ST: Red Sox @ Blue Jays | June 1-3

[whysoserious]

The league added this thing called trades?

1-1.5 fWAR. I don't make these up. There is a "linear plan upwards" when you have one of the strongest minor league systems in the minors.

What exactly are you arguing? Signing Fielder COULD have gotten us to the playoffs? That's the same thing I'm arguing.

We can trade for pieces.

Just look at the average age of the rotation and the position players. We are up and coming, nothing more nothing less. We have the prospects to make deals for positions of need, it's just stupid to jump the gun.

I understand there's trades, but guess what, signing someone cost you nothing but money and you can still make trades to push you over. I'm not saying outright that this was the year to go and get a Fielder type, but we can all see watching this guy, he could have helped in an area of concern.

If we're up and coming based on the rotation, we're wasting away our best hitter's prime in Bautista. Fielder is 4 year's younger, now he didn't hit as many HR's as Joey Bats the last couple of years but he sure as heck could have, and I say COULD have rounded out an offense around that growing starting pitching as it comes in to it's prime. Then we still would have had assets to make additional moves a year from now.

Some of you just assume that everything in the plan is going to go perfectly, everyone will develop and suddenly we'll sign or trade for those pieces. We very well may, but sometimes you have to make a couple of moves ahead of those in anticipation for something else.

[flatjacket1]

I understand there's trades, but guess what, signing someone cost you nothing but money and you can still make trades to push you over. I'm not saying outright that this was the year to go and get a Fielder type, but we can all see watching this guy, he could have helped in an area of concern.

If we're up and coming based on the rotation, we're wasting away our best hitter's prime in Bautista. Fielder is 4 year's younger, now he didn't hit as many HR's as Joey Bats the last couple of years but he sure as heck could have, and I say COULD have rounded out an offense around that growing starting pitching as it comes in to it's prime. Then we still would have had assets to make additional moves a year from now.

Some of you just assume that everything in the plan is going to go perfectly, everyone will develop and suddenly we'll sign or trade for those pieces. We very well may, but sometimes you have to make a couple of moves ahead of those in anticipation for something else.

Of course Fielder would have helped us. That's why he costs 214M. Josh Hamilton can help us next year. Does that mean we should sign him? No.

You can't rush a whole franchise because of one player. What about building around Lawrie? FA is a great trap to fall into. Players aged around 27-30 years old hit it coming off of their primes and get loaded.

There will be kinks in the armor. We will develop problems. Ricky might need TJ surgery tomorrow and never come out the same pitcher. Brett Lawrie can fracture his skull and be forced to retire. You never know. But signing a big name FA to stretch into MAYBE making the playoffs is a bad idea. Then once you get there you pull an Arizona 1 series and then everybody complains about how bad of a playoff team we are.

We have the power within our system to win a WS. We have enough talent to do that, it's just about converting it and retaining it. I'd rather watch Lawrie retire a Jay than have 35 year old Fielder sitting on the bench with a 20M+ paycheck. We have the talent. d'Arnaud is ranked higher than Lawrie ever was and is tearing up AAA. He is likely an improvement over JPA, which makes JPA expendable. We will get a nice return on him, maybe package him with Gose or Hech, you never know.

The possibilities are endless.

[Hamyltowne]

Some of you just assume that everything in the plan is going to go perfectly...

And some of you just assume money grows on trees.

Even with a billionaire owner--actually a corporation with much red tape, and not an eccentric industrial tycoon who grew up watching and loving the game--$200m is too much money to spend on a fat man playing a decade of baseball, two-thirds of which will be over age 30.

This is not terribly difficult to understand.

[BigLeagueChew]

I understand there's trades, but guess what, signing someone cost you nothing but money and you can still make trades to push you over. I'm not saying outright that this was the year to go and get a Fielder type, but we can all see watching this guy, he could have helped in an area of concern.

If we're up and coming based on the rotation, we're wasting away our best hitter's prime in Bautista. Fielder is 4 year's younger, now he didn't hit as many HR's as Joey Bats the last couple of years but he sure as heck could have, and I say COULD have rounded out an offense around that growing starting pitching as it comes in to it's prime. Then we still would have had assets to make additional moves a year from now.

Some of you just assume that everything in the plan is going to go perfectly, everyone will develop and suddenly we'll sign or trade for those pieces. We very well may, but sometimes you have to make a couple of moves ahead of those in anticipation for something else.

I agree with you to a certain extent ,however, AA has said he wants to build a winner first then acquire that big name to guarantee a winner, not the other way around. Is it the right way to go about things? Who really knows, the Jays have been a near .500 team for 20 years now and we've seen several different approaches to build a team that have all ended in the same way.

in the end , I worry that we don't end up being a great enough team for AA to fully commit to his wishes(competing in this division and signing a big name free agent) but if you look at the teams drafting+trade ability there is reason to be excited for the team going forward.

[Raptor_Guy]

Multiple threads talking about Prince Fielder now, great..

[LittleOzzy]

Need someone to make the next series thread please.

[whysoserious]

I'm excited about our prospects, I just think we had a unique opportunity to jump ahead this past off-season and next off-season even if' we're not that playoff team just yet this season. And It will only cost money in the end, not prospects given up which could be much more damaging.

In the end, I haven't seen the Jays go out and really land a big fish in a long time, we've been hovering around .500 and not really competitive for 20 years like BigLeagueChew mentioned.

I'm waiting to see the Jays actually commit to something. Maybe I'm pushing too soon but sometimes you have to make moves ahead of the actual timing. You just never know that the guy you want to round out the roster and fill the needs would be available at that exact timing.

[Santoki]

This game thread title should be changed to "28 useless pages of the David Cooper debate".

[SharoneWright]

Need someone to make the next series thread please.

I'll take a turn.