2012 NBA Draft - Part II

[jivelikenice]

I like Beal but do you guys see him as anything more than just a good player? Does he have the ability to complement his shooting w/ enough of n iso game to make him a bigtime SG?

IMO, what this team needs most is a sg/sf who can create off the dribble and have a good enough jumpshot to keep teams honest. We get stuck on offense when the game slows down to a grind it out type of affair. Will a shooter who' can't really create change that? Wall is best in the open floor. He already has a ton of responsibilities and we need to take some pressure off him when it turns into a haflcourt game. Which 2/3 in this draft has that ability?

[The Consiglieri]

Some VERY interesting tweets from Chad Ford last night

Chad Ford ‏ @chadfordinsider
Agree RT @nkeninitz: How do you feel about MKG vs Barnes, I feel like Gilchrist is a MUCH better prospect

Michael Kidd-Gilchrist is a warrior. Having a motor like that is a NBA skill.

Cody. He's been in our Top 10 since late December. RT @rinndogg: Who do you think has a higher ceiling, Cody or Tyler?

I know some think T. Zeller is too high on our Board. Played like Top 10 tonight. Scouts also high on Bullock. Potential 1st rd sleeper.

If Perry Jones played with Quincy Acy's toughness/intensity or if Acy had PJ3 size? No. 2 pick in Draft

Beal is No 4 in our Big Board and Mock. But could go a spot or 2 higher.


Yes, if Wiz get No 2 RT @danshanoff: Beal rebounds and defends way above 6-3. You'd never think "only 6-3." Any chance he goes 2nd?

Good game tonight from Bradley Beal. Hard to see how he misses at the next level. Such a complete NBA game, wish he was 2 inches taller

Theres a lot there... but the tweet I have in bold stood out the most for obvious reasons. Would you all be upset or dissapointed at taking Beal 2nd overall?

Not in the slightest, the only players in this draft that strike me as capable of becoming all stars among the top 10 are Davis, Drummond, MKG, Beal, and PJ3. The rest, guys like Robinson, Sully, Zeller, Barnes etc are all guys who have lower ceilings, or much lower ceilings but higher floors (Its impossible to see Robinson being a flat out bust, merely a good player sure, above average sure, flat out bust? No. Sully, very little chance of bust, high chance of a one dimensional guy whose only solid, Zeller will at worst be a capable center, in terms of value, in that Kaman-Bogut-D. Jordan area of not elite, but better than merely competent, and Barnes will always have his jump shooting ability, he'll always be able to score, but i dont see a dominant personality in him).

I would take Beal and not have a second thought because I already know he has a nearly Barnes like jumper and 3, and unlike Barnes, he is ferocious going to the hoop and contributes across the stat line and is a fiery competitor, an alpha dog ready to fight. Ever since I started studying him when I read and saw some wonderful things in November/December I became enamoured, and when the light went on in February he just seemed to go from a top recruit who could go 6-12, to an elite franchise possible guy. After Davis, I think he's the next closest thing to a sure thing in the draft. At bare minimum he will be a scorer and a stat line contributor across the board. Davis is going to at least be very good. MKG needs to develop the jumper, Drummond needs to have the mentality to fit the body and frame, and BBIQ. All those guys need something, to be able to turn the corner as a prospect, but Davis and Beal strike me as locks.

[pancakes3]

there is no panacea player in this draft, especially not a swingman to your specifications. anthony davis is close, but i have a hard time seeing him being a big time offensive force (25+ppg). a sg/sf who can create off the dribble and still be respected from range is a lot to ask for in a player and if someone has those skills, it'd be no secret.

beal is a complete player, has good athleticism, can shoot it from 3, and has a ton of overall talent. However, I'm anticipating gerald henderson with a jumper rather than the next wade incarnate.

