MIL/MIN

[WiscoKing13]

Bucks trade
Ellis-11
Gooden-6.2
Total-17.2

Minn Trades
Miller-4.8
Webster-5.3
Jonson-4
18
Total-14.1

Bucks do it to break up a back court that was awful last year and we are able to to get rid of gooden for intimidate cap space. This trade also gives the bucks a chance to to take a Zeller or Lenard, while at the same time be able to pick one of the 2 guards that will drop in the draft, maybe a ross type prospect.

Minn tries to take a large step forward by getting a top ten scorer in the league. They are able to get ellis by using their un guaranteed contracts to take on gooden and send a propsect who hasn't lived up to expectations.

Thoughts or swear words?

[Texas Chuck]

The idea makes sense--Minny consolidating pieces into a big-time scorer but Ellis is not a good fit for them. That team would be like the Nash Suns teams--they could score a ton but they would give up a ton and a half on the other end.

[Mattya]

I would rather just keep the pick and cap savings to go after guys who fit our needs better.

[WiscoKing13]

good value but bad fit in terms of monta and MINN?

[john2jer]

I think you mean #18, but yeah the value is close, but the fit is bad for Sota.

[WiscoKing13]

I think you mean #18, but yeah the value is close, but the fit is bad for Sota.

thanks for the heads up, fixed the pick

[[RCG]]

don't care for the trade for Minnesota if Ellis is the starting SG alongside Rubio.

It's more like a salary dump for Bucks except Minnesota throws in a pick. Should be more like:
Ellis/Gooden/12 for Webster/Miller/Milicic.
Bucks save some serious $$$ and Wolves trade cap-space for a late-lotto pick.

[WiscoKing13]

don't care for the trade for Minnesota if Ellis is the starting SG alongside Rubio.

It's more like a salary dump for Bucks except Minnesota throws in a pick. Should be more like:
Ellis/Gooden/12 for Webster/Miller/Milicic.
Bucks save some serious $$$ and Wolves trade cap-space for a late-lotto pick.

thats not even in the ball park, bucks aren't going to give you their best player on a good contract, the 12 pick and a guy left on a 3 year deal for no reason

[Texas Chuck]

don't care for the trade for Minnesota if Ellis is the starting SG alongside Rubio.

It's more like a salary dump for Bucks except Minnesota throws in a pick. Should be more like:
Ellis/Gooden/12 for Webster/Miller/Milicic.
Bucks save some serious $$$ and Wolves trade cap-space for a late-lotto pick.

UH no this deal is nothing like what you are saying. If Minny makes this deal its for Ellis its not to pay him and Gooden gobs of $$$ just to get their hands on 12. Also thats homertastic to expect Mil to give you two really productive players and a lotto pick just for cap space.

[[RCG]]

Well Minnesota has no need for two "really productive players" especially when one is a ball-dominant chucker. Continue using a Jennings-Ellis backcourt by all means.

[Texas Chuck]

Well Minnesota has no need for two "really productive players" especially when one is a ball-dominant chucker. Continue using a Jennings-Ellis backcourt by all means.

totally fine response. Original deal is fair value for Minny but if you read my first post I said he was a bad fit. But your claim that Mil needed to add value was crazy--simply say you dont want Ellis.

[Swimmer]

Honestly, I think RCG's version may be closer for me than the original. Monta is an undersized, flawed player getting paid $11M. Gooden is a journeyman for a reason, getting overpaid $7 for the next three years. Two arguably overpaid players.

In return, MIL is getting Miller (retiring, cap space), Webster (unguaranteed, essentially cap space), Johnson (admittedly sucks, but might turn it around in a change of scenery and if not, well, there's a 2013 team option), and #18 (cheap rookie on a good deal in a deep draft).

So roughly, an overpaid (negative) package from MIL in exchange for essentially pure cap space.

[john2jer]

Before this gets too crazy, as I said before, the value is there, but the fit is horrible. Because of the bad fit, Wolves fans are going to want/need more to be willing to do it. Now obiouvsly Bucks fans won't want to add more because the value is actually there.

The best thing to do would be to find a better fit for the Wolves that has similar value to the Bucks package, and make it a 3 way.

[crazybranman360]

Makes sense for both teams.

Ellis can come off the bench as a 6th man
Milwaukee clear room and gets another valuable pick


Derrick Williams might need to be included

[WiscoKing13]

Before this gets too crazy, as I said before, the value is there, but the fit is horrible. Because of the bad fit, Wolves fans are going to want/need more to be willing to do it. Now obiouvsly Bucks fans won't want to add more because the value is actually there.

The best thing to do would be to find a better fit for the Wolves that has similar value to the Bucks package, and make it a 3 way.

what SG or wing player would you be looking at

[[RCG]]

Before this gets too crazy, as I said before, the value is there, but the fit is horrible. Because of the bad fit, Wolves fans are going to want/need more to be willing to do it. Now obiouvsly Bucks fans won't want to add more because the value is actually there.

The best thing to do would be to find a better fit for the Wolves that has similar value to the Bucks package, and make it a 3 way.

what SG or wing player would you be looking at

I think players that fit better would be Andre Iguodala (more of a glue, all-around guy than a perfect fit - although he is expensive for production/ability/age), Rudy Gay, OJ Mayo, basically someone who plays above average defense, has adequate size for the position and can consistently hit the 3pt shot.

[yoyomayoma]

I was thinking something along the lines of Ellis/12/LMRAM for Williams/Miller/Webster. Seems to fill a lot of needs for the Wolves. Williams and 18 for the #2 gets them Beal so that would trump this. But a lineup of Rubio/Ellis/LMRAM/Love/Pek with a bench of Ridnour/Barea/12/18/Beasley makes them young and deep.

That said, my guess is Kevin Martin will be a Timberwolf next year.

[Xman]

Why is Ellis a bad fit in Minny?
Minny sux at SG (am I wrong - Webster?).
Ellis is a top scoring SG. Seems like putiing him playing off of Love and Rubio makes a lot of sense. Why does it not make sense?

Until I get info explaingin why he is a bad fit - I think the deal makes sense. Milwaukee give up the best player (on a 11 mil contract - which is not too bad for 2 years). Sucking up Gooden sux and giving up 18 sux - but that is a fairly cheap price to pay for what will be a key player on your team (second scorer).

[Texas Chuck]

heres a hint Xman: This isnt 1950s girls basketball. In other words everybody has to play both ways.

[[RCG]]

Why is Ellis a bad fit in Minny?
Minny sux at SG (am I wrong - Webster?).
Ellis is a top scoring SG. Seems like putiing him playing off of Love and Rubio makes a lot of sense. Why does it not make sense?

Until I get info explaingin why he is a bad fit - I think the deal makes sense. Milwaukee give up the best player (on a 11 mil contract - which is not too bad for 2 years). Sucking up Gooden sux and giving up 18 sux - but that is a fairly cheap price to pay for what will be a key player on your team (second scorer).

Have you seen him play, have you seen Rubio play? Just because he can score the ball does not make him a good fit. Ellis is a ball-dominant, under-sized SG who takes a lot of shots. Rubio is a true-PG, which by definition means he needs the ball in his hands to be effective. They aren't a good mix right there and wouldn't pair up well on the defensive side either.