Was Shaq a bad influence in any way on Wade?

[FlashKing]

I'm probably reaching big time here but I feel like Wades attitude changed when Shaq joined Miami. Wade was just a humble kid in his rookie year, then Shaq with all his baggage came down here. Shaq, infamous for being lazy and outta shape, choosing when to play hard. I feel like some of those characteristics have kinda rubbed off on Wade. obviously the guy is in great shape, but basketball shape, that is another story.

Wade has been injury plagued since last season, coincidentally enough the same time he got rid of Tim Grover. Wade along with LeBron making fun of Dirk's sickness during the finals, Shaq use to make fun of players as well, not to that extent, but he acted like a douche as well. Shaq could also be a cancer in the locker room, almost getting into it with Pat Riley during practice, dissing Wade when he was still on the team. like I said, i'm probably reaching here, i'm just trying to come up with an explanation for his behavior.

[arsenic]

[OtW]

I see where you are going with this.

Ugh,

I feel like we need a general DWade thread. I hate bashing on our players as hard as we have with bad losses like the Game 2 one, but I just feel the need to rip the way Wade has changed over the years. Didn't Riley call him out on his laziness and conditioning? Was it 2007? Shaq insulted other players?

Sounds like a source alright. Add on top of that telling the media stupid ish.

[Miamis3rdRing]

It's hard to know/tell how Wade would have turned out even without Shaq.

The guy started getting a ton of publicity during the those 2004 playoffs. It was basically a foregone conclusion (IMO) that the guy was on his way to becoming a big-time player. Even without Shaq his ego might have grown.

I do think Shaq MIGHT (And even this is up for debate considering the fact that he's had some great regular seasons) have screwed with him as far as his regular season effort goes. Then again, the regular season really doesn't matter. It's a long and grueling marathon, you just want to get thru it and be as healthy as possible.

Kind of OT...even though Shaq is kind of a d*** and a horrible analyst lol I'm glad he came here. Wade was the man in the Finals but without Shaq we don't even get there. Him coming to Miami really put the Heat on the map as far as being legit contenders. It's so freaking hard to win a championship. Look at this core and what happened last year, how we've struggled at times this year...alright I'll stop ranting now lol


Short answer:
Maybe, maybe not. Hard to tell how Wade would have turned out w/out Shaq. The guy went from basically a nobody early on to a player that people knew was going to be a star by the end of his rookie season.

[FlashKing]

I just want to make something perfectly clear.. i'm glad Shaq was traded to Miami. he was a big part in Miami winning it's only NBA title. i'm just bringing up his off the court/on the court behavior and whether it rubbed off on Wade. this is just speculation of course, which is all it will ever be.

[Miamis3rdRing]

I just brought that up because Shaq reminded me of what we did in '06...and how it seems hard as hell to repeat that again.

Anyway...good thread. Should be interesting to hear what other people say.

[Vertical Limit]

Shaq did have sort of a laid back influence on Wade, but he also encouraged/taught Wade to work on those post moves you see him use often. Look at Kobe and his post moves too, you know Shaq had an influence on him too.

Honestly, it doesn't even matter. When it's playoff time, Wade has always been serious and has taken it to another level. So far this postseason he hasn't done so but I think this loss we just had may have stung enough for him to wake up.

[Moggs24]

Why all the negative Wade posts everywhere. Wade gave his all last night and he always gives his all in the playoffs. What exactly did wade do wrong? Every single player in the league argues with the official when they are mad about a call and if your a superstar you get to be more dramatic. The guy is in great shape, his effort is there, I really don't see what you are talking about.

The post game comment wasn't a big deal, nor was the Dirk coughing incident. Let's remember Lebron and Bosh are the guys we usually bash here, what have we run out of bad things to say about them?

[Vertical Limit]

That one drive to the basket where I think Hill hit him on the chest and there was no call, that was **** bull. That was a clear foul that they did not give to Wade.

[FlashKing]

Why all the negative Wade posts everywhere. Wade gave his all last night and he always gives his all in the playoffs. What exactly did wade do wrong? Every single player in the league argues with the official when they are mad about a call and if your a superstar you get to be more dramatic. The guy is in great shape, his effort is there, I really don't see what you are talking about.

The post game comment wasn't a big deal, nor was the Dirk coughing incident. Let's remember Lebron and Bosh are the guys we usually bash here, what have we run out of bad things to say about them?

