2012 NBA Draft - Part V

[Ruzious]

Regarding Blatche, Hands11 brings up a good point that he can be our 5th big - our 3rd string center and power forward. As bad as he is, he's sure to be better than a rookie big we pick up with the #46 pick, or some vet minimum over-the-hill scrub like Tony Battie. And he costs us nothing.

No, it's a bad point, and it's a senseless point. You just won't give up on this guy. The word cancer is over-used in sports, but if there is a player who deserves that monicker, it's Blatche. He should not be around the team anymore - period. Having him back would be a step backwards in everything the organization says it's trying to do.

[Ruzious]

If Ted keeps Dray after failing to trade-him, then he will reveal himself as an owner more concerned with his money then he is about building a respected and winning organization. If he would rather poison the locker-room and fan experience at Verizon with the boo-birds just to keep his money, then fans have every right NOT to purchase tickets AND to complain loudly.

None of us really know what's going on behind the scenes with Blatche and the Zards as far as his relationship with his teammates (poison?); his relationship with the coaches, GM and owner, or Blatche's preparation for the upcoming season. All we know is what we see and know as fans--from the outside looking. So statements like this are pure nonsense, imo.

If Blatche is on the roster next season, I'm going to be at the Verizon Center rooting for him to succeed just as hard as I root for his teammates.

I think we all know enough in this case to have an informed opinon. It ain't rocket... surgery. The only things we don't know (which I won't speculate on) would probably make us more negative about keeping Blatche.

And it's not about rooting for him or against him, it's having to go through watching him play sluggishly and hurt the team. The average fan deserves better than that, and if they pay for a ticket, they're certainly entitled to boo him.

[nate33]

Regarding Blatche, Hands11 brings up a good point that he can be our 5th big - our 3rd string center and power forward. As bad as he is, he's sure to be better than a rookie big we pick up with the #46 pick, or some vet minimum over-the-hill scrub like Tony Battie. And he costs us nothing.

No, it's a bad point, and it's a senseless point. You just won't give up on this guy. The word cancer is over-used in sports, but if there is a player who deserves that monicker, it's Blatche. He should not be around the team anymore - period. Having him back would be a step backwards in everything the organization says it's trying to do.

Don't get me wrong Ruzious. I'd love nothing more than to "give up" on Blatche and have him amnestied. I'm just trying to maintain the perspective of an owner. If Blatche can serve as our 5th big and keep us from having to sign some other (worse) veteran for $1M, I can see Ted being interested. As a bonus, Blatche could end up playing better this year than last year (not a difficult task) so that his amnesty waiver value is boosted.

[DCZards]

How would Leonard's role have been any different with us Zard? Leonard would have had the same role that Singleton has and Ves had. Leonard plays the SF position period.

SF is a position not a role. Durant and LeBron are SFs, but their roles for their respective teams is very different than Leonard's role for SA. Just as Leonard's role with the Zards would have been different than it was for SA.

[sfam]

You can't build a team successfully around 2 perimeter players with no shooting range - no matter who you add. You can excuse it in a PG; you can't in a SF you're picking at 3. Unless MKG is showing in workouts that he's completely changing his shooting form - and we have no evidence that that's happened - there's no chance I'd consider him at 3. His offensive skills are way overrated. The only things he does well offensively are run the floor, drive to the hoop, dunk, and hit the offensive boards. He can't shoot with even mid-range, because his shooting on the way down is going to get blocked in the NBA if there's anyone within 10 feet of him. He's a mediocre ball-handler and can't handle in traffic. Contrary to a ton of posts here, he doesn't create shots for teammates. There is no Pippenesque point forward ability that he's shown - not even close. We drafted Vesely at 6 last year. If Vesely was a mistake, drafting MKG at 3 compounds the mistake and creates another.

The MKG comments are bordering on absurd. The way many of these posts read, MKG would be lucky if he even recognized a basketball. He can score, both in the post and in transition. He has a hitch in his shot, but this hardly means he's unrecoverable. Nor does it mean that Wall and Vesely won't improve their shooting. And this argument that we've already drafted our token unselfish glue guy player (Vesely) is also pretty rediculous. Is it really a bad thing to have the character of the team to be a bunch of unselfish players? Getting two of them hardly "compounds the error" - it helps solidify the character of the whole team.