[The Consiglieri]

A bit of a disheartening article on Wall (and Cousins) from grantland is somewhat relevant to team building:

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/772 ... us-cousins

[WizarDynasty]

Beal is a slight upgrade over crawford and he is smaller. He doesn't have dwade explosve athleticism to make up for his being undersized. He looks to be average athetlcally. Below average standing reach, and average athleticism doesn't translate to being a starter in this league. At best he is good bench player but he is going to get destroyed each night defensively if he your starter like ben gordon.

I would rather draft drummond and let him sit behind Nene and Seraphin for a 2-3 season until he gets it and then we have our bigman franchise player coming into his own just as we start to compete for a championhip with all of Nene's intangibles.
Wall and Drummond with Nene's Intangibles is worth the weight. Much more of a return versus drafting a slight upgrade over crawford who is about 3 inches shorter and doesn't get to the line alot even in college.
Option one is Lamb==he is everything we wished Nick Young. He is better than Beal because he is , has an explosive first step, and most importantly-- a very high basketball and works well without the ball in his hands. Either way i see us with a Uconn player if i am running things.
NO to barnes unless we get to late lottery draft picks.
Yes Beal has an aggressive style but he isn't a physically dominant player to go along with his aggressive style and he doesn't have an explosive step, something that is absolutely critical for an elite shooting guard.
I am quite happy with beal. yes he is thin, but his intangibles and fit with john wall are a match made in heaven. Drummond in 2-3 years is twice as good as MCgee if he has the rare two way center to imitate each day adn wizards are one of the handful of teams that drummond is guaranteed to reach his potential due to high iq two way veteran nene.

[Nivek]

I'm not completely sold on Beal either. I know I'm not sold on the other swingmen considered to be at the top of the draft (MKG and Barnes).

I would not draft Drummond under any circumstance. Whoever ends up taking him in the lottery is going to end up disappointed. Zeller will be a better pro.

[FAH1223]

Beal is a slight upgrade over crawford and he is smaller. He doesn't have dwade explosve athleticism to make up for his being undersized. He looks to be average athetlcally. Below average standing reach, and average athleticism doesn't translate to being a starter in this league. At best he is good bench player but he is going to get destroyed each night defensively if he your starter like ben gordon.

I would rather draft drummond and let him sit behind Nene and Seraphin for a 2-3 season until he gets it and then we have our bigman franchise player coming into his own just as we start to compete for a championhip with all of Nene's intangibles.
Wall and Drummond with Nene's Intangibles is worth the weight. Much more of a return versus drafting a slight upgrade over crawford who is about 3 inches shorter and doesn't get to the line alot even in college.
Option one is Lamb==he is everything we wished Nick Young. He is better than Beal because he is , has an explosive first step, and most importantly-- a very high basketball and works well without the ball in his hands. Either way i see us with a Uconn player if i am running things.
NO to barnes unless we get to late lottery draft picks.
Yes Beal has an aggressive style but he isn't a physically dominant player to go along with his aggressive style and he doesn't have an explosive step, something that is absolutely critical for an elite shooting guard.
I am quite happy with beal. yes he is thin, but his intangibles and fit with john wall are a match made in heaven. Drummond in 2-3 years is twice as good as MCgee if he has the rare two way center to imitate each day adn wizards are one of the handful of teams that drummond is guaranteed to reach his potential due to high iq two way veteran nene.

if we had kareem abdul jabbar to teach Drummond, I'd be all for it. But we don't have a big man coach.

[Earth2Ted]

That was a good but not great game by Beal against Louisville- unfortunately he just couldn't convert in the lane during crunch time, he missed on 3 different shots in traffic when Fla really needed it.

I'm sure I haven't seen his best work, but today he looked like a 6-10 pick, but not a top 3.

[jivelikenice]

I prefer Rivers to Beal. I know people on this board are down on him but if he measures in at 6'4 his stock will take off before the draft. His s first step gives him the chance to be something special in the NBA. He can shoot, create in the half court,change speeds, and get to the free throw line. His game will translate better to the NBA and I can see him being one of those guys that just has "it"....

