Official Raptors 2012 NBA Draft Thread, Part 9

[fredericklove]

Athleticism: 1) MKG 2) Lamb 3) Beal 4) Barnes
Size: 1) Barnes 2) MKG 3) Lamb 4) Beal
Defense: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) Lamb
Strength: 1) Barnes 2) Beal 3) MKG 4) Lamb
Quickness: 1) Beal 2) MKG 3) Lamb 4) Barnes
Leadership: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) Lamb
Jump shot: 1) Barnes 2) Lamb 3) Beal 4) MKG
NBA ready: 1) Beal 2) Barnes 3) MKG 4) Lamb
Ball handling: 1) Beal 2) Lamb 3) MKG 4) Barnes
Potential: 1) Beal 2) Lamb 3) Barnes 4) MKG
Passing: 1) Beal 2) MKG 3) Lamb 4) Barnes
Intangibles: 1) MKG 2) Barnes 3) Beal 4) Lamb

[Tough Tony D]

A survey here, rank these 4 wings (Barnes, Beal, Lamb and MKG) in terms of these attributes (Athleticism, Size, Defense, Strength, Quickness, Leadership, Jump shot, NBA ready, Ball handling, Potential, Passing and Intangibles)

Athleticism: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Size: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Defense: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Strength: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Quickness: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Leadership: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Jump shot: 1) 2) 3) 4)
NBA ready: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Ball handling: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Potential: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Passing: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Intangibles: 1) 2) 3) 4)

Here's mine

Athleticism: 1)MKG 2)Beal 3)Lamb 4)Barnes
Size: 1)Barnes 2)MKG 3)Lamb 4)Beal
Defense: 1)MKG (by far) 2)Beal 3)Barnes 4)Lamb
Strength: 1)MKG 2)Barnes 3)Beal 4)Lamb
Quickness: 1)Beal 2)Lamb 3)MKG 4)Barnes
Leadership: 1)MKG 2)Beal 3)Barnes 4)Lamb
Jump shot: 1)Beal 2)Barnes 3)Lamb 4)MKG
NBA ready: 1)Barnes 2)Beal 3)MKG 4)Lamb
Ball handling: 1)Beal 2)Lamb 3)MKG 4)Barnes
Potential: 1)MKG 2)Beal 3)Lamb 4)Barnes
Passing: 1)Beal 2)MKG 3)Lamb 4)Barnes
Intangibles: 1)MKG 2)Beal 3)Barnes 4)Lamb

[AbC?]

1) Davis
2-8) Trade the pick everyone else sucks.

[Man of Steel]

dat wingspan :megusta:

[Marlo Stanfield]

A survey here, rank these 4 wings (Barnes, Beal, Lamb and MKG) in terms of these attributes (Athleticism, Size, Defense, Strength, Quickness, Leadership, Jump shot, NBA ready, Ball handling, Potential, Passing and Intangibles)

Athleticism: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Size: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Defense: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Strength: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Quickness: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Leadership: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Jump shot: 1) 2) 3) 4)
NBA ready: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Ball handling: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Potential: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Passing: 1) 2) 3) 4)
Intangibles: 1) 2) 3) 4)

Here's mine

Athleticism: 1)MKG 2)Beal 3)Lamb 4)Barnes
Size: 1)Barnes 2)MKG 3)Lamb 4)Beal
Defense: 1)MKG (by far) 2)Beal 3)Barnes 4)Lamb
Strength: 1)MKG 2)Barnes 3)Beal 4)Lamb
Quickness: 1)Beal 2)Lamb 3)MKG 4)Barnes
Leadership: 1)MKG 2)Beal 3)Barnes 4)Lamb
Jump shot: 1)Beal 2)Barnes 3)Lamb 4)MKG
NBA ready: 1)Barnes 2)Beal 3)MKG 4)Lamb
Ball handling: 1)Beal 2)Lamb 3)MKG 4)Barnes
Potential: 1)MKG 2)Beal 3)Lamb 4)Barnes
Passing: 1)Beal 2)MKG 3)Lamb 4)Barnes
Intangibles: 1)MKG 2)Beal 3)Barnes 4)Lamb

