Pistons vs Wizards--Tankalicious Delight

[Rafael122]

The last 3 games reminded me of the early Hughes/Arenas days where we would control the first 3 quarters and then watch it fall apart in the 4th. The inexperience and youth is showing. This team cannot close games right now. Chris Singleton missing a point blank layup/dunk is inexcusable. At least we held another team under 100 points, the problem is we can't even score 90. This team needs outside shooting in the worse way.

[tontoz]

Before the trade Singleton wouldn't play at the end of close games. Nick would be playing the 3. Whenever Singleton tries to dribble nothing good ever happens.

I wonder if he can score off the dribble in the warmups before the game. I have my doubts.

[Zonkerbl]

The last 3 games reminded me of the early Hughes/Arenas days where we would control the first 3 quarters and then watch it fall apart in the 4th. The inexperience and youth is showing. This team cannot close games right now. Chris Singleton missing a point blank layup/dunk is inexcusable. At least we held another team under 100 points, the problem is we can't even score 90. This team needs outside shooting in the worse way.

That's the value of crisp execution -- you can do it in the fourth quarter when you're tired. Athleticism and effort will keep you in the game the first three quarters while you're fresh. But crispness is what keeps you in the game in the fourth.

[Rafael122]

The last 3 games reminded me of the early Hughes/Arenas days where we would control the first 3 quarters and then watch it fall apart in the 4th. The inexperience and youth is showing. This team cannot close games right now. Chris Singleton missing a point blank layup/dunk is inexcusable. At least we held another team under 100 points, the problem is we can't even score 90. This team needs outside shooting in the worse way.

That's the value of crisp execution -- you can do it in the fourth quarter when you're tired. Athleticism and effort will keep you in the game the first three quarters while you're fresh. But crispness is what keeps you in the game in the fourth.

Also, this was the third of a back to back to back. They looked exhausted. Wall is 21 and he was out there looking like a 35 year old.

[Illuminaire]

Saying Wall is far from our biggest problem is the same as saying someone is the skinniest kid at fat kid camp. He's still part of the problem.

You say teams can easily defend us by packing it in, but the facts don't support that. Nene and Seraphin combined for 52% FG and Monroe was on the bench but Wall took as many shots as those two combined at 35%. So the obvious conclusion is the ball didn't enter the post nearly enough.

Steve Nash wouldn't have us playing .500 ball?!?!?!?!? That's ridiculous hyperbole. If this team were simply able to hold double-digit leads it would have won 4 out of the last 5.

Let me repeat, the Wizards have had a substantial lead in 4 out of the last 5 games. You think Steve Nash would have blown 4 leads you are kidding yourself.

You're the one kidding yourself. We get our leads by playing high energy ball and getting out on the break. Teams keep adjusting to our sets at halftime, we get tired and can't keep up the same effort, and we lose leads. But please, don't let reality get in the way of your opinion. (Wait, you don't)

Also, you know what would be cool, JJ? Stop by some time after Wall has a GOOD game. 'Cuz lately, I've only seen you post in game threads to beat your same, dead horse after his bad games. It's like you only participate to complain about your one soap box issue.

[tontoz]

It should be noted that Nene/Seraphin combined for 7 turnovers. I think the obvious reason for that is the paint is very crowded. If they try to dribble or pass there is a good chance of a TO because the spacing is so bad.

I would like to see Seraphin try to get all the way to the rim instead of settling for quick shots but realistically that is tough to do when so many people are in the paint.

[Illuminaire]

Indeed, take away their points scored on the fast break. Then see what their FG% was.

We were NOT dominating with post scoring last night.

[tontoz]

Indeed, take away their points scored on the fast break. Then see what their FG% was.

We were NOT dominating with post scoring last night.

True, i can think of two baskets by KS that were on the break so four of them were in the half court set. Nene only had 1 field goal for the game going into the last couple of minutes.

I think KS could be a very strong post scorer but without room to operate his effectiveness will be reduced.

[dobrojim]

I don't agree. This team is horrible all these chucker's. Guys who don't shoot well. Wall will be better once he gets a go to scorer and some shooters. We have times when we look dangerous when we have them big leads. Imagine when we get shooters and a all around scorer. If we draft the right pieces in this year draft. I expect the wizards to be in the playoff hunt next season. We also get a training camp in and hopefully a great coach or even an decent one.