[Dat2U]

I would not hesitate in taking MKG over Beal. There's a lot to like about Beal but I don't see stardom. I see a rock solid above average basketball player. That's great if your drafting 5th or 6th, I want a little more from a 2nd or 3rd pick.

I know everyone loves Ty Zeller, but I keep reminding myself he's 22 yrs old senior. So yes, he's going to come into the NBA and should be able to contribute immediately. But when the majority of his draft class is his current age, will he still be the standout he is now?

Andre Drummond is 4 years younger than Zeller. Even the much maligned Harrison Barnes is 3 years younger than Zeller.

I think a better case can be made for Cody Zeller being a high lottery pick. Ty Zeller should be getting lottery considering but I'd wary of taking him too high.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Dat, I think Cody almost without a doubt will be the better NBA player. Cody can be an all star some day IMO.

[The Consiglieri]

Cody's going back to school. Almost zero chance he declares.

[hands11]

So you guys are finally coming around. lol
When are you going to learn.

Yeah. I don't see the value at the top of this draft. Specially with how they would fit here.

I have been targeting Beal and Tyler from the start. Now Beal is up to #5. I really like his personality and build but even with him I have some concerns. I guess not many players are a sure thing. Watching him play a few more games he doesn't seem to have a great motor which isnt what I expected. I wish I would have seem more of him before his team got bumped. But he has a strong work ethic. I dont think the team that get him or Zeller are going to be unhappy.

Tanking is not a good strategy. I mean it gets you more value if you trade down but it can also set you up to over pay for a top pick just because you have the slot. Now that Beal is at #5, he isn't the value buy that he once was. Tyler is that player now. Hansen is still interesting. Not sure Im an seeing the star power here that you take with a top pick. Trade down was the right move last year and it looks to be again this year. Or trade the pick for an established player targeting SG and SF

I been saying I didnt think this class was as outstanding as other thought it would be and I think last years class was a lot better then most thought. I'm going to have to start researching down draft more for those gems. I know CCJ posted a bunch of player a few time.

Here is a kid that looks interesting.
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Evan-Fournier-5719/

This team is going to get to the next level by upgrading SG and SF mostly. That and back up PG. But I wouldn't mind having Zeller on the team either. So CCJ and DC, who ya got at SF and SG ?

[hands11]

Wouldnt suck to add this kid.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Doron-Lamb-5213/

Im not seeing the player in this draft that is going to give this team what it needs to really lift it as much as I see nice pieces you could add.

More likely the piece this team needs will come via trade or FA. I'd take Josh Smith if he could be had for our draft asset. Batum Its going to be a challenge to complete the team. It is easy to fill holes when they are gaping and there are many. Putting together the skill position pieces is harder to mesh. You have to get the right mix of players who are going to handle the ball the most since they can easily just shoot it. See Crawford.

Or they can just add some quality which could be a slow grow or something that sets you up for those final big piece players via trade etc.

[The Consiglieri]

Beal's a top 5 pick easy. Great BBIQ, highly coachable, great jump shot, has no trouble driving to the hoop and drawing his share of fouls. Defends, fills the entire stat line, smart, can contribute across the board and has no real weaknesses. Not sure if he'll have elite athleticism at the next level, probably not quite that level, but its hard to imagine him being anything less than very good to good which is better upside and floor combo than anyone in this draft not named Davis (and possibly MKG if he got his jump shot working at some point). Didn't know you were a booster, but I was at least second on the train . He's the best compromise pick if we dont get the #1 in a lot of ways, as he addresses need (smart guy to man the 2-he's WAY better than Crawford, that comparison is deeply flawed, he's a much better shooter than Crawford and he's far more efficient and intelligent on the court plus he contributes more across the board), addresses IQ, addresses chemistry, addresses motor issues and addresses the need for talent. There are a lot of other guys that can help too and fit in that top 4 or 5, but he's definitely in there after Davis. Very stoked to hear he may be #2 on our board.

