ESPN: Teams inquiring about Bargnani, Calderon

pass first · Post #361 » by **pass first** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:10 am

TrueToCaesar wrote:I almost smashed my keyboard when I read "We're trying to keep him" (Calderon)

Seriously? Are we not rebuilding still? We should hold on to an overpaid veteran with no upside right?

It's all about the return.

Ultimately keeping him is cap relief. There's probably calls but nobody's offering expirings probably or pure cap space. The upside of keeping him is cap relief ultimately. Next year when he's expiring the offers may be a lot better too. Teams wouldn't be cutting 10 mil in their cap for the summer, and this is a big summer with the Dwight sweepstakes. Another possibility is keeping him at a much lower salary beyond his curent contract. Some people perceive that as possible upside, having Jose become the 6th man/back up point guard.

TrueToCaesar · Post #362 » by **TrueToCaesar** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:18 am

It just pisses me off that we don't have him on the trading block. It pisses me off we went and signed a bunch of old dudes this offseason that have no game left for their "leadership".

It pisses me off that we're giving Calderon so many minutes when we're not trying to trade him, and we have Bayless who needs to develop

cb4_jo6 · Post #363 » by **cb4_jo6** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:45 am

Calderon was always on the trading block, IMO. They're looking for a draft pick in return I would say.

pass first · Post #364 » by **pass first** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:47 am

TrueToCaesar wrote:It just pisses me off that we don't have him on the trading block. It pisses me off we went and signed a bunch of old dudes this offseason that have no game left for their "leadership".

It pisses me off that we're giving Calderon so many minutes when we're not trying to trade him, and we have Bayless who needs to develop

We also signed Forbes and Gray is not old either.

I don't think it's black and white who's on the block or not. If somebody's offering what BC wants Calderon can be traded. He already did traded him once if it wasn't for take-backs, and he would do it again.

Magloire brings what Reggie used to bring. Both on and off the court. Nothing wrong with having him around imo, especially not in a year like this.

Bayless has some potential, to be onest I don't mind him being chained to an extent, it's a contract year, rather have him blow up next year, we might get him at bargain price. I also don't think Calderon is holding Bayless back, they started together some games. It's mostly injuries holding him back. When he plays well he gets rewarded with minutes imo, just have to stay healthy.

TrueToCaesar · Post #365 » by **TrueToCaesar** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:49 am

Magloire does not bring anything anywhere close to what Reggie used to bring so I stopped reading there because all your credibility disintegrated

pass first · Post #366 » by **pass first** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:54 am

TrueToCaesar wrote:Magloire does not bring anything anywhere close to what Reggie used to bring so I stopped reading there because all your credibility disintegrated

Well mainly off the court. Evans has more left in the tank but they're both just big bodies hustling, setting screens and holding guys accountable. Reggie grabbed a few more boards, big deal. Magloire blocks more shots, same difference.

whoknows · Post #367 » by **whoknows** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:56 am

TrueToCaesar wrote:It just pisses me off that we don't have him on the trading block. It pisses me off we went and signed a bunch of old dudes this offseason that have no game left for their "leadership".

It pisses me off that we're giving Calderon so many minutes when we're not trying to trade him, and we have Bayless who needs to develop

How would you propose Raps should've gone about this season?
Signing D league players?
We already have 85% scrubs in the team...at least Casey can work with veterans some resemble of defence, unlike knuckleheads young'uns off D league...

How do you know that JC is not on the block, I believe that since the deal with Bobcats fell through JC was always available. Problem is that he is > than a bad contract (what has been offered so far). Can you even imagine the present games with both AB and JC out?

And am I the only one here that does not see Bayless ever turning into a good PG? He is too much Mike James like, looking for his shot and in the few moments he tries to setup an offence, he is more often than not, out of control.

TrueToCaesar · Post #368 » by **TrueToCaesar** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:57 am

Don't kid yourself, the difference between them is not just "One guy blocks more shots, the other guy rebounds more but besides that they're the same".

Magloire can't really do anything at a high level... Reggie was a tough defender that played mind games and was one of the best rebounders in THE LEAGUE. He was leading the league for a while IIRC.

TrueToCaesar · Post #369 » by **TrueToCaesar** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:01 am

whoknows wrote:
TrueToCaesar wrote:It just pisses me off that we don't have him on the trading block. It pisses me off we went and signed a bunch of old dudes this offseason that have no game left for their "leadership".

It pisses me off that we're giving Calderon so many minutes when we're not trying to trade him, and we have Bayless who needs to develop

How would you propose Raps should've gone about this season?
Signing D league players?
We already have 85% scrubs in the team...at least Casey can work with veterans some resemble of defence, unlike knuckleheads young'uns off D league...

How do you know that JC is not on the block, I believe that since the deal with Bobcats fell through JC was always available. Problem is that he is > than a bad contract (what has been offered so far). Can you even imagine the present games with both AB and JC out?

And am I the only one here that does not see Bayless ever turning into a good PG? He is too much Mike James like, looking for his shot and in the few moments he tries to setup an offence, he is more often than not, out of control.

Well first off, I seriously doubt Rasual Butler and Jamaal Magloire would be better than any D-League players we would've signed but forget that, I wasn't saying we should've signed D-Leaguers.

I'm sure JC is "available" but it's pretty clear we aren't actively TRYING to trade him, and we seriously overvalue him. Just watch, the trade deadline will come and go and we'll still have this fool.

As for Bayless, you have to at least give him a chance to try and be a PG, and in a season like this how does playing Calderon more minutes than him help us at all?

pass first · Post #370 » by **pass first** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:10 am

TrueToCaesar wrote:Don't kid yourself, the difference between them is not just "One guy blocks more shots, the other guy rebounds more but besides that they're the same".