Wall's shooting has seemingly fallen off of late (not sure what the stats actually
say) but I believe he needs to be one of the shooters on the roster. In addition
to a couple others...just sayin'

[dobrojim]

Can someone tell me why us losing these three games is bad, depressing, frustrating, etc.?

We could easily be 14-35, only being two games or so behind NJ (16-35), Tor (16-34), Det (16-33) "if we had beat them" and Sac (17-32).

With this season already down the toilet, being (11-38) is several times better for our chances to get better than (14-35).

I kinda agree. It's just that is obviously disheartening to lose games
like IND, ATL and DET when for the vast majority of the game, you were
winning.

[dobrojim]

The last 3 games reminded me of the early Hughes/Arenas days where we would control the first 3 quarters and then watch it fall apart in the 4th. The inexperience and youth is showing. This team cannot close games right now. Chris Singleton missing a point blank layup/dunk is inexcusable. At least we held another team under 100 points, the problem is we can't even score 90. This team needs outside shooting in the worse way.

we also got jobbed a couple/few times in the 4thQ.

We missed Book's boards even with the BruiseBros starting.

That and we in the heck would we leave a shooter open
like that? Thinking of Stuckey's late 3 that gave DET their
first lead since early in the 2nd Q. I HATE when players cheat
off their man like that.

[montestewart]

I'm not putting anybody but Paul in the category of flat better than Wall ever will be.

Magic says "HUH?"

The comparison was between Wall, D Will, and Westbrook. Was in a hurry when I typed anybody. Should have said any of the three.

Heck, there are a bunch of PGs I like better than Wall.

I know, just having some fun

[JonathanJoseph]

Saying Wall is far from our biggest problem is the same as saying someone is the skinniest kid at fat kid camp. He's still part of the problem.

You say teams can easily defend us by packing it in, but the facts don't support that. Nene and Seraphin combined for 52% FG and Monroe was on the bench but Wall took as many shots as those two combined at 35%. So the obvious conclusion is the ball didn't enter the post nearly enough.

Steve Nash wouldn't have us playing .500 ball?!?!?!?!? That's ridiculous hyperbole. If this team were simply able to hold double-digit leads it would have won 4 out of the last 5.

Let me repeat, the Wizards have had a substantial lead in 4 out of the last 5 games. You think Steve Nash would have blown 4 leads you are kidding yourself.

You're the one kidding yourself. We get our leads by playing high energy ball and getting out on the break. Teams keep adjusting to our sets at halftime, we get tired and can't keep up the same effort, and we lose leads. But please, don't let reality get in the way of your opinion. (Wait, you don't)

Also, you know what would be cool, JJ? Stop by some time after Wall has a GOOD game. 'Cuz lately, I've only seen you post in game threads to beat your same, dead horse after his bad games. It's like you only participate to complain about your one soap box issue.

Actually, I've posted effusive praise of Wall in the game threads where Wall actually played well. The reason you can't remember that is because it's only happened 3 times. At Detroit, At New Orleans and I think vs Miami.

[dobrojim]

jeez, 3 games all year.

Really?

[montestewart]

jeez, 3 games all year.

Really?

JJ, your tangent contains some truths. Prime Nash would do better, as would a bunch of others, but when you look at 2nd year PGs, I think it's a pretty short list that clearly would have done appreciably better under similar circumstances.

Wall has flaws, and many of them are observed and commented on by Wall fans. His passive spectator mode drives me batty, as does some of his out of control drives, and his shot is what it is (maybe it will get better with practice) but he shouldn't try some of his shots and instead try to make something else happen, even on this lousy team.

It's easy for most of us long-time Wizards observers to see how this situation can improve. More and better shooters, a clear (and good) go to scorer, less selfish players, team stability, and Wall getting more experience, making more veteran decisions, and improving his shot could all contribute to his improved play.

Looking at the bright side, the Wizards have won nine times when Wall was not having a good game. I'm still amazed that they managed to beat Portland on the road with Wall getting only 29 points (10-14 FGs) and only 9 assists, while allowing Felton to go off for four points.

[Illuminaire]

jeez, 3 games all year.

Really?

JJ, your tangent contains some truths. Prime Nash would do better, as would a bunch of others, but when you look at 2nd year PGs, I think it's a pretty short list that clearly would have done appreciably better under similar circumstances.

