The Official What Would You Do This Off-Season Thread

[Fella504]

TRADE AMARE TRADE AMARE TRADE AMARE

[ORANGEandBLUE]

Smith impressed me with his defense and his team work this year

but make no mistake ... JR is a chucker first, cant dribble in a crowd and isnt much of a play maker


there are guys out there like Neal who are better fits for less money

not sure who specifically but Im not a scout either

I like Neal better than JR, but he'd cost the $2m, which could be better spent on filling other needs. Novak + JR > Neal.

[NoLayupRule]

Smith impressed me with his defense and his team work this year

but make no mistake ... JR is a chucker first, cant dribble in a crowd and isnt much of a play maker


there are guys out there like Neal who are better fits for less money

not sure who specifically but Im not a scout either

I like Neal better than JR, but he'd cost the $2m, which could be better spent on filling other needs. Novak + JR > Neal.

not him specifically as hes gonna probably stay put in SA

there are players in the NBDL and playing abroad and so forth who are talented but might be slightly limited. We see it every year. Like Neal or the thug in Atl who saved games for them so often this year.

point is we need to explore inexpensive role players much as we did this year with Novak and Lin

[crazybranman360]

Goals:
1. Maximize the potential of an Amare + Melo duo (whatever that potential is)
2. Coninuity + Chemistry
3. Solid Bench Unit


Moves:
1. Resign Lin, Novak, Jeffries
2. S&T Fields for Luke Ridnour
3. Sign Reggie Evans + Keith Bogans to the vet min
4. Draft a 3rd PG (Machado?)


Depth Chart:
Jeremy Lin/Luke Ridnour/#48
Iman Shumpert/Toney Douglas/Keith Bogans
Carmelo Anthony/Steve Novak
Amare Stoudamire/Reggie Evans
Tyson Chandler/Jared Jeffries/Josh Harrellson

[Dr. Detfink]

The only thing the Knicks can do, settle down and develop a personality. Players like Ama're have to understand they need to give Chandler help.

[spaceballer]

2. S&T Fields for Luke Ridnour

You can't S&T Fields for Ridnour. Ridnour gets paid $4M in 2012-2013. You would have to sign Fields to a $8M per year contract in order to do a S&T for a $4M per year contract. Under the Base Year Compensation rule, if you give him a raise as part of a S&T, Fields' contract only counts as either old salary value ($788,872) or 50% of new salary value, whichever is higher, for the purpose of matching salaries. And you're not even allowed to pay him $8M per year next year, since he's subject to the Gilbert Arenas Provision that limits him to MLE ($5M) for the first 2 yrs of his next contract.

Because Fields is subject to the Base Year Compensation rule, we will probably not be doing any S&T with him.

[crazybranman360]

2. S&T Fields for Luke Ridnour

You can't S&T Fields for Ridnour. Ridnour gets paid $4M in 2012-2013. You would have to sign Fields to a $8M per year contract in order to do a S&T for a $4M per year contract. Under the Base Year Compensation rule, if you give him a raise as part of a S&T, Fields' contract only counts as either old salary value ($788,872) or 50% of new salary value, whichever is higher, for the purpose of matching salaries. And you're not even allowed to pay him $8M per year next year, since he's subject to the Gilbert Arenas Provision that limits him to MLE ($5M) for the first 2 yrs of his next contract.

Because Fields is subject to the Base Year Compensation rule, we will probably not be doing any S&T with him.

Would a S&T for Barea work?

[TwelvePac]

1. It makes ZERO SENSE to try to dump Stoudemire for any old crap now. Like I said in the other silly thread involving that NONSENSE deal with the Warriors for Biedrins and Jefferson, it serves ZERO point for the Knicks to try to dump Stoudemire for useless players with big contracts. Unless some team is willing to give the Knicks a good offer (and you can tell when it's good) you keep Stoudemire. Let Woodson try with a full training camp to figure things out (you guys wanted to give D'Antoni years and years to work it out, so why not Woodson?).

2. If they manage to somehow get the ruling in their favor then you need to make a serious push for a PG like Nash. Keep pushing until Nash signs with someone else or with you. Nash being a straigh up guy I'd imagine won't hold this team hostage. Acquiring a guy like Nash would be HUGE in terms of solving the Anthony/Stoudemire dilemma.

3. Keep a sharp eye out on any amnesty and/or buyouts for quality guys that you can get for cheap. They don't have to be in their prime nor do they have to be sure things, but what you are looking for here is guys that can produce enough in a role that otherwise you would not be able to afford.

4. Draft? Honestly while sure you might get something out of it now, it may be best to look for a hidden gem of an upside guy. There's enough guys in the NBA that will be free that will take vet minimum contracts that can produce similar to what most 2nd rounders could for the next year or so. Might as well see if you can find someone that you think can turn into something (either a Euro that you need to stash overseas, or a raw high upside guy that may have some room to grow into a nice player).

Does trying to rid us of Stoudemire to become a better defensive team and allow us to put Melo at the four were he was killing his opponents makes ZERO SENSE? I am not sure how you feel about my proposal so let me have it.

