Nick Young traded to Clippers/McGee to Denver/Nene to DC

[verbal8]

So why would McGee get paid 10M. I just don't get it. Unless he is the starting center, I just don't see it. And unless they make him the starting center, I'm not even sure he resigns with them. Just glad we don't have to deal with any of that.

Kris Humphries got 8 million last year. Kwame Brown got $7 million. It comes down to supply and demand, their aren't enough NBA capable 7 footers, so the ones there are get overpaid. DeAndre Jordan got $10 million+/year on a long term deal.

[tontoz]

So why would McGee get paid 10M. I just don't get it. Unless he is the starting center, I just don't see it. And unless they make him the starting center, I'm not even sure he resigns with them. Just glad we don't have to deal with any of that.

Kris Humphries got 8 million last year. Kwame Brown got $7 million. It comes down to supply and demand, their aren't enough NBA capable 7 footers, so the ones there are get overpaid. DeAndre Jordan got $10 million+/year on a long term deal.

When the trade happened i checked out the Clippers board for awhile. I was surprised how many people were really down on Jordan. I saw several people say that matching the offer for Jordan was a mistake.

[nate33]

Pretty sure the next big game he has (if they advance past the Lakers) it will up his salary again by a couple mil. It's so funny watching the overreaction to his highs and lows.

What makes McGee so different ?

He is a bench player. Bench players have big games sometimes. Well at least the better bench players do.

Chris Anderson is going to make 4,526,000 next year. He is on their books for 2 more years. That is how much the guy who was their energy guy who backs up at center and blocked shots makes. And when CA had it rolling, he produced that game in and game out.

So why would McGee get paid 10M. I just don't get it. Unless he is the starting center, I just don't see it. And unless they make him the starting center, I'm not even sure he resigns with them. Just glad we don't have to deal with any of that.

Hands11, you can argue until you are blue in the face that McGee doesn't deserve $10M. It doesn't matter how many facts and examples you bring up, you will be wrong. There are too many GM's that will see McGee's "potential". It doesn't matter a bit that he isn't a starter. He's a freak athlete for his size and he has one of the longest standing reaches in NBA history. He also happens to post a PER around 20 at the age of 24. Somebody is going to pay him.

[dobrojim]

What's wrong with this: McGee and mom are happy in Denver. McGee accepts that he's just a part of winning team, an important piece of a team that with very young players has forced a game seven against the Lakers. Javale stays where he is, a rotation player playing for a HOF coach, on a team that has a chance to eliminate LA. McGee accepts 4 years, $42 M, because it's not just about the money with him. He is LOVED in Denver, and that team is going to get better.

Eventually, people are going to stop laughing at what might be a disability with McGee and they are going to accept that he plays with heart and hustle and that is all you can ask of anyone. Some people are challenged. Some people could not bench press 225 pounds if their life depended on it, and others could do it 20 times. Some people think algebra is hard and others can teach math, some folks cannot run a mile but others (including one of my all time favorite posters) run marathons.

So what if Javale isn't the brightest dude? I like him. I think he's going to be fine in Denver and he's okay even if this is who he is. I've already said I expect McGee will gain weight and get stronger like Bynum. He is not finished improving. Javale is a good rebounder and with increased strength he will get in the paint more. I don't think he's ever going to be consistent, but he's going to be considered a good C.

Also, with time his basketball IQ will get better. I am not sure about his impulsive moves or his struggles with asthma, but I think he's going to slow down for the better, and he seems to be do so now already. Again, I like Javale, mistakes and all. I appreciate that the guy is different and I think a good coach can work around his mistakes.

I think I know who you're talking about. Thanks for putting a smile on my face.

[closg00]

McGee last night: 2 points and 5 boards.

Snap back to reality. McGee is what he is: a talented but extremely erratic C.

The same could be posted after each of John Wall's crappy performances. Did you give-up on Wall?

[Dat2U]

But McGee has also been playing more or less exactly the way he played in Washington. His playoff PER is 20.8. It was 19.6 in Washington. The modest improvement can probably be explained by the fact that he is playing more minutes against backups, and Denver has the luxury of benching him when he plays poorly.

