Official Speculation Thread (Pt. XXV: Offseason Edition)

[BadMofoPimp]

I am sorry, but that stats chart has Duhon better than Glen Davis. LOL

[Def Swami]

Wait, I'm coming in late here, but are people seriously debating if Rudy Gay is better than Anderson?

Yes...That is happening......on this board. How embarrassing dude.

I dare them to take this to the General Board.

Rudy Gay is a better basketball player than Ryan Anderson with higher upside. Someone tell me what Ryan does well consistently, other than shoot? He doesn't defend well, he doesn't know how to box out, he can't create off the dribble, he doesn't have a post game, no first step, hardly even has a mid-range game. He spreads the floor and shoots when he's open. That's his job. He is nothing more. Can he be? In due time, yes. But let's not fool ourselves. Gay + Dwight >>>> Ryan + Dwight

How many 6'9" athletic, scoring, slashing SF's with length to defend multiple positions are there in the NBA? Very few. How many Ryan Anderson's are there in the NBA? Plenty and more to be found in the draft. Acquiring athletes like Gay is extremely hard in the NBA, so when you have the opportunity to do it, you don't shed a tear for having to trade a jump shooting PF that can't defend.

As for the contract, yes it's massive. Which is why MEM is looking for a salary dump. These are the kind of deals we're going to get. I'd like to hold out and trade for Monta or J-Smoove, but it's highly unlikely with out assets. I still think landing Rudy Gay is highly unlikely with our assets, but if we're desperate to keep Dwight, then Gay as a sidekick fulfills the need. We have expiring deals to offer and we're a team willing to take on Gay's contract, making the pool of competition for Gay smaller, in our favor. The pool of competition for Smith and Ellis is far larger because more teams are willing to take those deals and we can't compete with those offers without some luck.

I'd welcome Gay. He's an athletic wing who can get to the basket and hit mid-range shots. Dwight + Gay is actually a good combo to build around. At age 25, Gay's best basketball is ahead of him.

[mhi]

This really is a ridiculous discussion. The argument should be how many good moves Bower has made as a GM and how anyone ever gave him a head coaching job.

[MagicTownBaller]

[img]http://img.tapatalk.com/48bcdba7-3ae1-1509.jpg[/img]
This should be our GM

[glennathan]

This really is a ridiculous discussion. The argument should be how many good moves Bower has made as a GM and how anyone ever gave him a head coaching job.

It is not that someone gave him a HC'S position but that he let Byron Scott go and he took over as head coach.

[magicman123]

Wow those stats are legit, I guess we should trade Dwight and redick for conley, do it

[Nyce_1]

This really is a ridiculous discussion. The argument should be how many good moves Bower has made as a GM and how anyone ever gave him a head coaching job.

It is not that someone gave him a HC'S position but that he let Byron Scott go and he took over as head coach.

hahaha

son, you only do this if you're Riley or Phil. Wow.

[eyriq]

Wait, I'm coming in late here, but are people seriously debating if Rudy Gay is better than Anderson?

I'm bored so ya'll suffer.

My position is that it is a nuanced discussion and if you are building a core different player styles a la the A, B, C system that someone described earlier is the better approach compared to the 'get his own' shot mantra that has so caught our collective appetites.

Also, I like to buck the idea that Anderson is a scrub or a Garrity or a Novak or a proven playoff bust and so on.

Edit: Not to mention it is hilarious watching guys trying to down play FACTS

[OrlChamps2030]

I heard the real reason we may trade D12 is to build around Ryan Anderson

[Carlos Arroyo]

Wait, I'm coming in late here, but are people seriously debating if Rudy Gay is better than Anderson?

I'm bored so ya'll suffer.

My position is that it is a nuanced discussion and if you are building a core different player styles a la the A, B, C system that someone described earlier is the better approach compared to the 'get his own' shot mantra that has so caught our collective appetites.

Also, I like to buck the idea that Anderson is a scrub or a Garrity or a Novak or a proven playoff bust and so on.

Edit: Not to mention it is hilarious watching guys trying to down play FACTS

those stats of yours have duhon better than glen davis soooooo Hmmmmmmmm

[mhectorgato]

Wait, I'm coming in late here, but are people seriously debating if Rudy Gay is better than Anderson?

I'm bored so ya'll suffer.