Are you seriously going to turn a blind eye to the way Wade behaves on the court at times? not getting back on defense when he doesn't get a call his way, last night being just another example when he blindsided Collison after he didn't get the call. just because Celtics fans approve of Garnett's dirty tactics, doesn't mean I should approve of Wades.

..and when did I say he wasn't in great shape? I questioned whether he's in game shape, big difference. just because a body builder is ripped, doesn't mean he can run a marathon. Wade has been plagued with injuries the last 2 seasons. maybe that is due in large part to lack of conditioning.

[Chessboxer]

Its tough to say. I read a portion of Shaqs' book and he compared and contrasted his time with LA and Miami with Wade and Kobe. He mentioned that he mentored Wade on how to carry himself like a star player on and off the court as soon as he got to Miami, part of it at the request of Riley.

Yes, I do think Shaq had a positive influence on Wade.As much flak as Shaq takes over his conditioning and approach to the game, he always had the correct mindset when he took the floor. I remember when Wade was playing the Wizards when Shaq was injured, The first game Wade had a dissapointing first half. We all know how that series turned out. Wade basically said Shaq told him to "be the best player on the floor".

In terms of the 'regular season doesn't matter only the playoffs do', I can see some merit. However, I do think Shaq as an all time great player brought a certain mentality of individual dominance and ego that great players need to have and that was something Wade benefitted from.

A little off topic but I agree with the OP concerning Wade and his conditioning this year. He really needs to get back with Tim Grover. He's always looked his best with Grover. I admire Wade for thinking progressively and focusing on body mechanics, balance and coordination. However, I don't see any appreciable impact in his game and he's had his most injury plagued season in the last 3 years, when the goal this past offseason was to reduce injury.

I don't think his offseason with Downs was that effective. You can blame the shortened season, but most of Wades' injuries started from the beginning of the season. I don't think its age either. He was amazing last year and he is only 30, not 35. Wade just looks stronger/agile and more explosive under Grover, his methods just seems to cultivate those attributes and are just suited to an athlete of Wade's calibre.

[DefenseWins]

The amount of Wade threads is unsettling but yes, his attitude is very annoying.

The wanting the foul and he doesn't get back on defense because of it.

Do you guys remember even in the Finals in Game 6, yeah we didn't have anything going but we were trying to make a run. Wade didn't get a foul call, and he gets a technical... things like that changes momentum. This is your last stance, and you get a technical? I remember Wade in his post game interviews in the Finals and boy is that a different Wade. The no expectations Wade and just wanting to win. Now we have expectations and I'm starting to think it's messing with their heads big time.

I also feel like this has escalated since LeBron came. LeBron is not influencing him, but they think they are invincible together and the best team. More like the best 2 guys in the league together...

but I don't know man, he is acting like a diva and it's sad.

It also has a negative impact on the team because of his antics. When he's frustrated the whole team will be, and that goes for LBJ. They have to set an example for these role players who suck lol.

Wade tends to take no BS from anyone, but he has to be careful... first he shoves Rip, and now Collison. It didn't look good either seeing as we lost too.

[RhapidKid]

[Moggs24]

Why all the negative Wade posts everywhere. Wade gave his all last night and he always gives his all in the playoffs. What exactly did wade do wrong? Every single player in the league argues with the official when they are mad about a call and if your a superstar you get to be more dramatic. The guy is in great shape, his effort is there, I really don't see what you are talking about.

The post game comment wasn't a big deal, nor was the Dirk coughing incident. Let's remember Lebron and Bosh are the guys we usually bash here, what have we run out of bad things to say about them?

Are you seriously going to turn a blind eye to the way Wade behaves on the court at times? not getting back on defense when he doesn't get a call his way, last night being just another example when he blindsided Collison after he didn't get the call. just because Celtics fans approve of Garnett's dirty tactics, doesn't mean I should approve of Wades.

..and when did I say he wasn't in great shape? I questioned whether he's in game shape, big difference. just because a body builder is ripped, doesn't mean he can run a marathon. Wade has been plagued with injuries the last 2 seasons. maybe that is due in large part to lack of conditioning.