I have no problem with trading Stoudemire IF the deal makes sense. Trading him for crap just to basically "not have to see his face, I'm so furious at him right now" isn't the way to go. It's highly unlikely that teams will be willing at this point to offer the Knicks what Stoudemire's real worth is. As such it doesn't make sense to try to trade him now. His value is probably at his lowest since the knee surgery 6 years ago. You don't trade low...that's GM'ing 101. Give him, and the team, a shot to figure things out...hope that he comes back with his mind clear (it really seemed like mentally he was out of it more so than physically) and come out strong. THEN you may look to trade him.

As far as putting Melo at the four? Not at all unless the plan is for Anthony to get worn out like Stoudemire got worn out during the 2010-2011 season playing out of position at C. And that would not be a smart move at all. Even if they deal Stoudemire, Anthony would/should still be the starting SF and you get a more physical rebounder/defender type (OR a perimeter threat type) to start alongside him at PF. At no point would I move Anthony to permanent starting PF...none.

My fear is that with Stoudemire his value could go either way. If it goes down you are stuck with him ala Elton Brand. Why not take advantage of a team like the Nets who are desperate for star power.

Gerald Wallace can play several positions and can play the 2 or come off the bench when Shump returns. I am fine starting Melo at the 3 but make no mistake, we shall go small at times with Melo at the 4 because it creates a very favorable match-up for us as was proven last year.

Another option is to put Gerald Wallace at PF in the defensive end while Melo plays the 4 on offense. Sounds desperate but I feel like we shall move Amare before is too late and getting a former NBA All-Defensive team player for him who is still relatively young is a great fit. Is like going back to the teams of the 90's.

[Pharmcat]

someone mentioned Chris Douglas-Roberts

great suggestion

cheap player who could be instant offense off the bench when needed

if CDR is so great, why couldnt he find work in the nba last season?

[Pharmcat]

Smith impressed me with his defense and his team work this year

but make no mistake ... JR is a chucker first, cant dribble in a crowd and isnt much of a play maker


there are guys out there like Neal who are better fits for less money

not sure who specifically but Im not a scout either

why would neal come here for a vet min deal when he can get more from some1 else or stay with the winning culture of spurs?

[Pharmcat]

specific names please

its easy to bash a guy for his negatives, but then not list any alternatives

No need to list names IMO. No need to replace him. Getting rid of JR is addition by subtraction in itself. Ideally JR Smith or a player like him has no place on the team with deep playoffs aspirations. Hopefully Woodson will design more plays to involve the whole team through passing. Then we won't need any JR-like "create his own shot" ala go one on one guys. Plus we already have Melo for that role in case anytime we absolutely want to go an iso.

JR has lead this team to victory, see that CLE when no 1 else could do much

its easy to bash him, but then replacing him is not so easy at the vet min....he provides a dynamic of the bench that no other player at the vet min can provide

[melo mvp 15]

specific names please

its easy to bash a guy for his negatives, but then not list any alternatives

No need to list names IMO. No need to replace him. Getting rid of JR is addition by subtraction in itself. Ideally JR Smith or a player like him has no place on the team with deep playoffs aspirations. Hopefully Woodson will design more plays to involve the whole team through passing. Then we won't need any JR-like "create his own shot" ala go one on one guys. Plus we already have Melo for that role in case anytime we absolutely want to go an iso.

JR has lead this team to victory, see that CLE when no 1 else could do much

its easy to bash him, but then replacing him is not so easy at the vet min....he provides a dynamic of the bench that no other player at the vet min can provide

I still can't believe all the hate JR gets. I mean, I assume it's from his playoff outing... but honestly he was way out of his role the entire series. The dude basically played PG, covered LeBron/Wade and was a 2nd option at times. He's obviously not gonna do that when everyone is healthy.

JR is an MLE type player, his immaturity and off the court problems lower that a little bit. But regardless, JR at one year $2.5 mil or $3 mil is a complete steal. Not only is the value great, but without him we have to find a replacement 6th man for minimum or our 2nd rounder- there's nobody nearly as good as him at that price. Our best hopes would be TMac, VC or even Iverson... personally I'd much rather have JR.

[LINIZALLSTAR]

I hated JR this season, but for some reason I hope he comes back for that price.
and also, I just want to see the whole team come back.
PG - Lin/Rookie/Bibby
SG - Shump/Smith/Fields
SF - Melo/Fields/Novak
PF - Stat/Jeffries
C - Chandler/Jorts

We're not missing talent, we're missing chemistry. Maybe a season without some sort of offseason drama or anything and no injuries and our guys will finally learn to play with each other.

