, no matter how you look at it. Why you want to take Lee? He's horrible, dude got FIVE years left on his contract.

There's a reason no one else in the league talks about acquiring Monta, because he's a horrible fit almost everywhere. Maybe you can find a combination of pieces that perfectly compliment Monta Ellis, but do you think our front office can? We can't even build around Dwight for god's sake, and he's like the easiest person to build around. When the last time the Warriors made the playoffs? Great players can take their team to the playoffs once a while, even if they have bad players surrounding them. Great players improve their teams' win wherever they go, I can't say the same for Ellis. Trading Dwight for Ellis is absurd.

I still don't get how the Nets package is worse than this package. Brooks, Lopez, and a couple of picks isn't bad. Even just Bynum is better. But I'd rather let Dwight walks, to be honest with you. We're doing pretty good right now, so maybe just wait and see. Who knows, we may do damage in the playoff. Look at the Giants, people thought they'll miss the playoffs, but then they won the whole thing.

[MagicFan41]

How do you know that? That's like saying "I know JJ can be an all-star with more minutes". Also, how do you get Ellis, Deng, and Noah? Duplicate Dwight and trade him to both team or what?

OK, I reread your post. My mistake for not seeing the comment about replacing JJ with BBD. So, take out JJ. I still wouldn't do it. That package is crap, no matter how you look at it. Why you want to take Lee? He's horrible, dude got FIVE years left on his contract.

There's a reason no one else in the league talks about acquiring Monta, because he's a horrible fit almost everywhere. Maybe you can find a combination of pieces that perfectly compliment Monta Ellis, but do you think our front office can? We can't even build around Dwight for god's sake, and he's like the easiest person to build around. When the last time the Warriors made the playoffs? Great players can take their team to the playoffs once a while, even if they have bad players surrounding them. Great players improve their teams' win wherever they go, I can't say the same for Ellis. Trading Dwight for Ellis is absurd.

I still don't get how the Nets package is worse than this package. Brooks, Lopez, and a couple of picks isn't bad. Even just Bynum is better. But I'd rather let Dwight walks, to be honest with you. We're doing pretty good right now, so maybe just wait and see. Who knows, we may do damage in the playoff. Look at the Giants, people thought they'll miss the playoffs, but then they won the whole thing.

Obviously I don't KNOW that, but I'm pretty confident in that fact. He already IS a good player. That's why year after year he gets mentioned as being an "all-star snub". I think at the PG spot, instead of the SG spot, since he is undersized for a SG and oversized for a PG, he would flourish. Perhaps you should have a tiny bit of foresight before commenting...I didn't say to clone Dwight and trade him to both teams. If you trade Noah + Deng + CJ Watson for Dwight + Hedo, and then you let Jameer, JJ, Watson go after summer 2013...hopefully sign Ryno to a contract around the 8mil a year range this summer, you pretty much only have about $48mil committed to Noah+Deng+Ryan+BBD+JRich+Q+Duhon. I am guessing the cap would be somewhere in the range of $63-$65 million that summer. Should be more than enough room to sign Monta in FA. If you need to, you could probably cut-and-stretch BBD that summer to free up another $3-4mil in cap room. It can definitely be done though, not hard at all with our contracts after that trade.

You really think Lopez+Brooks+picks is going to make us any better than the bottom of the East? Cmon. Ask Washington how that's working out for them...

Part of the reason a lot of teams DON'T want Monta is because, like I said, he isn't really a SG because he is too small. He is better served as a PG, but lots of teams in the league, especially contenders, already have legit PGs (Boston, OKC, Chicago, San Antonio, Clippers). A lot of the other teams don't have the necessary pieces to get him. I would think a few teams that might be interested would be LA, ATL, ORL, Miami. However, few have the right pieces to get him...and he "works" on this team almost better than any other team in the league (perhaps ATL as well). It is more of a "fit" issue, as well as the current situation on most teams, that is preventing him from being traded, NOT his talent level.

And David Lee is "horrible"? LOL. Gimme a 19-10 guy who shoots 52% from the field ALL day. Yeh, really "horrible". Pau was putting up almost IDENTICAL numbers in Memphis to what Lee has put up. Just because Memphis didn't make any noise, did that make Pau "horrible"? People keep equating wins or losses with talent/lack of talent. That simply isn't always the case in the NBA. It's a team sport, and from 1-5 (more like from 1-10), the "team" has to work. Doesn't mean losing teams can't have good players on them.

[eyriq]

I really like Bensational's trade idea. If GST would accept Nelson/Redick '13 1st for Ellis those trades would really round out the shakeup. A Miller/Ellis back court and a SJax/Ish/Anderson/Earl bench is a big upgrade. If GST doesn't bite than I'd offer the same deal to Phoenix for Nash but make the '13 pick lottery protected and nix the three way trade. If we can't lure in another star player for the Nelson/Redick/1st rounder package than I still think the three way makes us better.