No I am not going to turn a blind eye, I like every other heat fan hates when we bitches to the refs and doesn't get back on D. What I am pointing out is that this is a league wide problem and not a Wade issue. The superstars are all whiny bitches, but that is just par for the course. On this point I agree with you.

Where I don't agree is that I don't see the collison foul as that big of a deal. Was it poorly timed, absolutely but it was a frustration foul and it happens I don't see it as some pattern. Also the timing of this thread is terrible. why do we have to all turn on each other every time we lose. The rest of realgm is relentlessly hammering Wade, do we have to pile on.

And the last thing is that it is comical all you guys pointing out how wade should go back to Grover like you have any idea what you are talking about. First off do you know that he no longer is in touch with Grover? Perhaps he just wanted to spend the offseason in Miami instead of Chicago. none of you have any idea what his off season prep looked like and I have seen no sign that he wasn't and still is in great game shape. Wade missed 17 games this season. A large chunk of those were right at the beginning of the year with a heel/Plantar fascia issue that is simply bad luck and has nothing to do with conditioning and then the other large chunk was at the end of the season where he was clearly resting for the playoffs.

So I would like one of you fitness pros to explain to me what Grover would have done differently then downs and how that would have prevented him from missing the games he missed this season?

[Ratchet_Rio]

Why all the negative Wade posts everywhere. Wade gave his all last night and he always gives his all in the playoffs. What exactly did wade do wrong? Every single player in the league argues with the official when they are mad about a call and if your a superstar you get to be more dramatic. The guy is in great shape, his effort is there, I really don't see what you are talking about.

Everyone on this team has to be held accountable. Wade is supposed to be the leader of this team and he doesnt act like it. Wade gave his all last night and he always gives his all in the playoffs? Really? His ass is extremely lucky he's not being suspended for that cheapshot on Collison. I dont know what this guy is thinking anymore, Bosh is out, and you do something so potentially stupid. Think about how catastrophic it would have been to go into Indiana tied 1-1, with just LeBron. What happened to this guys jumper? Why wasn't he perfecting it in the offseason instead of going to fashion shows with Carmelo in Europe? How bad does Wade really want it? We're gonna find out tonight

[DefenseWins]

Yeah ... a lot of people wanted Wade suspended.

WHen he pushed Rip it wasn't much but the fact that he just pushes another guy again, they might start to look into it.

If Wade would have gotten suspended the next game, heads would roll lol.

[Moggs24]

Nothing you said is wrong, I just believe he wants it as bad as any player out there. Like you said the next few games will answer these questions.

Anyway Im going to sleep, I don't why we are all on hear at 2 in the morning anyways.

[NoComparison]

wade played his heart out in game 2.. idk wut yall talkin bout.

[RexBoyWonder]

To me the new attitude, annoying as it's been, is not the real issue with Wade. the real issue is his skiil-set.

In his best years he had a decent mid range jumper that really helped him get some easy buckets and vary his attack. one would think as a player get older his skillset will grow and improve, but for some reason the exact opposite happend with Wade.

SHOOTING IS THE MOST IMPORTANT ATTRIBUTE FOR A SG, and his jumper just died. it's very disapointing and hurts the team in huge ways. our offense could be in an all other level if Wade a good outside shot.

Wade's shooting is the biggest elephant in the room nobody is talking about.

When u look at all time greats, (MJ being the prime example) u see them devolping their game over the years, turning weaknesses into strengths. MJ had a worst jumper than Wade in his early years, but he kept working on it and it paid off in huge ways and made him the legand he became. Wade went the other direction, his shot somehow GOT WORSE, and as he's geting older this fact will despertly hurt his overall game. defenders can just lay off him and pack the paint and his moves are too predictable (get to the rim EVERY TIME). it makes life so much harder for him and for the team build around him.

I dont think it's too late. actually i expected him to come back this year with his good mid-range shot, but sadly that didnt happen at all. i still cant understand how is that possible. HE"S GOT TO WORK ON SHHOTING IN THE MOST DEVOTED AND SERIOUS WAY POSSIBLE, it's that important for him and for the Heat going forward.

[Heat3]

It's hard to tell, but sometimes I think so. Mainly cause of the "we'll turn the switch on" attitude this team has had since Shaq got here. I think it's stuck around since then. The only time Wade went all out was the year after his injury.

That might have been a natural progression of his personality by virtue of being a star, but I'll blame Shaq anyway