As miller31time points out, the narrative that McGee has suddenly picked up his game after leaving Washington is simply false. McGee remains the same player he always was. He has incredible talent mixed with an appalling lack of consistency and basketball IQ. Nothing he has done in the playoffs changes my mind about the trade.

Here's the argument I don't understand. It's the playoffs. That should mean more. That should carry a little weight. The matchup should carry a little weight. In DC, he wasn't playing playoff basketball. And I do see improvement. I'm actually seeing him consistently block out. I see him running with a purpose. He's still no where close to a finish product but I'm definitely seeing signs of progress.

[Dat2U]

McGee last night: 2 points and 5 boards.

Snap back to reality. McGee is what he is: a talented but extremely erratic C.

And Denver really missed him last night. The game was basically a blowout by the time he came into the game in the 1st & 3rd quarters.

[Nivek]

Dat: I think there's a danger in placing a lot of emphasis on the playoffs. McGee has played well in a couple of the games, but his entire playoff career is 6 games and 150 minutes. His regular season sample is 275 games (including 153 starts) and 5839 minutes. Then look closer at the playoff record. It shows the same peaks and valleys in quality of play he has in the regular season. His aggregate numbers in the playoffs are pretty similar to what he's done in the regular season. There may be signs of progress, but how many times have we seen such signs? Dozens. If not more. Often followed by backsliding.

I like McGee. I think he has the ability to be a great player. But, if I was a GM, I don't think I'd be willing to make a $40-50 million bet on him becoming great.

It's nice that he's had some good games in the playoffs. It's good that they've come against Bynum and the Lakers. But, he's also had two crappy games and two mediocre games in the same playoffs against the same guy. It's only 6 games.

Now, if he suddenly goes on a sustained run of good play throughout a deep playoff run, then maybe start paying more attention to the playoffs. But so far, the playoff record looks a lot like his regular season record. The safer bet at the moment is that he's going to continue that pattern in the future. That's the way I'd bet until he SHOWS a break in the pattern.

[hands11]

Dat: I think there's a danger in placing a lot of emphasis on the playoffs. McGee has played well in a couple of the games, but his entire playoff career is 6 games and 150 minutes. His regular season sample is 275 games (including 153 starts) and 5839 minutes. Then look closer at the playoff record. It shows the same peaks and valleys in quality of play he has in the regular season. His aggregate numbers in the playoffs are pretty similar to what he's done in the regular season. There may be signs of progress, but how many times have we seen such signs? Dozens. If not more. Often followed by backsliding.

I like McGee. I think he has the ability to be a great player. But, if I was a GM, I don't think I'd be willing to make a $40-50 million bet on him becoming great.

It's nice that he's had some good games in the playoffs. It's good that they've come against Bynum and the Lakers. But, he's also had two crappy games and two mediocre games in the same playoffs against the same guy. It's only 6 games.

Now, if he suddenly goes on a sustained run of good play throughout a deep playoff run, then maybe start paying more attention to the playoffs. But so far, the playoff record looks a lot like his regular season record. The safer bet at the moment is that he's going to continue that pattern in the future. That's the way I'd bet until he SHOWS a break in the pattern.

Exactly.

McGee has ripped off pretty good string for the Wiz. 8 games or so. One good game is no surprise for McGee. He defiantly has that in him. In the environment he is in on this team, he will try extra hard not to do bone headed plays. But unless they go on a long run in the playoffs, he just hasn't had the time to prove anything different then what he has while on the Wizards.

It still comes down to this, he is a back up. How much will Denver pay for a back up ? in order to get overpaid, some team that isn't as good is going to have to want him as their starter. Regarding Denver, unless he is the starter before these playoffs are over, I don't see it happening in the off-season. So they will only offer him back up player dollars.

I don't see any other good team signing him to start so they aren't offering the big dollars.

That leaves the crappier teams. Of them, who would do it ? And if he does go to a crapper team, he very well may not have a coach that can help him as much. He will be right back were he came from and in that environment, he will struggle more. If that happens, I could see him putting up big numbers though. Kind of a Cousins thing though. They will be empty. But in about 3 years, he could get it all together and really become a solid player.

NO could do it. That would be a good town for McGee. I could see that happening.
Cleveland could do it. Move Anderson to PF.