[BelgianMagic]

how about this for a 3 team deal for the 2 guys in the wiretap (Anderson + Jackson)?

DEN
in: JRich + Duhon/Harper + Bass TPE + draft picks
out: Miller + C.Anderson

MIL
in: BBD + QRich
out: SJax

ORL
in: Miller + C.Anderson + Jackson
out: JRich + BBD + Duhon + QRich

Denver get instant cap relief on Anderson's deal, and get an upgrade at SG, and a replacement backup PG. (Duhon is optional. if it's too much salary to commit to for them, swap him for a rookie)

Milwaukee get Jackson off the team, and get another big man to fill in whilst Bogut is out.

Orlando get some solid veterans to make a strong run this season, and actually get deals that expire this summer and next summer as opposed to 3 years down the track.

Dwight/C.Anderson
R.Anderson/Clark
Hedo/
SJax/JJ/Von
Nelson/Miller/Duhon?

there's some flexibility there for guys to swing between the 2, 3 and 4 to create matchup problems.

This would be a very good deal for us.

But again, I doubt Otis has this kind of creativity in finding deals ..

I think it's pretty bad to see members of a discussion board have a better vision on all this than a guy who does this as a job I'm sure Denver/Milwaukee would be interested in this ..

Otis on the other hand is probably looking for longer, bigger contracts .. He has a reputation to uphold

[MagicFan41]

Rose evidently has suggested that the Bulls get Pau. He supposedly suggested a deal of Boozer + a PG for Pau. Every star is getting into the "play-the-GM" role now it seems. Maybe Dwight inspired that in him?

If the Bulls did somehow land Pau, I bet Dwight would warm up even more to the idea of going to the Bulls, as he there were reports that said he wants to play with Pau. Interesting that Rose would suggest something like that while they're playing so well. Why can't these stars just play the game of basketball? So annoying as a fan to see this kind of stuff. Especially with Boozer playing really well this season...

[BN]

Rose evidently has suggested that the Bulls get Pau. He supposedly suggested a deal of Boozer + a PG for Pau. Every star is getting into the "play-the-GM" role now it seems. Maybe Dwight inspired that in him?

If the Bulls did somehow land Pau, I bet Dwight would warm up even more to the idea of going to the Bulls, as he there were reports that said he wants to play with Pau. Interesting that Rose would suggest something like that while they're playing so well. Why can't these stars just play the game of basketball? So annoying as a fan to see this kind of stuff. Especially with Boozer playing really well this season...

Then again, wasn't Dwight buddies with Boozer or something? Actually they mustn't have been that great of buddies considering that he didn't sign with us...

[Coach_McGuirk]

Guess we will see Lopez today.

Brook Lopez, who will return from foot surgery on Sunday, has gained 10 pounds of muscle while rehabilitating.
Lopez looks visibly stronger and could be poised for a big second half of the season, even if the threat of a trade hangs over him. He says he's in good shape, and the Nets took "every conceivable precaution" with his return according to coach Avery Johnson, but it should take him at least a few games to get up to speed

[Def Swami]

Guess we will see Lopez today.

Brook Lopez, who will return from foot surgery on Sunday, has gained 10 pounds of muscle while rehabilitating.
Lopez looks visibly stronger and could be poised for a big second half of the season, even if the threat of a trade hangs over him. He says he's in good shape, and the Nets took "every conceivable precaution" with his return according to coach Avery Johnson, but it should take him at least a few games to get up to speed

That Dwight v. Lopez matchup next week will show us all we need to know, I'm sure.

[arkknight1988]

kenneth farried is outproducing bbd while getting paid 1mil per yr. davis is a big part of our bench and we need him to pick it up.

davis has a per of 7.28

[thelead]

kenneth farried is outproducing bbd while getting paid 1mil per yr. davis is a big part of our bench and we need him to pick it up.

davis has a per of 7.28

BBD just needs to be traded.

[jjtreyball]

Getting ready for the why didn't we get jr smith threads

[arkknight1988]

Getting ready for the why didn't we get jr smith threads

i would take him over jj or jrich 9 times out of 10

[MagicFan41]

Getting ready for the why didn't we get jr smith threads

Because he's actually pretty much exactly what we need/lack?

[SubyWill]

Getting ready for the why didn't we get jr smith threads

Because he's actually pretty much exactly what we need/lack?

Pretty much, he was exactly what we needed.

[Rccanes2311]

Anyone talking about acquiring David Lee doesn't care bout defense.

[PeePee la Fritz]

Man that Wafer guy, way better then JR Smith. How has he not stuck anywhere yet or get consistent minutes?!?! Oh ya I remember, because he's not that good!