Official Raptors 2012 NBA Draft Thread, Part 8

Los Manos · Post #41 » by **Los Manos** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:08 am

Do we really have to waste time convincing a poster of the merits to Anthony Davis' HUGE upside because he claims he "is the most overrated player i have ever seen"?

Let Kenny put himself out on an island all alone as there isn't an NBA scout or GM who wouldn't take him no.1 this year and last year too. I said it three games into the season and nothing has convinced me otherwise that Davis has a chance to be the best PF in the world in his prime. Any prospect you can say that about goes no.1 in the draft.

kenny · Post #42 » by **kenny** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:09 am

he is projected to be a franchise player which i dont think he will be.. even if he becomes as good as bosh that still doesnt make him a franchise player.. if the raptors draft him then what do we do? we already have bargnani and ed davis and amir and val.. do we draft davis and trade him to another team for a really good player? or do we trade bargs ? or whoever

fredericklove · Post #43 » by **fredericklove** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:15 am

Los Manos wrote:Let Kenny put himself out on an island all alone as there isn't an NBA scout or GM who wouldn't take him no.1 this year and last year too. I said it three games into the season and nothing has convinced me otherwise that Davis has a chance to be the best PF in the world in his prime. Any prospect you can say that about goes no.1 in the draft.

True, I was an epic Irving fan last year but even I had to admit I'd take Davis over Irving in a blink of a second just like that. His potential and skillset are incredibly high.

kenny · Post #44 » by **kenny** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:20 am

well see how he plays next year then.. i still think hes going to be good.. just not as good as a lot of you think he is going to be... i cant see him being as good as garnett in his prime no way.. but i guess you guys can shut me up if you end up being right about him

PowerPhil15 · Post #45 » by **PowerPhil15** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:23 am

2/3 position in order:

Lamb
Barnes
MKG
Beal
Rivers

Terrance Jones should actually be in that mix as of the last 3 games

kenny · Post #46 » by **kenny** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:25 am

fredericklove wrote:
kenny wrote:considering i live in the states right now.. i have definitely been watching him play.. i hope he does develop and offensive game.. but right now his offense is still far behind

I won't say far behind, he's shown flashes of offense so he still has potential on offense, how old is he? 19? He's still a freshman, he's not even a rookie in the NBA yet. You honestly think he won't develop any offense in the next 3 years? Like I said, he's shown offensive display in last ten games so it's not like he's reluctant to improve offensively. Once he goes to the nba, he will have big man coaches privately teach him all the offensive moves. With his length, quickness, understanding of big man's fundamentals, and work ethic, it's hard to see him not working hard to develop an offense. It's raw right now but not entirely limited, also he's not a poor jump shooter. I have to repeat this again to you, he's got a decent elevation on that jump-shot with proper release form, unlike jump shot you see from Drummond, or Camby or Dwight, that jump shot is going to improve in the NBA, and it's going to help him score alot of points. Also, his jump hooks should improve and become unguardable because its release is very high especially due to his long frame.

i can agree with this because what you are saying definitely makes sense... but some players have trouble developing their offence further.. im not comparing the two but look at ed davis.. the guy has no offensive skill and he hasnt really improved much in the last two years.. this is not a comparison because i know anthony davis is already way better than ed davis

fredericklove · Post #47 » by **fredericklove** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:27 am

kenny wrote:he is projected to be a franchise player which i dont think he will be.. even if he becomes as good as bosh that still doesnt make him a franchise player.. if the raptors draft him then what do we do? we already have bargnani and ed davis and amir and val.. do we draft davis and trade him to another team for a really good player? or do we trade bargs ? or whoever

Not even a logjam would affect your choice. His caliber is not to pass up when he's first on board (espn, nbadraft, DX, and chad ford has spoken to all GMs and they all would take Davis first unaimously and has said he's a very high caliber player too, you're the only one on this board or the only one so far that claims he's not a franchise player, and you argued with limited evidences to prove your argument.