I guess there are enough bad teams out there that someone might pay him, but it isnt going to be a good team.

[closg00]

Hermit and some others may want to skip this post.

Re: Tank at Tank Game Thread: The Ship Be Sinkin 2/6/12 7
by Chocolate City Jordanaire on Tue Feb 07, 2012 6:53 am

Edit:

HOWEVER, I am also convinced McGee is a better-than-average NBA player. His strength is his capacity to give weak side help and block shots at the rim. McGee has a PER of 18.7, by far the highest on the Wizards. (Booker is next at 16.3). By Win Score/48, McGee is second to Booker. By block percentage, Javale McGee is #1 in the NBA for the THIRD YEAR IN A ROW. McGee is also #10 in the NBA in offensive rebound percentage. IMO Wittman is right to tell McGee to block shots. I also like the fact, that Wittman is using Seraphin well off the bench, unlike Flip Saunders.

Fast-Forward post-trade

Coach: JaVale McGee Succeeds; CP3 Controls the Court
>snip<
The reality is that JaVale McGee has already discovered a better offensive role during his time in Denver. Most post players are taught to get to the strongside block and post there, looking for an entry pass, receiving the ball, finding cutters, then going to work. However, in Denver, a lot of McGee’s time is spent on the weakside in what would traditionally be called an empty post set.

This empty post tactic is a basic tenet of dribble drive motion offense. In many ways, a vacated strongside post unlocks the floor and gives more room to penetrators on the strong side. It also forces McGee’s defender to set up in a help position a lot of the time, which opens up a lot of opportunities for McGee that do not involve creating his own opportunity.

Weakside positioning means that McGee’s responsibilities include screening away from the ball (an easy task for him to handle), cutting and diving when there is penetration to an open area for a potential dump-off and easy score, and the mandate to go to the offensive glass. His positioning on the weakside means his defender is constantly in help, which is a difficult place to be when a shot goes up: McGee can crash hard and often, and is in great position to finish plays from there.

The entire article
http://www.hoopsworld.com/coach-javale- ... -the-court

Denver has begun to make adjustments utilizing JaVales strengths, can't wait to see what JaVale looks-like even after just one summer under Nuggets development/coaches.

[theboomking]

And I can't wait to see what Javale is going to look like after really working on his outside shot this summer, which McGee has said is going to be his focus

McGee is a terrible rim protector. Looking at McGee's block totals is about the worst way to measure him as a rim protector. The Wizards consistently allowed one of the worst at rim finishing percentages in the league with JaVale starting at center, and many on the board said it was because Wall and the rest of our wing players allowed too much penetration. Then McGee leaves and all of a sudden, even without Nene on the court, our defense is vastly improved and in the top half of the league.

McGee may well turn into a good offensive player. He has shown that he cares about this and has good tools. McGee will probably post great individual rebounding numbers, even if his effect on net rebounding for the team isn't overly positive. McGee however is just straight up a terrible man defender in the post and help defender. He has terrible recognition skills, and his lateral movement isn't good either.

CCJ, you earlier referenced McGee's problem perhaps being a disability. The reason I can't stand McGee is that I see his problem as being a diva-like attitude. McGee wants the spotlight. He sees himself as someone who should bring the ball up the court, pass the ball behind his back, and attempt dunks from the FT line. Javale acts like he buys into what his mother says about him being "the future of the league". God. I hope not.

McGee has never verbally acknowledged the importance of defensive rotations and playing within a team framework, and it seems like he just doesn't care about those things. If McGee would just one time, say the right thing, as even Blatche does, I would have more faith in his ability to ever reach his potential. McGee however doesn't even appear bright enough to say the right thing. A center with McGee's length and athleticism that is a huge defensive liability, is just a travesty. I'm not sure you can invest 40-50 million in a terrible defensive center and ever hope to win a championship.

[hands11]

You got it boom

He may get that 10M, but it isn't going to be on a good team.

On a good team, he is a part time Birdman with more offense and no drug or child porn problems. What is that worth ? 5M a year for 3 years ?

Tonight is a huge game. If McGee is going to have to change to prove he is worth more money, he needs more playoff game to do it.

