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2012 NBA Draft - Part II

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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#661 » by Benjammin » Fri Mar 23, 2012 2:53 pm

Higga wrote:No surprise Beal's stock is rising. There is always a need for quality shooters who can score efficiently at the 2 spot. A Wall/Beal backcourt would be awesome offensively(though probably not as good defensively as Wall/MKG).

Are there any other good SFs besides Barnes? I haven't really been paying attention to draft prospects...


MKG is not a 2; MKG is not a 2; MKG is not a 2. He's a weak shooter for a three right now and he has excellent size to guard 3s so putting him at the 2 doesn't make that much sense.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#662 » by Rafael122 » Fri Mar 23, 2012 2:55 pm

Benjammin wrote:
Higga wrote:No surprise Beal's stock is rising. There is always a need for quality shooters who can score efficiently at the 2 spot. A Wall/Beal backcourt would be awesome offensively(though probably not as good defensively as Wall/MKG).

Are there any other good SFs besides Barnes? I haven't really been paying attention to draft prospects...


MKG is not a 2; MKG is not a 2; MKG is not a 2. He's a weak shooter for a three right now and he has excellent size to guard 3s so putting him at the 2 doesn't make that much sense.


How do we know MKG won't end up being just a polished version of Chris Singleton?
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#663 » by fishercob » Fri Mar 23, 2012 4:42 pm

Ruzious wrote:
Nivek wrote:David Berri has written several times that GMs tend to significantly overrate players who perform well in the NCAA tournament in the year before they're drafted. So, Beal should be shooting up draft charts league-wide, but teams should be paying more attention to what he did during the regular season.

My gut feeling is that when a freshman steps up hugely, it means more than when an upperclassman does it. Also, he had a big game right before the tournament against Kentucky. While clearly his entire season should be considered, I think it is smart in Beal's case to weight his end o season games more. He's not a Mateen Cleaves sitiation.


I'm with Ruz on this one. It's one thing if we're talking about an upperclassman with a body of work. Say, Juan Dixon. But a freshman who got better and better as the year went on would seem to tell a different story.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#664 » by Nivek » Fri Mar 23, 2012 4:55 pm

I'd have to go hunt down the exact reference to be sure, but I don't think Berri's analysis changed based on whether the player was an upperclassman or not. I'd have to check to be sure.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#665 » by The Consiglieri » Fri Mar 23, 2012 5:07 pm

7-Day Dray wrote:Chad Ford just tweeted that Washington would take Beal as high as #2.

Sullinger played well last night too.


Feeling real good. A few of us started touting Beal during the past month and he is really playing up to that rep. Since February the kid has been on fire, making Barnes look quite the inferior product for our needs. As I've posted, at this point its 1. Davs 2. Beal 3. MKG (Ive just reversed their order) 4. Robinson 5. Oh cr#p, we couldn't get one of those four?
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#666 » by Ruzious » Fri Mar 23, 2012 5:18 pm

Nivek wrote:I'd have to go hunt down the exact reference to be sure, but I don't think Berri's analysis changed based on whether the player was an upperclassman or not. I'd have to check to be sure.

Ah, maybe he didn't think of it. Now, he can write a sequel.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#667 » by The Consiglieri » Fri Mar 23, 2012 5:20 pm

Rafael122 wrote:
Earth2Ted wrote:
7-Day Dray wrote:Chad Ford just tweeted that Washington would take Beal as high as #2.

Sullinger played well last night too.


I am trying to figure out of Chad has a Wizards source on this or if he is just pulling it out of his posterior. Ernie certainly has been telegraphing his punches the last couple years- he did on Vesely, and I think even going back to that #5 for Miller and Foye deal.

I just hope that Ernie (and my sense is that Ted is probably keeping him around :-? ) doesn't just think Nene is the center of the future, and that Nene, Seraphin, and Vesely will morph into some sort of championship caliber front line. But he probably does.


I wouldn't take a big unless it's Anthony Davis. I like what I saw from Beal, efficient scoring, played a smart game and he doesn't play like he's 6'3''. REALLY liking this kid now.


They called it last year on draftexpress and other sources, the kid has everything we need at the 2. Great BBIQ, selfless player, high motor, contributes across the stat line, great jumper, good 3, plays D. The only issue with him is size, he's a little small for a 2. But he's rugged and muscular, and plays much bigger than he measures. At the very least, I think he'll be a very good player at the next level. He may actually have the potential to be a star. A month ago he was in that 6-12 area, 2 weeks ago in that 5-8 area, and now he looks like 2-8 area and it's ALL based on production since he started putting it all together in February. He has EVERYTHING we want, if we go for a shooter instead of a big and in my view, will contribute a great deal more than Barnes.

