Woelfel - 70% bogut's gone and maybe Jennings (update pg131)

[fishercob]

Mcgee to Milwaukee needs to happen, if for no other reason than the reality show potential of combining McGee and Skiles. I'd have them live together too. They do have the Michigan connection though(Skiles @ MSU and Epic Vale from Flint), so maybe it would turn out like those coming of age movies where Skiles helps McGee become a man and McGee helps Skiles leran to love again.

Or maybe Skiles would just murder McGee. Either way, I'd watch.

Thank you random Wizards fan. You are always welcome here.

Thanks. My honest outsider's opinion is that you guys should basically stand pat. See if you can buy Jackson out of the final year of his deal and let him go chase a ring (assuming anyone wants him). If not, deactivate his ass if he acts up.

You just need to suck it up and suck next year. After next summer you'll have close to $30M in cap room. That's before amnestying Gooden, which could be a decent option because he's bound to get picked up by someone, thereby limiting the cash outlay by ownership.

You just need to draft well this year and next. Keep Ilsayova if possible. Bide your time. Keep the faith. Probably get new uniforms.

Peace.

[Ed Wood]

Actually while we're on the topic of getting objective outsider feedback does the league generally appreciate the ...uh... virile basketball force we have in Jan Vesely? Because I'd hate to think he was thought of as an enormous doofus as opposed to the force of nature that he is.

Like are people still gonna look at him and say "yeah that's a sixth overall pick right there, I could use some of that?" Not that I'd like to trade him obviously, seeing as he's so good, but uh, just in case the league forces a trade so that we don't have an unfair advantage.

[JimmyTheKid]

Ugh. Maybe we shoudnt invite other teams' fans to exchange ideas. I'm now officially depressed looking at a possible trade with the Wizards. They're working with a whole lotta yuck on that roster.

[emunney]

I don't think Vesely has done enough yet for anybody to have an opinion on him one way or another. But in my personal opinion, I don't think he did enough pre draft to justify his draft position. Has he had any of those giant dunks?

I see he's 0-21 on jump shots. Is that right? Jesus.

[Ruzious]

I don't think the sentiment is so much that Bogut isn't worth having, a lot of the focus on injury is preemptive haggling, though the downward trend of his shooting over the last two years is concerning. That being said you aren't going to get a favorable response to anything involving Washington's first round pick, the responses thus far have included voices from across the roster construction spectrum (in terms of patience and youth vs. immediate improvement with veterans) and if nobody has said yes thus far nobody is going to say yes.

Myself I'd be pretty comfortable offering McGee and Vesely, particularly if Harris could also be included coming back, I'd be comfortable including Singleton for the same purpose, and would also be willing to offer up Jordan Crawford. I realize that's not a cornucopia of talent but our roster is largely ass and you work with what you've got.

I think that's a good realistic basis of discussion. Something like McGee, Vesely, Young (exp), and Turiaf (exp) for Bogut and Harris works in the trade checker.

[JimmyTheKid]

Actually while we're on the topic of getting objective outsider feedback does the league generally appreciate the ...uh... virile basketball force we have in Jan Vesely? Because I'd hate to think he was thought of as an enormous doofus as opposed to the force of nature that he is.

Like are people still gonna look at him and say "yeah that's a sixth overall pick right there, I could use some of that?" Not that I'd like to trade him obviously, seeing as he's so good, but uh, just in case the league forces a trade so that we don't have an unfair advantage.

I like these Wizards' fans. And, yeah, bad pick. Not Yi or Joe Alexander bad, but yeah, who knows. Its still early?

[fishercob]

I don't think Vesely has done enough yet for anybody to have an opinion on him one way or another. But in my personal opinion, I don't think he did enough pre draft to justify his draft position. Has he had any of those giant dunks?

I see he's 0-21 on jump shots. Is that right? Jesus.

From last saturday night, for your viewing pleasure:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55fjt3N0nFM[/youtube]

He's smart and athletic. Great defensive instincts. He's incredibly weak and cannot shoot to save his life.

[emunney]

Very nice. Yeah, I liked him two years ago when it looked like his shooting was showing some promise. Then last year his shot totally fell apart and he couldn't even hit FTs anymore. Dunk or nothing. He reminded me of a more athletic Jared Jeffries going into the draft. Which is ok, but no 6th overall.

[MilBucksBackOnTop06]

How about Curry, Udoh, Biedrens for Bogut and Beno?

I'd do any Bogut deal with Curry. Then of course we land the #1 pick and get Davis.

Jennings/Curry/Harris/Ilyasova/Davis.

Now that si the type of team this franchise needs! excellent...young, dynamic, fresh faces and up and coming that can draw the fans bases imagination.