[spaceballer]

2. S&T Fields for Luke Ridnour

You can't S&T Fields for Ridnour. Ridnour gets paid $4M in 2012-2013. You would have to sign Fields to a $8M per year contract in order to do a S&T for a $4M per year contract. Under the Base Year Compensation rule, if you give him a raise as part of a S&T, Fields' contract only counts as either old salary value ($788,872) or 50% of new salary value, whichever is higher, for the purpose of matching salaries. And you're not even allowed to pay him $8M per year next year, since he's subject to the Gilbert Arenas Provision that limits him to MLE ($5M) for the first 2 yrs of his next contract.

Because Fields is subject to the Base Year Compensation rule, we will probably not be doing any S&T with him.

Would a S&T for Barea work?

Barea is scheduled to get $4,493,000, which is even more than Ridnour's $4M. That makes it even more impossible with Fields and the Base Year Compensation rule. You'd have to sign Fields to a $9M per year contract to match salaries, and you can't even go above MLE for a player under the Gilbert Arenas Provision.

As a general rule, just forget about doing S&T's. The rules are different in the new CBA. In the old CBA, players WANT S&T's, in order to get the benefits of having a bird contract while going to a new team. You're not allowed to do that in the new CBA. So no players will agree to a S&T under the new CBA unless they desperately wish to join a particular team and it is capped out and can't sign them outright. All the previous benefits are gone. They rewrote the rules to discourage S&T's in the new CBA. They have even more onerous S&T restrictions for taxpaying and above the apron teams soon, scheduled to come into effect in 2013-2014.

Just forget about S&T's, unless you're dealing with a max player who wants to join a capped out team or something. No reason for any free agent to do go through the trouble of a S&T with so little benefit now.

[Dr. Detfink]

Would love to see how the Knicks can get their hands on Eric Gordon. Trade for Roy Hibbert. Ok, that's dream land...but that's just me.

[Mecca]

PG - Lin - Telfair - Nate
SG - Shump - Nate - Pietrus
SF - Melo - Pietrus
PF - Amar'e - Jorts
C - Tyson - Jeffries

[Retired_Doc]

Barea is scheduled to get $4,493,000, which is even more than Ridnour's $4M. That makes it even more impossible with Fields and the Base Year Compensation rule. You'd have to sign Fields to a $9M per year contract to match salaries, and you can't even go above MLE for a player under the Gilbert Arenas Provision.

As a general rule, just forget about doing S&T's. The rules are different in the new CBA. In the old CBA, players WANT S&T's, in order to get the benefits of having a bird contract while going to a new team. You're not allowed to do that in the new CBA. So no players will agree to a S&T under the new CBA unless they desperately wish to join a particular team and it is capped out and can't sign them outright. All the previous benefits are gone. They rewrote the rules to discourage S&T's in the new CBA. They have even more onerous S&T restrictions for taxpaying and above the apron teams soon, scheduled to come into effect in 2013-2014.

Just forget about S&T's, unless you're dealing with a max player who wants to join a capped out team or something. No reason for any free agent to do go through the trouble of a S&T with so little benefit now.

Very good response, spaceballer. You are one of the very most-informed posters on this forum! And greatly respected from what I can see!

[chales_zed]

Spaceballer is easily one of the best posters on this forum. If only he could add some more colour commentary and personality in his posts.

Props once again for yet another well-researched and informative post, Spaceballer.

I wouldn't want Barea in the team anyway, anybody who's watched him play for the Timberwolves will realise he's been rubbish sans Mavericks championship run.

JR has lead this team to victory, see that CLE when no 1 else could do much

its easy to bash him, but then replacing him is not so easy at the vet min....he provides a dynamic of the bench that no other player at the vet min can provide

JR can be a fantastic player if he can keep his head screwed on and is kept on a tight leash. The problem is that Woodson poorly utilised JR and accentuated his weaknesses and we've been given no reason to expect any improvement on his part.

[TKF]

Would love to see how the Knicks can get their hands on Eric Gordon. Trade for Roy Hibbert. Ok, that's dream land...but that's just me.

he has been a pleasant surprise for me the past few years.. better than I thought he would be at this point.. just needs to stay healthy..

[ctorres]

- I feel with Lin, Shump, Melo, Stat, and Tyson, we have our starting lineup completely set. Woodson strikes me as a man of integrity. Call me naive, but when he says he can make it work among Melo, Stat, and Tyson, I'm going to believe him.

- Novak and Smith can completely go off on a good night and that's something I would not take for granted.

- Jeffries I do not mind having at the minimum. Him and Tyson in the frontline for spurts can get us some major defensive stops against any team.

- It is crucial for us to develop BOTH Josh Harrelson and Jerome Jordan. Why look to spend over $5 million on a veteran big man when we have TWO big men with legitimate size making only $750,000 in salary a piece! Our coaching staff needs to get up off their asses and find roles for these guys. They don't have to be stars or even starters. However, there is no excuse for Jordan and Harrelson to not be able to give the team a quality 12-16 mpg each. They have the basketball skills to play at the NBA level.

- I would trade Landry Fields for a decent back-up point guard. Smith outplayed him at the end of the season on both ends. Fields has his benefits but they don't outweigh the limits his game possesses.

- I honestly don't know if Douglas can recover and save his basketball career.