Barnes, btw, was featured in the latest Atlantic Monthly. He's apparently exceptionally smart, and really talented (musical prodigy perhaps?).

Link:

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/arc ... ller/8911/

"....Barnes, now a sophomore at UNC, has lived up to the hype, both on and off the court. A 6-foot-8 small forward with a silky jumper and a knack for hitting game-winning shots, he’s also widely touted as college basketball’s most cerebral star since Bill Bradley. But where Bradley devoted his analytical abilities to hoops and academics, Barnes has added a third area of interest: the business of basketball. Barnes’s business acumen is what brought him to UNC—and accounts for the fact that he’s still there.

After his freshman season, Barnes would have been a certain top-five pick in the NBA draft. But he decided to pass up the league and return to college. Part of his rationale for doing so was the prospect of an NBA lockout. He also genuinely likes school. But a big reason he came back to UNC was that he believes remaining in college for at least one more year will eventually increase his endorsement potential. “The longer you stay in college,” Barnes explained, “the better a brand you build.

....That morning, he’d attended three classes at UNC’s highly regarded Kenan-Flagler Business School (including his favorite, Entrepreneurship), and he looked more like a college student interviewing for a job at an accounting firm than a soon-to-be-multimillionaire sports star. His manner was similarly restrained, one might even say businesslike. He sat bolt upright in his chair and paused carefully before each answer.

“The NBA is a business,” Barnes told me, elaborating that players are akin to pieces of inventory that, if they don’t produce, get replaced by other pieces that do. “But on the brighter side,” he added, “you do gain a lot of capital, and you have a platform from which you have avenues to do just about anything you want to do.” Indeed, Barnes seems amazed that more basketball players don’t take advantage of those avenues. “I think if anybody has an opportunity to play professional basketball,” he said, “to not transcend that into off-the-court endeavors is really a waste....”
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#668 » by tontoz » Fri Mar 23, 2012 5:20 pm

The Consiglieri wrote:
7-Day Dray wrote:Chad Ford just tweeted that Washington would take Beal as high as #2.

Sullinger played well last night too.


Feeling real good. A few of us started touting Beal during the past month and he is really playing up to that rep. Since February the kid has been on fire, making Barnes look quite the inferior product for our needs. As I've posted, at this point its 1. Davs 2. Beal 3. MKG (Ive just reversed their order) 4. Robinson 5. Oh cr#p, we couldn't get one of those four?



Definitely glad they have Beal ahead of MKG. I don't see the point of drafting a wing player who can't shoot.

Watched Beal for the first time last night. Doesn't look too small to me.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#669 » by dobrojim » Fri Mar 23, 2012 6:38 pm

I was nodding off last night when I got back from the game and
missed the 2nd half of Beal's performance. I saw enough on
the one play he chased down a break and got a block.
He looked like he had the length of a fwd on that play.
They say his wingspan is good.

Me likey.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#670 » by Liverbird » Fri Mar 23, 2012 6:54 pm

I see Beal's floor as Eric Gordon and ceiling as a Dwayne Wade lite. Outside of the overall #1 - I'd take him for this team as long as he's on the board - regardless of draft position. IF Jae Crowder lasts into the 2nd round - take him and call it the day. Else Tony Mitchell, Arnett Moultrie, Mo Harkless - whomever falls...

If we can find a taker for Lewis and Crawford for a veteran SG - that would be my ideal offseason.

Blatche....meh....who the hell knows.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#671 » by Ruzious » Fri Mar 23, 2012 7:24 pm

Austin Rivers has applied for the draft. That really surprised me - he's got a lot to prove and improve on. I'm still a lot higher on him than most people are - just think he made a mistake by not waiting a year.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#672 » by Dat2U » Fri Mar 23, 2012 7:27 pm

With Beal he does play bigger than he's listed. He's built very solidly and he shows decent slashing ability as well. I'm not sure I'd go top 2 just yet but I've got him in the top 5 range. He's become my 2nd favorite perimeter player in the draft behind MKG.