[The Consiglieri]

One other note. With the 5 game spread between us and 4 and 5, we are doing really good. A nice bummer. Those teams are winning at a 1 in 3 rate, suggesting that they'll add about 6 wins the rest of the way, meaning if they played up to their season long trend, we'd need to play better than .500 ball the rest of the way to threaten our likely bottom 3 finish. It's looking more and more like we're locking in a bottom 3 finish, just got to make sure we lose those road games against garbage squads in april, the last 12 games are split between total horse manure teams and solid teams. Nothing much in between. A road/home split for the most part too.

Sounds for now like the pre-camp, pre tourney finale top 6 are:
1. Davis
2. Beal
3. MKG
4. Robinson
5. Drummond
6. Barnes

I love four of the six, and am intrigued and terrified of Drummond.

[hands11]

RFA, and Stern (and the new owner) aren't going to let the marquee player they got in return for CP3 just walk away.[/quote]
Its not up to them new Orleans can offer him a contract. But it doesn't mean he will resign. I would like wizards to go after him and we draft Thomas Robinson.[/quote]


That would no doubt be a solid way to go.

[SUPERBALLMAN]

Any good shooting SFs that might be there with our 2nd pick?

[Silvie Lysandra]

I like Beal...but when in doubt I got to go with the stud 2 way player. Not that Beal is a bad defender, but MKG outside of the jumper is the perfect SF prospect, a great slasher and finisher at the hoop, impact perimeter defender, great rebounder, incredible intangibles...MKG/Ves/Nene is a pretty intimidating and defensive frontcourt with depth to boot. We could add a guy like Ray Allen or another pure shooter, and probably win 40-42 games next year.

I wouldn't say Beal *doesn't* have superstar potential...but MKG's ceiling ranges between Gerald Wallace and Scottie Pippen.

[nate33]

I like Beal...but when in doubt I got to go with the stud 2 way player. Not that Beal is a bad defender, but MKG outside of the jumper is the perfect SF prospect, a great slasher and finisher at the hoop, impact perimeter defender, great rebounder, incredible intangibles...MKG/Ves/Nene is a pretty intimidating and defensive frontcourt with depth to boot. We could add a guy like Ray Allen or another pure shooter, and probably win 40-42 games next year.

I don't think MKG helps us win that much in the short term. He is going to be a bad fit until he develops a jumper. I'm not hating the idea of drafting him, I just think it'll take a couple of years before it really pays off.

My guess is that Drummond moves up the draft board as we get into the training camps, workouts and measurements. The guy is a physical freak and GM's always love physical freaks - regardless of how they actually play. I think Drummond goes 2nd. It's pretty much a sure bet that we will pick in the 3-5 range (a third place record gives us just a 4% chance of falling all the way to 6) so we're looking at a choice between Robinson, Beal and MKG. I'd be happy with any of them.

If we get Robinson, I wonder how much value Booker would have in a trade scenario? Could we trade Booker plus one of our 2nd rounders for a late lotto pick and land a shooter like Lamb? Booker is my favorite player on the team but he's redundant with Robinson and he has good trade value. It's also questionable whether we'll be able to retain him in 2014 if we sign a major free agent this summer or next summer. Loading up on rookies this summer makes sense as they would be up for new contracts when Nene comes off the books.

So our offseason could look something like this:
Draft Robinson
Trade Booker for the #13 pick and draft Doron Lamb
Sign Danny Green
Amnesty Blatche

PG Wall/Mack
SG Lamb/Crawford
SF Green/Singleton
PF Robinson/Vesely
C Nene/Seraphin

I'd actually look to trade or dump Crawford as I think his style of game would be detrimental to the development of Lamb. I'd rather have a guy like Mason as the backup and mentor. If we could add a guy like Ray Allen on a 1-year deal, I'd be all for it, but I don't see it happening.