My position is that it is a nuanced discussion and if you are building a core different player styles a la the A, B, C system that someone described earlier is the better approach compared to the 'get his own' shot mantra that has so caught our collective appetites.

Also, I like to buck the idea that Anderson is a scrub or a Garrity or a Novak or a proven playoff bust and so on.

Edit: Not to mention it is hilarious watching guys trying to down play FACTS

You've not answered my question E ---

Based on your FACTS, does Ryan impact the game MORE than D12?

This is based on your highlighting Ryan's on/off number to compare to Rudy. (Ryno 15.4 vs Rudy -0.4)

So, is Ryan 66% more "impactful" than D12? (Ryno 15.4 vs D12 9.5)

[OrlChamps2030]

Wait, I'm coming in late here, but are people seriously debating if Rudy Gay is better than Anderson?

I'm bored so ya'll suffer.

My position is that it is a nuanced discussion and if you are building a core different player styles a la the A, B, C system that someone described earlier is the better approach compared to the 'get his own' shot mantra that has so caught our collective appetites.

Also, I like to buck the idea that Anderson is a scrub or a Garrity or a Novak or a proven playoff bust and so on.

Edit: Not to mention it is hilarious watching guys trying to down play FACTS

those stats of yours have duhon better than glen davis soooooo Hmmmmmmmm

Stats also show Duhon made Dwight play better and Ryan play at a all-star level...screw going for Nash we already have a Steve Nash in Duhon....#STARTDUHON2013

[Def Swami]

Wait, I'm coming in late here, but are people seriously debating if Rudy Gay is better than Anderson?

I'm bored so ya'll suffer.

My position is that it is a nuanced discussion and if you are building a core different player styles a la the A, B, C system that someone described earlier is the better approach compared to the 'get his own' shot mantra that has so caught our collective appetites.

Also, I like to buck the idea that Anderson is a scrub or a Garrity or a Novak or a proven playoff bust and so on.

Edit: Not to mention it is hilarious watching guys trying to down play FACTS

You've not answered my question E ---

Based on your FACTS, does Ryan impact the game MORE than D12?

This is based on your highlighting Ryan's on/off number to compare to Rudy.

So, is Ryan 66% more "impactful" than D12?

[CPBalla2003 n da 863]

I'm big on Anderson, but, Rudy is a better player, but it makes me wonder how much his game would change playing with a dominant post player, I know y'all will say Z-Bo, but half of his game is out on the elbows shooting, and using that to penetrate to the lane. as a third option, Anderson is the better fit for this team, i don't go for that contract, and rather go for J. Smith to compenstate defense on the perimeter, or go with a guard that can create his own shot and for others. if the contract was better, i would bite.

[ADRajX]

I would trade for Gay in a heartbeat... the guy has his critics and doubters... but at the end of the day, he's a YOUNG athletic and talented SF who can create almost any shot for himself, put the ball on the floor strong to the hoop, create shots for others, and score & rebound pretty well... he may not be the best individual defender at his position, but he plays good team defense overall.

He's also a legit Robin we can put next to Dwight's Batman... we've never had a perimeter player with his skills to pair with Dwight... I also believe Gay's numbers will be even better playing next to Dwight (since Dwight impacts the game in so many ways and helps his teammates look better than they really are).

[eyriq]

Wait, I'm coming in late here, but are people seriously debating if Rudy Gay is better than Anderson?

I'm bored so ya'll suffer.

My position is that it is a nuanced discussion and if you are building a core different player styles a la the A, B, C system that someone described earlier is the better approach compared to the 'get his own' shot mantra that has so caught our collective appetites.

Also, I like to buck the idea that Anderson is a scrub or a Garrity or a Novak or a proven playoff bust and so on.

Edit: Not to mention it is hilarious watching guys trying to down play FACTS

You've not answered my question E ---

Based on your FACTS, does Ryan impact the game MORE than D12?

This is based on your highlighting Ryan's on/off number to compare to Rudy.

So, is Ryan 66% more "impactful" than D12?

Well now, you can induce many things from those facts, but not that Anderson has more impact. The Plus-Minus component alludes to how well the unit performs with Anderson and/or with Dwight.