You draft him, then work your way out by trading other assets. Why you use Bosh as example, Bosh is an offensive talent but defensively he isn't. You're comparing a high offensive player to a defensive player with flashes of offense, it's not even a consistent comparison. Also, he won't be as good as bosh "offensively" but he is going to be better and potentially light years ahead of Bosh defensively, even if his offense isn't going to be as good as Bosh, even with a caliber like Dwight, isn't offensively skilled like Bosh but his defense alone can change the game completely. So for you to claim he won't be a franchise player is very inconsistent. He has every aspect of the game to be a franchise level player. What you argue is his "raw" offense that you use as main case to claim he won't be franchise player, that's again highly inconsistent. Raw doesn't mean he can't improve. If he's a legit defensive game-changer with rooms to improve his offense, that to everyone is clearly going to be an instant franchise potential level type of player.

kenny · Post #48 » by **kenny** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:30 am

i wasnt really comparing him with bosh in terms of their style of play.. i was just talking about overall how good he would become... if the raps do end up somehow drafting him i hope you are 100 percent correct and that he turns out to be a stud

fredericklove · Post #49 » by **fredericklove** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:33 am

kenny wrote:
fredericklove wrote:
I won't say far behind, he's shown flashes of offense so he still has potential on offense, how old is he? 19? He's still a freshman, he's not even a rookie in the NBA yet. You honestly think he won't develop any offense in the next 3 years? Like I said, he's shown offensive display in last ten games so it's not like he's reluctant to improve offensively. Once he goes to the nba, he will have big man coaches privately teach him all the offensive moves. With his length, quickness, understanding of big man's fundamentals, and work ethic, it's hard to see him not working hard to develop an offense. It's raw right now but not entirely limited, also he's not a poor jump shooter. I have to repeat this again to you, he's got a decent elevation on that jump-shot with proper release form, unlike jump shot you see from Drummond, or Camby or Dwight, that jump shot is going to improve in the NBA, and it's going to help him score alot of points. Also, his jump hooks should improve and become unguardable because its release is very high especially due to his long frame.

i can agree with this because what you are saying definitely makes sense... but some players have trouble developing their offence further.. im not comparing the two but look at ed davis.. the guy has no offensive skill and he hasnt really improved much in the last two years.. this is not a comparison because i know anthony davis is already way better than ed davis

Some players are players without the upside AD has. Why use Ed as example then if he isn't physically as quick, or with upsides at AD's level? Some players have limited upside in terms of footwork, bbiq, or awareness on both ends but AD is already advanced in those areas, physically, he's very lightening quick for a big man, the only knocks you can have on him is his knowledge of post moves, maybe he won't have Sullinger type of post moves but he can utilize his quickness along with an improving jumpshot to score.

kenny · Post #50 » by **kenny** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:35 am

a lot of people on this board can be very stubborn about things.. maybe davis will be better than i think but a lot of you seem to always think you are right.. like how many of you say bayless is our future point guard and how bad calderon is... even though when calderon is out for long periods of time our offense suffers and has no flow to it... you guys seem to be pretty confident in anthony davis so hopefully i am wrong

kenny · Post #51 » by **kenny** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:37 am

im using ed davis as an example of players who struggle to keep developing their offense.. i know ad is nothing like ed and that he is much better already and 3 years younger

Rapsfan07 · Post #52 » by **Rapsfan07** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 6:34 am

kenny wrote:a lot of people on this board can be very stubborn about things.. maybe davis will be better than i think but a lot of you seem to always think you are right.. like how many of you say bayless is our future point guard and how bad calderon is... even though when calderon is out for long periods of time our offense suffers and has no flow to it... you guys seem to be pretty confident in anthony davis so hopefully i am wrong

Very few people on the board believe he is our future PG. Most posters just want the guy to have a chance to show what he's got. He has the skills and produces at a very high rate when he starts to there is reason to believe that there is some untapped potential left there.

As for Anthony Davis...He's going to be a good player and has franchise player talent. Even if he doesn't become the next KG, he'll still be a good player.

Drummond is very disappointing. You'd think with physical gifts like that, he'd be imposing his will in the NCAA. He desperately need to go back to school for a year because he is steadily slipping.

hops_88 · Post #53 » by **hops_88** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:11 am

The thing im curious about Anthony Davis is... do you think he'd be able to play the 3 position? I haven't seen enough games of Kentucky because of work. But, id figure that would probably be the best position for him in his first few years (especially on our team) since he doesnt have the strength to defend in the post just yet, and would be awesome with his long arms aroudn the perimter in a zone. Not to mention since hes an awesome weakside shot blocker... keeping him as a floater would probably help out quite a bit. Then offensively with his length and growing post game he can take perimeter orientented SF's in the post, and the post oriented SF's on the perimeter and stretching the defense.