It was good to see that performance last night. I still have concerns regarding overall lack of production and the inconsistency on his jumper this year which was supposed to be one of his best traits. And the combination of being a bit undersized and not being an elite athlete stops me short of calling him an elite prospect. But still he appears to be a very good one. I'd say he's destined to be somewhere b/w James Harden and Eric Gordon at the top of SG lists in a few years.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#673 » by WizarDynasty » Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:17 pm

Beal is just way to undersized to pick in the lottery as a two guard. Eric Gordon is powerfully built and actually over powers players, beal just seems way to non athletic with little size to be a dominant player. He seems like a crawford type player coming off the bench as his best role. If he had monta ellis type athleticism at 6'3 then i would be more optimistic. I like the idea of going after harden and trading our lotto pick to ensure they don't match. Or maybe they do a sign and trade and we work it out pre-draft with some brilliant GM work, otherwise threaten OKC with a max contract offer to Harden to destroy their chances of keeping IBAKA.
Beal looks like a Jason Terry clone.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#674 » by closg00 » Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:29 pm

Trade Vesely for a 2nd rounder or combo him with a later 2nd round pick to move-up in the 2nd.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#675 » by Ruzious » Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:39 pm

WizarDynasty wrote:Beal is just way to undersized to pick in the lottery as a two guard. Eric Gordon is powerfully built and actually over powers players, beal just seems way to non athletic with little size to be a dominant player. He seems like a crawford type player coming off the bench as his best role. If he had monta ellis type athleticism at 6'3 then i would be more optimistic. I like the idea of going after harden and trading our lotto pick to ensure they don't match. Or maybe they do a sign and trade and we work it out pre-draft with some brilliant GM work, otherwise threaten OKC with a max contract offer to Harden to destroy their chances of keeping IBAKA.
Beal looks like a Jason Terry clone.

At 18 years old now, he's much bigger and MUCH stronger than Terry and Ellis are now. Beal isn't even undersized - much less "way to undersized".

Harden's not a free agent until after next season. Trading for him this off-season makes no sense, because he could leave.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#676 » by MF23 » Fri Mar 23, 2012 9:04 pm

I wouldn't dismiss Austin Rivers at all. He can become the best 2g out of this class. He has a lot of things to work on but his character is of one who probably will do whatever it takes. Never discount a person who comes from means but still shows hustle and hunger. I'd be willing to bet he's going to be a top 10 pick.

For the Wizards Rivers isn't someone I'd think about but I wouldn't look down on it if they picked him. All things considered I think he's a safe pick with a generous upside.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#677 » by The Consiglieri » Fri Mar 23, 2012 9:28 pm

Ruzious wrote:Austin Rivers has applied for the draft. That really surprised me - he's got a lot to prove and improve on. I'm still a lot higher on him than most people are - just think he made a mistake by not waiting a year.


Stupid decision. From the commentary I've seen on the guy, he's seen as someone who has a lot to learn and needs to figure it out, and this draft is already deep as hell, and he didnt play up to expectations. He was expected to slide in somewhere between 3 and 10, and everyone ive seen write on him suggests 8-25 instead. A real bad decision. He could have really improved his stock next year, and playing for Mike is a great way to do that. Foolish.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#678 » by truwizfan4evr » Fri Mar 23, 2012 9:58 pm

I understand we need a shooter but I really prefer a big man. You can always find a shooter its hard to find a solid big man. I rather us get Thomas Robinson or Andre Drummond just assuming we don't win lottery and take Anthony Davis. Those's guys would be my first options.
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#679 » by mhd » Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:25 pm

The following teams wouldn't take Beal IMO:
1) Hornets (have Gordon, and would take Drummond, MKG, and Robinson over him);
2) Bobcats (Henderson is ok, and would take Barnes, Drummond, Robinson, etc);
3) Pistons (would take Drummond, and Robinson, and Barnes, and MKG, and move Monroe to C);
4) Nets (Brooks);
5) Portland (would take Drummond, Robinson, etc, have Matthews signed longterm, and have E. Williams who they like).
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Re: 2012 NBA Draft - Part II 

Post#680 » by truwizfan4evr » Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:35 pm

mhd wrote:The following teams wouldn't take Beal IMO:
1) Hornets (have Gordon, and would take Drummond, MKG, and Robinson over him);
2) Bobcats (Henderson is ok, and would take Barnes, Drummond, Robinson, etc);
3) Pistons (would take Drummond, and Robinson, and Barnes, and MKG, and move Monroe to C);
4) Nets (Brooks);
5) Portland (would take Drummond, Robinson, etc, have Matthews signed longterm, and have E. Williams who they like).

WEll Gordan is a free agent still.
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