So far he is 2 good games, 2 bad game and one ok game.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

And I can't wait to see what Javale is going to look like after really working on his outside shot this summer, which McGee has said is going to be his focus

McGee is a terrible rim protector. Looking at McGee's block totals is about the worst way to measure him as a rim protector. The Wizards consistently allowed one of the worst at rim finishing percentages in the league with JaVale starting at center, and many on the board said it was because Wall and the rest of our wing players allowed too much penetration. Then McGee leaves and all of a sudden, even without Nene on the court, our defense is vastly improved and in the top half of the league.

McGee may well turn into a good offensive player. He has shown that he cares about this and has good tools. McGee will probably post great individual rebounding numbers, even if his effect on net rebounding for the team isn't overly positive. McGee however is just straight up a terrible man defender in the post and help defender. He has terrible recognition skills, and his lateral movement isn't good either.

CCJ, you earlier referenced McGee's problem perhaps being a disability. The reason I can't stand McGee is that I see his problem as being a diva-like attitude. McGee wants the spotlight. He sees himself as someone who should bring the ball up the court, pass the ball behind his back, and attempt dunks from the FT line. Javale acts like he buys into what his mother says about him being "the future of the league". God. I hope not.

McGee has never verbally acknowledged the importance of defensive rotations and playing within a team framework, and it seems like he just doesn't care about those things. If McGee would just one time, say the right thing, as even Blatche does, I would have more faith in his ability to ever reach his potential. McGee however doesn't even appear bright enough to say the right thing. A center with McGee's length and athleticism that is a huge defensive liability, is just a travesty. I'm not sure you can invest 40-50 million in a terrible defensive center and ever hope to win a championship.

I kind of thought Pam and Javale were more correct than the Wizards. The Wizards failed to adjust at all with Flip. Randy clearly wasn't a fan of Javale McGee.

If he had a diva attitude in DC, perhaps you might consider that Flip didn't win a darned thing here starting Armstrong or Oberto or Blatche. Tapscott didn't do much. Ernie said buy the help you need.

Javale's going to reach whatever his potential is in Denver. George Karl is wise enough to start Mozgov. On this board, even before the trade I said START SERAPHIN if he's playing better at C. In fact that might keep McGee's asking price down. My main thought was start McGee with Seraphin, and experience the same thing the Nuggets have going with Faried and McGee. Two young guys with energy. But no, the Wizards had their system and everyone in DC wanted to focus on all McGee does that is embarrassing and on all how much HE MIGHT ASK FOR.

As it is, more power to the Wizards for turning the corner and acquiring Nene. It's looking like a good move.

At the same time, I'm not at all surprised the Nuggets have a good chance to end this Laker dynasty and McGee is a big part of why. He is what he is, a player you have to make accommodations around to use to his fullest potential.

[willbcocks]

CCJ: you can't really ignore what McGee will ask for when making decisions about the future. We could last year and the year before, but this was the year where we had to make a decision about how much cash he's worth to the team over how many years. I guess we'll see this summer, but I still think he'll get a DeAndre Jordan contract or more.

I think that might be an unfortunate scenario for McGee's playing career. If he gets a reasonable salary (32/4) and embraces the role, I think he could be a fan favorite high energy sub who could really make an impact. Instead I think his career might take a Haywood arc: he gets paid too much to be coming off the bench but isn't good enough to start, and so he frustrates the organization and fans.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

willb, I agree with you that McGee for the moment would appear to be much better off accepting role player status and less money and he will remain a fan favorite. What I doubt is any team wants to come in and offer McGee crazy dough kind of money. I don't see him commanding 12/13M, what Nene makes. That said, McGee will very likely chase the high dollar offer, wherever it comes from. It is the NBA way.

Denver might match and thus, the pressure and eventual Haywood status could follow.

[hands11]

I see some of you are finally coming around to what I have been saying.

So here is the deal with Denver, how are they going to make it all work in the long run.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/denver.htm

Miller is gone or can get signed for less. I would guess in the 2/3M range. The Wiz should even consider looking at adding him for a year.
Chandler signed a five-year deal worth $37 million, so throw another 7M. That put them at $49M

Have they used there amnesty yet ?