I think with Bargnani a player liek Anthony Davis can fit in perfectly at the 3 spot. Because you'll have Val whose the pick and roll guy, long arms around the basket and a good hook shot/set jumper. Bargs the guy who you can iso and plays outside/in and stretches the D from the perimter. Then Anthony Davis playing inside out.

Ideally though you'd have to have 2 fairly good player makers with those 3 at the 1 and 2 position.

Just my thoughts on how AD would fit on our team at the 3 position. What do you guys think?

endo · Post #54 » by **endo** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 10:24 am

I like AD as more of a lane intimadator and with him out on the wing I think you'd be wasting his defensive talents.

nahom1319 · Post #55 » by **nahom1319** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 2:06 pm

hops_88 wrote:Just my thoughts on how AD would fit on our team at the 3 position. What do you guys think?

2006 called, even they think its a terrible idea. :wink:

Bad idea for a few reasons:

1)AD needs to get used to playing against bigger guys in the post for development purposes
2)He's not fast enough to play on the wing
3) Offensively he has mostly been an alley hoop/putback type guy. Can he do more? Sure and he willl develop those aspects at the pf spot.
4)Exactly how much success did we have with bargnani at the 3? And you wanna try it again? :banghead:

Reignman · Post #56 » by **Reignman** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 2:44 pm

hops_88 wrote:The thing im curious about Anthony Davis is... do you think he'd be able to play the 3 position? I haven't seen enough games of Kentucky because of work. But, id figure that would probably be the best position for him in his first few years (especially on our team) since he doesnt have the strength to defend in the post just yet, and would be awesome with his long arms aroudn the perimter in a zone. Not to mention since hes an awesome weakside shot blocker... keeping him as a floater would probably help out quite a bit. Then offensively with his length and growing post game he can take perimeter orientented SF's in the post, and the post oriented SF's on the perimeter and stretching the defense.

I think with Bargnani a player liek Anthony Davis can fit in perfectly at the 3 spot. Because you'll have Val whose the pick and roll guy, long arms around the basket and a good hook shot/set jumper. Bargs the guy who you can iso and plays outside/in and stretches the D from the perimter. Then Anthony Davis playing inside out.

Ideally though you'd have to have 2 fairly good player makers with those 3 at the 1 and 2 position.

Just my thoughts on how AD would fit on our team at the 3 position. What do you guys think?

LOL, no. If we luck out and get AD you put him at the 4 and never look back. He's a PF and he's going to be a damn good one, no need to screw up his development by playing him out of position, especially when we don't have another guy on the roster that projects to be anywhere near him.

sunny · Post #57 » by **sunny** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 3:04 pm

I just want to bring up something I find to be incredibly frustrating and annoying.

THIS IS NOT A BAD DRAFT
NEXT YEAR'S DRAFT IS NOT AUTOMATICALLY AMAZING

every years, its the same thing, over and over again. its ridiculous.

wanker · Post #58 » by **wanker** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 3:27 pm

Sunny, how did Lamb look yesterday (I didn't see the game)? Calhoun was there, so he he had a great game, right?

reck0n3r · Post #59 » by **reck0n3r** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 3:57 pm

Jeremy Lamb is now 12th on DX. Drummond is 4th. Not sure what they were before.

Not sure why MKG is so high (2nd). Maybe he'll show me why today.

Looking forward to watching how our kids do and number 40 on UNC.

ATLTimekeeper · Post #60 » by **ATLTimekeeper** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 4:08 pm

reck0n3r wrote:Jeremy Lamb is now 12th on DX. Drummond is 4th. Not sure what they were before.

Not sure why MKG is so high (2nd). Maybe he'll show me why today.

Looking forward to watching how our kids do and number 40 on UNC.

He played yesterday. Lamb has been in that range all year. I guess DX doesn't see him in the same light as some others. Drummond has been pretty steady 2-4 range. I think Kidd-Gilchrist has had some monster games against the best competition. He's been relatively quiet the past month or so, but still solid. No one has really come on strong, so I guess it's as likely to be him going 2nd than anyone else (at this stage).

Who do you want the Raptors to select in the 2012 NBA draft?