Magloire can't really do anything at a high level... Reggie was a tough defender that played mind games and was one of the best rebounders in THE LEAGUE. He was leading the league for a while IIRC.

Okay Reggie is better, you win. Can I please have my credibility back now?

Ackshun · Post #371 » by **Ackshun** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 8:08 am

We need to keep Calderon. There is no other PG out there currently that can satisfy our needs, unless we trade Demar.

This draft is stacked with players that play DD's role, and I imagine at least 2-3 will turn out much better. Send DD home for Bledsoe, or to Bobcats for Augustin.

We're not gonna find our future PG in this draft. I really don't want Andre Miller, Kirk Hinrich or Dragic running this team next year.

Keep Jose. He's a valuable off the bench guard WHEN we become competitive, and can shoot a bucket or two. We don't need his cap space.

Plushberry · Post #372 » by **Plushberry** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:02 pm

TrueToCaesar wrote:It just pisses me off that we don't have him on the trading block. It pisses me off we went and signed a bunch of old dudes this offseason that have no game left for their "leadership".

It pisses me off that we're giving Calderon so many minutes when we're not trying to trade him, and we have Bayless who needs to develop

How do you get through the day?

highness · Post #373 » by **highness** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:06 pm

Ackshun wrote:We need to keep Calderon. There is no other PG out there currently that can satisfy our needs, unless we trade Demar.

This draft is stacked with players that play DD's role, and I imagine at least 2-3 will turn out much better. Send DD home for Bledsoe, or to Bobcats for Augustin.

We're not gonna find our future PG in this draft. I really don't want Andre Miller, Kirk Hinrich or Dragic running this team next year.

Keep Jose. He's a valuable off the bench guard WHEN we become competitive, and can shoot a bucket or two. We don't need his cap space.

Lol those are horrible trades for us. smh

Post #374 » by **Marvin!** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 2:24 pm

TrueToCaesar wrote:It just pisses me off that we don't have him on the trading block. It pisses me off we went and signed a bunch of old dudes this offseason that have no game left for their "leadership".

It pisses me off that we're giving Calderon so many minutes when we're not trying to trade him, and we have Bayless who needs to develop

did you just fall off the turnip truck?

Coaches and GMs say exactly that, all the freaking time about players on their team because it's stupid not to, and can cause serious issues if they don't...

what the **** do you expect them to say? "He's old and washed up, we're just praying we can get anything for him before his hammy blows out for good..."

Jesus people, use your heads! They said Charlie V was a core piece one day and traded him within 2 days after saying it...

Post #375 » by **Morris_Shatford** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 2:42 pm

TrueToCaesar wrote:It pisses me off that we're giving Calderon so many minutes when we're not trying to trade him, and we have Bayless who needs to develop

Maybe its just me;
But for once I wouldn't mind a young guy actually earning his minutes rather then being handed them because of the "development" cop out. Bayless started six games this season and shot 34% in those six games after weeks of hearing "He is better as a starter" he got to start and he wasnt that good.

I am all for dealing Jose if we get value, but Bayless has shown nothing to me this season with any degree of consistency for me to believe he is the answer to any problems we have.

Post #376 » by **Morris_Shatford** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 2:45 pm

Marvin! wrote:
TrueToCaesar wrote:It just pisses me off that we don't have him on the trading block. It pisses me off we went and signed a bunch of old dudes this offseason that have no game left for their "leadership".

It pisses me off that we're giving Calderon so many minutes when we're not trying to trade him, and we have Bayless who needs to develop

did you just fall off the turnip truck?

Coaches and GMs say exactly that, all the freaking time about players on their team because it's stupid not to, and can cause serious issues if they don't...

what the **** do you expect them to say? "He's old and washed up, we're just praying we can get anything for him before his hammy blows out for good..."

Jesus people, use your heads! They said Charlie V was a core piece one day and traded him within 2 days after saying it...

Exactly;
What is a coach suppose to say about a guy on his roster performing well?
"We think this is a fluke, and we need to trade him now to get something of value for him"

Jose's value isn't going down as he is on the cusp of becoming a 10m dollar expiring contract that can actually play at an NBA level. Moving him now, or at the draft, or at next seasons trade deadline is fine by me assuming you get the best return, not just the best return available right now.

Greg Stink · Post #377 » by **Greg Stink** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 3:07 pm

To put somebody on the block is to say that you'll take the least-crappy offer for him. To reinforce his value is to say you'll take the best.

dagger · Post #378 » by **dagger** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 3:08 pm

I'd point out that Jose's value as an expiring contract this summer also increased with the new CBA because the salary matching requirement for non-taxed teams over the cap went from 125 to 150%. That means it will be easier for other teams to acquire Jose without gutting their roster. Also, trading him in the summer would allow us to find a transitional PG in free agency - maybe even Steve Nash - to tide us over through the 2013 draft when we logically draft ourselves a PG.

revvolutions · Post #379 » by **revvolutions** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 3:41 pm

i think we've already made the judgment call on bayless when we didn't extend him. i doubt he gets offered much.

Crazy-Canuck · Post #380 » by **Crazy-Canuck** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 3:59 pm

Morris_Shatford wrote:
TrueToCaesar wrote:It pisses me off that we're giving Calderon so many minutes when we're not trying to trade him, and we have Bayless who needs to develop

Maybe its just me;
But for once I wouldn't mind a young guy actually earning his minutes rather then being handed them because of the "development" cop out. Bayless started six games this season and shot 34% in those six games after weeks of hearing "He is better as a starter" he got to start and he wasnt that good.

I am all for dealing Jose if we get value, but Bayless has shown nothing to me this season with any degree of consistency for me to believe he is the answer to any problems we have.

The only thing Bayless has shown this year is his inability to stay healthy.