If they sign McGee to big money, they are going to be tight in years to come and they have other players to sign like Ty.

Oh, post game Shaq said McGee was coming to his big man camp.

So now we sit back and see if this works out long term for Denver. Should be interesting to see where McGee lands and for how much.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I see some of you are finally coming around to what I have been saying.

So here is the deal with Denver, how are they going to make it all work in the long run.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/denver.htm

Miller is gone or can get signed for less. I would guess in the 2/3M range. The Wiz should even consider looking at adding him for a year.
Chandler signed a five-year deal worth $37 million, so throw another 7M. That put them at $49M

Have they used there amnesty yet ?

If they sign McGee to big money, they are going to be tight in years to come and they have other players to sign like Ty.

Oh, post game Shaq said McGee was coming to his big man camp.

So now we sit back and see if this works out long term for Denver. Should be interesting to see where McGee lands and for how much.

After these playoffs, I bet Javale is going to have a bunch of older cats, uncles if you will, schooling him on the finer parts of the game. His heart and hustle were on display, but most of all, he competed fairly and with class.

When I saw what Bynum did on that play near the end I was thinking Javale HAS TO retaliate. Javale needs to learn how to place an elbow on a guys ribs when the ref isn't watching. McGee is thin but a lot of times boney dudes can inflict a lot of punishment if they learn how to connect bone against meat on some fleshy guy. Hit and run is what he needs to do to Bynum. Bump him and run past him down the other end. Then flop when Bynum hits him back.

Javale is a nice kid but I am sure a guy like Shaq is going to show him some things he needs to know. F Bynum.

[hands11]

McGee is going to have to do something because once you hit the playoffs, its even more of a mans game in the post. Hard fouls happen. Mommas boy is going to have to grow a set if he wants to be a start in the playoffs.

Yeah, Shaq and Charles were busting on Bynum for not bringing enough hustle while complimenting McGee on his.

I still don't see how Denver can afford much more then 7M for him.

I'm not sold that McGee will stay in Denver for less. Specially since he isn't starting. That would mean Denver has to start him. Will they do that ?

Because of all that is not worked out about where and what McGee will be, it makes the Wiz trade that much better. Actually, that had a lot to do with why they did it. 13M for Nene is not overpaying. Not sure why so many have been saying it is. Nene is worth more in Washington then he was in Denver because he is a bigger part of the offense. He has the green light here. He is a leader here.

On the flip side. Ty Lawson is a total steal. Dude makes 2,544,528 next year. But then he is up as a RFA. Denver has some figuring out to do.

[Ruzious]

I see some of you are finally coming around to what I have been saying.

So here is the deal with Denver, how are they going to make it all work in the long run.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/denver.htm

Miller is gone or can get signed for less. I would guess in the 2/3M range. The Wiz should even consider looking at adding him for a year.
Chandler signed a five-year deal worth $37 million, so throw another 7M. That put them at $49M

Have they used there amnesty yet ?

If they sign McGee to big money, they are going to be tight in years to come and they have other players to sign like Ty.

Oh, post game Shaq said McGee was coming to his big man camp.

So now we sit back and see if this works out long term for Denver. Should be interesting to see where McGee lands and for how much.

Denver can afford him for cap purposes. It's not like the NFL where there's a hard cap. You can go over the cap to re-sign your players. And their payroll isn't going to be so high that they'll have luxury tax issues. Otoh, I do think they've overpaid long-term a bit for their other perimeter players - Galinari, Afflalo, Harrington, and probably Chandler. I think he'll end up re-signing with Denver. Overall, he showed enough that they're going to want to keep him. And they're a team lacking in star level talent, so he'd at least provide hope for them.

[Induveca]

I like the McGee/Faried combo. Those two should really feed off of each other.

Mark my words, Faried is going to be a MONSTER next season. Wouldn't surprise me at all if he averaged 22/12. The guy is a perennial all star in the making. He barely knows what he's doing out there and already has stretches of dominance purely due to "force of will".

Bravo to McGee, he gained a TON of respect around the league with this series. Best thing that could have happened to him and Washington, they both lose some of the "knucklehead" vibe. Very definition of addition by subtraction.