They can learn how to win, fail, endure, compete, and then succeed together with all us have for the last 25 years here. We would all be behnd them 110% and support them going to games in and in the community.

A group like that this city fan base can adopt and embrace like OKC has there's and not a bunch of journeymen role players with no appeal or track record.

If the Bucks had any sense at all....AT ALL...This is what they should have done a LOOOOOOONG tine ago, but the game has passed Kohl by.

Every one of those players are awesome. Even Harris....who at 19 could fit in with a group like that. Curry and Jennings and Davis would be drawing cards on the road and a highlight reel every night on the networks.

They all want to win, but would have to be coached up and taught how to consistently on the NBA level. We would all wait for them...what's 2-3 more years with a group like this? Atleast we all would have some fun...watching them light teams up.

This is a hypothetical scenario you devised here, but this would be absolutely GREAT.

[Ruzious]

Very nice. Yeah, I liked him two years ago when it looked like his shooting was showing some promise. Then last year his shot totally fell apart and he couldn't even hit FTs anymore. Dunk or nothing. He reminded me of a more athletic Jared Jeffries going into the draft. Which is ok, but no 6th overall.

Exactly.

In my mind and some other like-minded Zardzians, the hope is he bulks up over the next few years and becomes somewhat of a Noah type center - but with better hair.

[tontoz]

Ugh. Maybe we shoudnt invite other teams' fans to exchange ideas. I'm now officially depressed looking at a possible trade with the Wizards. They're working with a whole lotta yuck on that roster.

I just don't think there is a deal here. Frankly i would rather let Mcgee walk and take my chances with Seraphin rather than take on $27 million for an injury damaged player.

[Lippo]

Rashard Lewis
32.5 year old , 6-10, 215 lb F from Alief Elsik High School (Texas)
7.8 ppg, 3.9 rpg, 1.0 apg in 26.0 minutes
Jan Vesely
21.5 year old , 6-11, 240 lb F from KK Partizan (Serbia)
3.0 ppg, 3.2 rpg, 0.7 apg in 15.3 minutes
JaVale McGee
24 year old , 7-0, 237 lb C-F from Nevada
11.5 ppg, 8.9 rpg, 0.6 apg in 27.4 minutes
Trevor Booker
24 year old , 6-7, 240 lb F from Clemson
8.2 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 0.7 apg in 23.5 minutes
2012 2nd

Outgoing Players
Andrew Bogut
27 year old , 7-0, 245 lb C from Utah
11.3 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 2.6 apg in 30.3 minutes in 2011-2012
Stephen Jackson
33.5 year old , 6-8, 218 lb F-G from Butler CC
10.5 ppg, 3.2 rpg, 3.0 apg in 27.4 minutes in 2011-2012
Beno Udrih
29.5 year old , 6-3, 205 lb G from Armani Milano (Italy)
5.6 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 3.3 apg in 17.7 minutes in 2011-2012


we can amnesty gooden and lewis off book the following year and we are set.

[emunney]

Very nice. Yeah, I liked him two years ago when it looked like his shooting was showing some promise. Then last year his shot totally fell apart and he couldn't even hit FTs anymore. Dunk or nothing. He reminded me of a more athletic Jared Jeffries going into the draft. Which is ok, but no 6th overall.

Exactly.

In my mind and some other like-minded Zardzians, the hope is he bulks up over the next few years and becomes somewhat of a Noah type center - but with better hair.

That's a good hope. Granted I'm going entirely by what I saw overseas, but I think he's got the court awareness but not the knack for rebounding.

[coolhandluke121]

This is simple. You have to let Washington protect the pick (top-5 at most) this year and leave it unprotected if it goes to next year. Both teams have to take that calculated risk. No way Washington gives up a potential top-3 pick this year, and no way the Bucks do it without at least a chance at getting a good draft pick for their trouble.

Going into next season with Wall/Bogut/Singleton/top-3 pick would look awful promising for Washington. But it might not bear fruit right away, in which case the Bucks might get a top-7 pick in 2013 from the Wizards. Or the Wizards could fall to 6th this year, in which case the 2102 pick goes to the Bucks while the Wizards still have their 2013 pick.

Realistic gamble all the way around if you ask me.

[Badgerlander]

The most important part of the deal of course is the Bucks getting Sam Cassell back.

[MilBucksBackOnTop06]

I'm sorry, but this is a 24 page thread based on what Gery W, is reporting...where are the insiders that come on here? All I keep reading is speculation, but there have been zero rumors from realgm insiders?

I will overlook you typed something like this as being naive...IT'S ALL SPECULATION. You will never read factual trades and information at this stage bigdog34.

Everyone will report and throw out feelers and see what sticks and create stories. You should know that. There are no such thing as 'Insiders.'