Wall has flaws, and many of them are observed and commented on by Wall fans. His passive spectator mode drives me batty, as does some of his out of control drives, and his shot is what it is (maybe it will get better with practice) but he shouldn't try some of his shots and instead try to make something else happen, even on this lousy team.

It's easy for most of us long-time Wizards observers to see how this situation can improve. More and better shooters, a clear (and good) go to scorer, less selfish players, team stability, and Wall getting more experience, making more veteran decisions, and improving his shot could all contribute to his improved play.

Looking at the bright side, the Wizards have won nine times when Wall was not having a good game. I'm still amazed that they managed to beat Portland on the road with Wall getting only 29 points (10-14 FGs) and only 9 assists, while allowing Felton to go off for four points.

Monte, can I give you a platonic hug as an expression of how awesome you are?

+1 Appreciation for the balance and thoughtfulness of that post.

[jivelikenice]

Actually, I've posted effusive praise of Wall in the game threads where Wall actually played well. The reason you can't remember that is because it's only happened 3 times. At Detroit, At New Orleans and I think vs Miami.

Thats just ridiculous and you lose credibility with a statement like that. I guess 38/8/6/4 steals on 59% shooting v Houston was a bad game.

I feel ridiculous even writing this but here are other examples of very high quality games.
25/7/8 v OKC
27/10/7 v Bos
31/7/5 v Tor
21/11/9 v Sac
19/15/5 v Mil
33/4/3 v Orl
20/14/6 v GS
29/9 v Por

These are just a few and he's had a lot of other solid games, but he's under a microscope here. He can put up 20/10 and there's still be talk about what else Wall could have done better in that game. He has flaws like we've all acknowledged but his improvement in a shorteneded condensed schedule w/ limited practice time has been very solid. He's in a little slump now and still has some bad habits but based on his improvement this year I think he'll get there with some work on his own plus better parts & coaching stability around him.

[Liverbird]

jeez, 3 games all year.

Really?

JJ, your tangent contains some truths. Prime Nash would do better, as would a bunch of others, but when you look at 2nd year PGs, I think it's a pretty short list that clearly would have done appreciably better under similar circumstances.

Wall has flaws, and many of them are observed and commented on by Wall fans. His passive spectator mode drives me batty, as does some of his out of control drives, and his shot is what it is (maybe it will get better with practice) but he shouldn't try some of his shots and instead try to make something else happen, even on this lousy team.

It's easy for most of us long-time Wizards observers to see how this situation can improve. More and better shooters, a clear (and good) go to scorer, less selfish players, team stability, and Wall getting more experience, making more veteran decisions, and improving his shot could all contribute to his improved play.

Looking at the bright side, the Wizards have won nine times when Wall was not having a good game. I'm still amazed that they managed to beat Portland on the road with Wall getting only 29 points (10-14 FGs) and only 9 assists, while allowing Felton to go off for four points.

Spot on Monte.

Wall (as have all our young'ins) have been subjected to really poor basketball and low BBIQ for the last couple years. Every one of them have developed poor habits and perhaps limited growth because of the circumstance. Certainly Wall has been on occasion sub-par and needs to improve his ability to run an offense, but IMO the fashion in which this team was constructed pre-trade, even the best of them would have struggled. Keep in mind he is only 21 and placed in a very difficult situation.

The only way Wall will start to improve is by 1) winning and 2) have a good mentor. He has neither of these at the moment although Nene seems like a good seed. For this reason, I'm not a believer of the tank. I think you need to win - period. With Nene, the improving Seraphin and Booker, the addition of complementary pieces in the draft/FA and a preseason I think we'll see improvements to his game.

[dobrojim]

Thats just ridiculous and you lose credibility with a statement like that.

old song done by the Allmans, Can't Lose What You Never Had.
I think that actually might have been an old Muddy Waters (McKinley Morganfield) song.

OK. That's unfair. I allow credibility to most all until they prove
they don't deserve it anymore.

In this case, You Can't Lose What You Have Not Recently Had.

[dobrojim]

Blatant throw of the game by the refs. When they waited two minutes into the wizards timeout to look at the foul on wall over and over again five times -- only to give it to detroit. You could see it in the wiz' eyes -- they knew the refs weren't going to let them win, no matter what happened. Wall was fouled on that dump off from Nene and they didn't call it. Detroit knew they could get away with murder on defense and nothing would be called.

Throughout the 4thQ the refs were driving our tank.
Chris Hanburger would have liked the D that DET played
on one play where nothing was called. Basic horsecollar.