Athleticism: 1)Lamb 2)MKG 3)Beal 4)Barnes
Size: 1)Barnes 2)MKG 3)Lamb 4)Beal
Defense: 1)MKG 2)Beal 3)Barnes 4)Lamb
Strength: 1)Barnes 2)Beal 3)MKG 4)Lamb
Quickness: 1)MKG 2)Beal 3)Lamb 4)Barnes
Leadership: 1)MKG 2)Beal 3)Barnes 4)Lamb
Jump shot: 1)Beal 2)Lamb 3)Barnes 4)MKG
NBA ready: 1)Beal 2)MKG 3)Barnes 4)Lamb
Ball handling: 1)Beal 2)Lamb 3)MKG 4)Barnes
Potential: 1)Lamb 2)MKG 3)Beal 4)Barnes
Passing: 1)Beal 2)MKG 3)Lamb 4)Barnes
Intangibles: 1)MKG 2)Beal 3)Barnes 4)Lamb

[ash_k]

MKG is more athletic than Lamb??? explain and define athleticism in your books

[Los Manos]

Athleticism: 1) Lamb 2) MKG 3) Barnes 4) Beal
Size: 1) Barnes 2) Lamb 3) MKG 4) Beal
Defense: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Lamb 4) Barnes
Strength: 1) Beal 2) Barnes 3) MKG 4) Lamb
Quickness: 1) Lamb 2) Beal 3) MKG 4) Barnes
Leadership: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) Lamb
Jump shot: 1) Lamb 2) Barnes 3) Beal 4) MKG
NBA ready: 1) Barnes 2) Lamb 3) MKG 4) Beal
Ball handling: 1) Lamb 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) MKG
Potential: 1) Lamb 2) Barnes 3) Beal 4) MKG
Passing: 1) Beal 2) MKG 3) Lamb 4) Barnes
Intangibles: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) Lamb

[Eating a Book]

if someone could post the PER''s and pace adjusted stats for the top 8 prospects, it would be much appreciated.

Here's a spreadsheet I have with most of the 1st round prospects in this draft, and some of their advanced stats:
Link

I don't have pace-adjusted numbers there, but I do have ORtg/DRtg. I can add the per36 numbers as well.

This is DX's top 8, along with their PERs:

1. Davis - 35.4
2. Drummond - 21.9
3. MKG - 21.4
4. Robinson - 28
5. Beal - 22
6. Sullinger - 30.9
7. Barnes - 21.7
8. Henson - 25

Much appreciated.

Davis has a 141 ORtg and an 80 DRtg. Sweet mercy.

[JamesNaismith]

Athleticism: 1) Lamb 2) Beal 3) MKG 4) Barnes (all of them are quite average athletes)
Size: 1) Lamb 2) Barnes 3) MKG 4) Beal
Defense: 1) MKG 2) Barnes 3) Beal 4) Lamb
Strength: 1) Beal 2) Barnes 3) MKG 4) Lamb
Quickness: 1) Beal 2) MKG 3) Lamb 4) Barnes
Leadership: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) Lamb
Jump shot: 1) Lamb 2) Barnes 3) Beal 4) MKG
NBA ready: 1) Beal 2) MKG 3) Barnes 4) Lamb
Ball handling: 1) Lamb 2) Beal 3) MKG 4) Barnes
Potential: 1) Lamb 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) MKG
Passing: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Lamb 4) Barnes
Intangibles: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) Lamb

[Man of Steel]

MKG is more athletic than Lamb??? explain and define athleticism in your books

He's got a good first step and pretty solid ups. Saw a dunk of Lamb's in game that was reminiscent of Blake making Mozgov his prison b!tch. The workouts should give Lamb the boost everyone seems to know he deserves, I think he's being underrated right now (saw him as low as 12 on a mock). MKG is a more strong/dominant athlete but I'd definitely say Lamb is more fluid/quick.