They don't know much more then anyone else by and large. They call themselves that to get you to buy their publications.

No organization would leak anythng they did not want their publicist to let the media get their hands on. And many tiems these rumors start with agents or player reps that get stuff started for their clients.

Some reporters have better or more credible connections they call 'my sources' then other reporters do, just as some GM's have better connections then others do.

There may be some guys who won't deal with Hammond who might listen to Ron Walter or Mike Burr and some others. They probaly all call around the league...which to me leads to confusion.

But do not come in here a week before the deadline and look for 'facts.' You are not going to get them. So most of the time you will see percentage based possibilities like Woelful gave you to keep himself safe by saving 70%, so if he is wrong then he can spin it to mean, well that was the other 30% and he is not right or wrong...

This counseling is free of charge he that is of 106 posts ...Your welcome.

[Ruzious]

The most important part of the deal of course is the Bucks getting Sam Cassell back.

No way. Ya know - Sam is not just another pretty face.

[bstrassburg]

PP's son Alex Kennedy is doing a chat at Hoopsworld and had this (nothing new) to say:

The Milwaukee Bucks aren’t actively shopping Andrew Bogut, but they’re listening to offers. That’s something they haven’t done in the past, which is why the Bogut trade rumors have started to surface. If Milwaukee does find a trade partner for Bogut, they’ll try to include Stephen Jackson in the deal. Jackson alone doesn’t have any trade value right now so he’ll only be moved if he’s thrown into a bigger deal.

[Ruzious]

Very nice. Yeah, I liked him two years ago when it looked like his shooting was showing some promise. Then last year his shot totally fell apart and he couldn't even hit FTs anymore. Dunk or nothing. He reminded me of a more athletic Jared Jeffries going into the draft. Which is ok, but no 6th overall.

Exactly.

In my mind and some other like-minded Zardzians, the hope is he bulks up over the next few years and becomes somewhat of a Noah type center - but with better hair.

That's a good hope. Granted I'm going entirely by what I saw overseas, but I think he's got the court awareness but not the knack for rebounding.

I agree again. He's better at blocking out then actually snaring the rebound. I'm not sure if that's a Euro teaching thing - or maybe the fact that he's played primarily the small forward position there. He's definitely not a 3 in the US - he's bulked up considerably since last season, and hopefully his frame will hold more.

[MilBucksBackOnTop06]

Are you pretty sure about Jennings? I do not get this team. They get rid of TJ, Williams, and Sessions. BJ is not that much better than these guys. Not a true PG.

Like I've been saying, a lot of the stuff I've been hearing lately makes no sense to me. I don't get much of the anti-Bogut sentiment and I don't get the apparent lack of any concern whatsoever about Jennings. I also think more players should be on the block right now than are being shopped.

I agree. Why on earth do they want to put up with the crap that BJ put out after the All Star snub? When watching the Bulls game BJ completely ignored Ersan a bunch of times when he was driving to the basket. Meanwhile Delfino and Dunlevely made some really nice passed too Ersan for the hoop. This organization just keeps on trying to build with the wrong players. I do not mind trading Bogut, but only because of the injury problems he had.[/quote]
msiris hush.

I am so sick and tired of everyone getting on Jennings for his reaction to the all star snub. HE SHOULD BE UPSET. Any player would be who cared.
Yes even I at the end questioned it but after thinking about it I looked at it from his perspective.
Don;'t you get upset with a bad grade in school, or a low raise or evaluation at your job!? S

Sure you do...

These are not auotmatons you know. He has feelings and goals he aspires to and is probaly hard on himself more then we are on him. This might have been the best chance he will ever have to be an All Star and there were things as a PG that went down that he could not control that kept him from that.

Now do you come out in the media and admit that? Yes and no. He was being honest and answered the question like a man. I got no issue with that. Then came out and plaed better. There are times in every NBA season when EVERY PLAYER in the entire will feel like Jennings does...and be on edge.

All Star selection time, and the trade deadline...Those two times for sure will get any player in this shortened season out of wack mentally and emotionally. Especially young players that is 22 and a PG in the NBA at a position that is stacked.

Fans need to calm down and give Jennings some slack on this. Was he snubbed? I know there were a lot of PG's and players on that team that technically should not have been on there due to them being injured and they were selected by reputation only by the coaches, but the bottom line is the Bucks did not promote Jennings enough for it publicly and then they were not winning, Bogut was hurt, and Jackson in the dog house and Skiles running players in and out not settling on a lineup like some spasm.

All of that would drive anyone crazy...especially a PG. You all need to learn basketball physche before you come in here and rip some situations and look at it from both sides. it id hard to do when few of us have the talent of these players, but it is easy to sit back and knock him.

Factor everything that went down and then judge it.

That is all