Edit: my pic no fit

Double Edit: Just to define the process of building on facts to create definite statements:

Inductive reasoning is the process of observing data, recognizing patterns, and
making generalizations based on those patterns. You probably use inductive
reasoning all the time without realizing it. For example, suppose your history
teacher likes to give “surprise” quizzes. You notice that, for the first four chapters
of the book, she gave a quiz the day after she covered the third lesson. Based on
the pattern in your observations, you might generalize that you will have a quiz
after the third lesson of every chapter. A generalization based on inductive
reasoning is called a conjecture.

http://math.kendallhunt.com/documents/d ... 895_02.pdf

[RickB-Orlando]

This really is a ridiculous discussion. The argument should be how many good moves Bower has made as a GM and how anyone ever gave him a head coaching job.

From Wikipedia:

Bower helped rebuild the Hornets, despite the troubles Hurricane Katrina placed on the club and the city of New Orleans in general. He took a giant step in re-writing Hornets history by trading franchise piece Baron Davis to the Warriors, then selecting guard Chris Paul fourth overall in the 2005 NBA Draft.

This alone is a move Otis would never have made, and SVG would have fought vehemently.

They broke out, with the dangerous roster of Tyson Chandler (whom Bower traded for in 2006 for J.R. Smith), Paul, Stojakovic, West, and new acquisition Morris Peterson (from Toronto), with pieces like 3-point specialists Rasual Butler and Jannero Pargo (the former acquired in a 2005 trade, the latter left prior to the 2008–09 NBA season) and rebounders Melvin Ely and Ryan Bowen; and developing youth such as Julian Wright and Hilton Armstrong (both draft picks of the Hornets). The general of it all was Coach of the Year Byron Scott prior to the 2004–05 NBA season, and the Hornets won 56 games, their first divisional title, and were labelled "contender" by many analysts.

Which tells me he can build a team, not just a collection of players, and he can work with his head coach to do so.

In fact, Bower's performance in spearheading the Hornets from lottery team to contender gave him 12 votes from the sportswriters for the Sporting News NBA Executive of the Year, behind Lakers' GM Mitch Kupchak and winner, Boston Celtics' Danny Ainge.

I have no idea if he's really the frontrunner or not, but if he is willing to take chances to develop youth rather than doggedly stick with older players on the downside of their career, and build a team that his coach can run their plans around, he's already better than Otis.

[ChildishGambino]

^^ you make great points....but for me the hang up is the fact that allegedly Bower and Alex are Friends....i'm not quite sure how i feel about that.....that fine line between professionalism and friendship will blur in that case.....i just don't know....

[J the Drafter]

I have no idea if he's really the frontrunner or not, but if he is willing to take chances to develop youth rather than doggedly stick with older players on the downside of their career, and build a team that his coach can run their plans around, he's already better than Otis.

I think you're too quick to dismiss the good Otis has done. Smith's biggest weakness has been overpaying when he didn't need to, and his desperate gamble in 2011.

[mhectorgato]

I'm bored so ya'll suffer.

My position is that it is a nuanced discussion and if you are building a core different player styles a la the A, B, C system that someone described earlier is the better approach compared to the 'get his own' shot mantra that has so caught our collective appetites.

Also, I like to buck the idea that Anderson is a scrub or a Garrity or a Novak or a proven playoff bust and so on.

Edit: Not to mention it is hilarious watching guys trying to down play FACTS

You've not answered my question E ---

Based on your FACTS, does Ryan impact the game MORE than D12?

This is based on your highlighting Ryan's on/off number to compare to Rudy.

So, is Ryan 66% more "impactful" than D12?

Well now, [/u]you can induce many things from those facts[/u], but not that Anderson has more impact. The Plus-Minus component alludes to how well the unit performs with Anderson and/or with Dwight.

Then how do you use that stat as a "FACT" to show Ryno > Gay?

That is in-fact what you are doing, as you went through the effort to:
1) put the boxes around the respective player's stat line.
2) put a red arrow (highlighting the negative value) pointing to Gay's on/off the floor value.
3) put a red arrow (highlighting the positive value) pointing to Ryno's on/off the floor value.

Further, if that stat can be misleading within the same team, how can you use to compare players with (1) different teammates (2) under different offensive and defensive schemes (3) against different opponents (4) with different injuries to starting lineups?

Inductive reasoning is the process of observing data, recognizing patterns, and
making generalizations based on those patterns. You prob...

Please don't go all maginno (aka condescending) on me.

***

I'm not saying that Ryno <<<< Gay or Gay >>>> Ryno. Just taking issue with your (mis)use of stats to state your position.