[Los Manos]

Athleticism: 1) Lamb 2) MKG 3) Barnes 4) Beal
Size: 1) Barnes 2) Lamb 3) MKG 4) Beal
Defense: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Lamb 4) Barnes
Strength: 1) Beal 2) Barnes 3) MKG 4) Lamb
Quickness: 1) Lamb 2) Beal 3) MKG 4) Barnes
Leadership: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) Lamb
Jump shot: 1) Lamb 2) Barnes 3) Beal 4) MKG
NBA ready: 1) Barnes 2) Lamb 3) MKG 4) Beal
Ball handling: 1) Lamb 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) MKG
Potential: 1) Lamb 2) Barnes 3) Beal 4) MKG
Passing: 1) Beal 2) MKG 3) Lamb 4) Barnes
Intangibles: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) Lamb

Might be interesting to see what the totals are so for 1) 4 points, 2) 3 points, 3) 2 points, 4) 1 point

My totals are:

Lamb - 33
Beal - 30
MKG - 29
Barnes - 28

[Garmfay]

PPG don't tell the whole story. His effort has come into question, just see too many red flags as seen why he is rated in the late teens. Meanwhile, Royce White attacked the basket at will against Kentucky. 6'8'' 270lbs basically a freshman with point guard type skills. He just needs to cut the body fat to be a wing player

[Rapsfan07]

I don't get the Lamb love at all. Hes gonna be an average starter at best, he can't really create his own offense.

At this point my draft board is:
Harrison Barnes
Michael Kidd-Gilchrist
Royce White
Kendall Marshall

You have Royce White and Kendall Marshall ahead of Jeremy Lamb?!? Whatever....

Wow man...No offense by I thank God you're not drafting for us. Lamb and Sullinger are the safest picks in this draft. White and Marshall ahead of Lamb is lunacy. That'll set the franchise back for years and cost almost every GM their job.

Here's a spreadsheet I have with most of the 1st round prospects in this draft, and some of their advanced stats:
Link

I don't have pace-adjusted numbers there, but I do have ORtg/DRtg. I can add the per36 numbers as well.

This is DX's top 8, along with their PERs:

1. Davis - 35.4
2. Drummond - 21.9
3. MKG - 21.4
4. Robinson - 28
5. Beal - 22
6. Sullinger - 30.9
7. Barnes - 21.7
8. Henson - 25

Thanks Bboy... wow. Davis really is head and shoulders above everyone else. It's interesting to note however that the bigs generally have higher PERs than the smalls.

[fredericklove]

MKG is more athletic than Lamb??? explain and define athleticism in your books

Athleticism to me is a physical combination of mobility, agility, jump and acceleration. MKG is head and shoulder above in terms of his non-stop motor, agility in terms of him moving his body's position defensively is pretty much top-notch but okay solid offensively however, his reflex, endurance and balance are better than Lamb. He has a better jump, I'm not talking about hop but jump, MKG has a quicker bounce off the ground than Lamb imo, Lamb has that long wingspan which makes him looks good when he jumps, and acceleration he's one that can go coast-to-coast at full accelerated speed, and even in half court he has that too but he just doesn't know how to use hesitation move that well thats why he pulls the brake too often when he explodes 1st or 2nd step.

[Undefeated]

I think a reason why Andre Drummond gets this "soft label" is because of his lack of fundamental skills. He doesn't seem to know how to make himself big seeing how half the time he looks lost out on the floor trying to figure out what to do. When you watch him rebound the ball, he never boxes out getting low on his base like he's sitting on a chair using his rear to push/clear opponents out of his radius rather he uses his hops to out jump his opponent for the loose ball. Sometimes he misses those 50/50 battles because of his timing. Even when he sets a pick, he never gets his feet wide and plants them. And the picks he sets are usually too wide, low or high. I understand that he should have picked this up in high-school, but it's glaringly he really lacks fundamentals of a big man.

I don't think he's that raw either with his post game either. He understands how to use his limbs, especially those elbow when he's backing down his opponent and uses the "chicken-wing" on his defenders' back to get around and through. It's not really a hook, so he won't get called for the offensive foul.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNvdH5Bzz_Y[/youtube]

[Man of Steel]

PPG don't tell the whole story. His effort has come into question, just see too many red flags as seen why he is rated in the late teens. Meanwhile, Royce White attacked the basket at will against Kentucky. 6'8'' 270lbs basically a freshman with point guard type skills. He just needs to cut the body fat to be a wing player

Are there other red flags besides his effort? I don't think effort is the problem or we would have a similar situation to PJ3 and Drummond where they haven't produced (not the case).
May seem like a poor excuse but Lamb isn't the primary ball-handler for the huskies and doesn't get as many touches due to the nature of play we have seen from Napier and Boatright. However, he has still demonstrated great handles to go with a good first step, as well as demonstrating the ability to score off the ball, all equally important characteristics for any SG. That's why potential wise I think he's the best wing prospect based on tools.

Defense is an area where the other prospects edge him but with his length and lateral quickness, he's more than capable of defending and I think if Casey can get Bargnani to play defense, he can make a solid defender out of Lamb.

[ash_k]

MKG is more athletic than Lamb??? explain and define athleticism in your books

Athleticism to me is a physical combination of mobility, agility, jump and acceleration. MKG is head and shoulder above in terms of his non-stop motor, agility in terms of him moving his body's position defensively is pretty much top-notch but okay solid offensively however, his reflex, endurance and balance are better than Lamb. He has a better jump, I'm not talking about hop but jump, MKG has a quicker bounce off the ground than Lamb imo, Lamb has that long wingspan which makes him looks good when he jumps, and acceleration he's one that can go coast-to-coast at full accelerated speed, and even in half court he has that too but he just doesn't know how to use hesitation move that well thats why he pulls the brake too often when he explodes 1st or 2nd step.

Then 3 out 4 (Mobility, agility and jump) Lamb is way-ahead of MKG. Lamb is like a gazelle out there.

[fredericklove]

Athleticism: 1) Lamb 2) MKG 3) Barnes 4) Beal
Size: 1) Barnes 2) Lamb 3) MKG 4) Beal
Defense: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Lamb 4) Barnes
Strength: 1) Beal 2) Barnes 3) MKG 4) Lamb
Quickness: 1) Lamb 2) Beal 3) MKG 4) Barnes
Leadership: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) Lamb
Jump shot: 1) Lamb 2) Barnes 3) Beal 4) MKG
NBA ready: 1) Barnes 2) Lamb 3) MKG 4) Beal
Ball handling: 1) Lamb 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) MKG
Potential: 1) Lamb 2) Barnes 3) Beal 4) MKG
Passing: 1) Beal 2) MKG 3) Lamb 4) Barnes
Intangibles: 1) MKG 2) Beal 3) Barnes 4) Lamb

Might be interesting to see what the totals are so for 1) 4 points, 2) 3 points, 3) 2 points, 4) 1 point

My totals are:

Lamb - 33
Beal - 30
MKG - 29
Barnes - 28

I just did my total.

Beal - 36
MKG - 33
Barnes - 28
Lamb - 20

[Garmfay]

Wow man...No offense by I thank God you're not drafting for us. Lamb and Sullinger are the safest picks in this draft. White and Marshall ahead of Lamb is lunacy. That'll set the franchise back for years and cost almost every GM their job.

You don't stupid safe picks in a draft like this, you go for big risk big reward. We have enough average starters. What happened to Lamb in big games? Disappeared. Marshall made 5 all americans look good, look what happened when he got injured? I always had out of the box type lists but remember I had Turner at #9 in the DeRozan draft when he didn't declare because people said he was mid-late round pick.

I'm calling it out right now Royce White will be a stud.

[fredericklove]

MKG is more athletic than Lamb??? explain and define athleticism in your books

Athleticism to me is a physical combination of mobility, agility, jump and acceleration. MKG is head and shoulder above in terms of his non-stop motor, agility in terms of him moving his body's position defensively is pretty much top-notch but okay solid offensively however, his reflex, endurance and balance are better than Lamb. He has a better jump, I'm not talking about hop but jump, MKG has a quicker bounce off the ground than Lamb imo, Lamb has that long wingspan which makes him looks good when he jumps, and acceleration he's one that can go coast-to-coast at full accelerated speed, and even in half court he has that too but he just doesn't know how to use hesitation move that well thats why he pulls the brake too often when he explodes 1st or 2nd step.

Then 3 out 4 (Mobility, agility and jump) Lamb is way-ahead of MKG. Lamb is like a gazelle out there.

Can you sorta explain those 3 in a more detailed format and how Lamb is better at those areas than MKG?