Bottom line this comes down to a risk/reward decision. If we pick MKG we will be accepting the shooting percentage risk while expecting a payoff in other areas. I'm still interested in Beal first but wow, MKG is hardly a disaster - he'll be a huge upgrade for us.

[sfam]

Regarding Blatche, Hands11 brings up a good point that he can be our 5th big - our 3rd string center and power forward. As bad as he is, he's sure to be better than a rookie big we pick up with the #46 pick, or some vet minimum over-the-hill scrub like Tony Battie. And he costs us nothing.

Nothing other than a cancer in the locker room, you mean? On the positive side, At least he'll be able to show Wall, Vesely and the rest how to make it rain at stripper parties. Can't wait for the new team cell phone shots!

EDIT: I'm catching up on the thread from an airport in Kazakhstan - should have read all the way first - I see this point has already been made.

[Dat2U]

You can't build a team successfully around 2 perimeter players with no shooting range - no matter who you add. You can excuse it in a PG; you can't in a SF you're picking at 3. Unless MKG is showing in workouts that he's completely changing his shooting form - and we have no evidence that that's happened - there's no chance I'd consider him at 3. His offensive skills are way overrated. The only things he does well offensively are run the floor, drive to the hoop, dunk, and hit the offensive boards. He can't shoot with even mid-range, because his shooting on the way down is going to get blocked in the NBA if there's anyone within 10 feet of him. He's a mediocre ball-handler and can't handle in traffic. Contrary to a ton of posts here, he doesn't create shots for teammates. There is no Pippenesque point forward ability that he's shown - not even close. We drafted Vesely at 6 last year. If Vesely was a mistake, drafting MKG at 3 compounds the mistake and creates another.

The Miami Heat would disagree with you. Of course there are some roster issues that need to be addressed by adding floor spacers at the 2 & 4 but LeBron & Wade do the bulk of their damage from mid-range, slashing to the rim and getting out the break.

As for Vesely, his presence shouldn't impact any decision. We may need to think about consolidating some these rookie contracts for veterans with shooting ability.

[dobrojim]

He can't shoot, Dat. If he had a respectable jumper, fine. But he can't shoot.

We can go around in circles on this but shooting isn't the only skill in basketball. And frankly, I think part of this board has lost sight of that. Folks seem more interested in finding the perfect offensive fit as opposed to the best player. Not the best fit mind you, just the best offensive fit, as if that somehow should dictate the direction we go in above anything else.

Also, MKG is 18, his shot may improve. The NBA is filled with players who improved or didn't improve their shooting once they got in the league. With MKG's work ethic, youth and maturity, I'd expect him to be in the former category.

I tend to agree with you to an extent. I do find it interesting that there are those
who 'hate' Ves but want MKG. Maybe it's because they don't think we can afford to
have 2 players 'like' that. I say like that because other than the fact that one is clearly
a 3 who might play 2 or 4 on occasion (MKG) and the other is a 4 who could play 3 or 5
on occasion, their respective games or assets are similar in that the both play hard,
are more defensive oriented than offensive, both have high BBIQs and are not exactly
what one would describe as 'go to' scorers. Both figure to get most of their offense
on transition and/or offensive rebounds or cuts to the rim.

I would be happy with MKG but I think I would be happier with Beal. I know you
feel pretty much the reciprocal way. Maybe we'll both end up unhappy when the
pick ends up being neither one of them. TRob is lurking, Drummond has regained
some position on many people's board and Barnes surprised with his measurables
at the combine.

[LyricalRico]

^ Well, I don't think Ruz was talking about LeBron and Wade. He's talking about Wall and MKG - who aren't nearly in the same class as scorers. LeBron/Wade can be title contenders as mediocre outside shooters because they are so good at everything else. That's not the case with the players Ruz is talking about. I think he's right - this team will be best served by adding complementary pieces because we don't yet have anyone good enough to transcend a glaring lack of skill in one particular area.

[Dat2U]

I tend to agree with you to an extent. I do find it interesting that there are those
who 'hate' Ves but want MKG. Maybe it's because they don't think we can afford to
have 2 players 'like' that. I say like that because other than the fact that one is clearly
a 3 who might play 2 or 4 on occasion (MKG) and the other is a 4 who could play 3 or 5
on occasion, their respective games or assets are similar in that the both play hard,
are more defensive oriented than offensive, both have high BBIQs and are not exactly
what one would describe as 'go to' scorers. Both figure to get most of their offense
on transition and/or offensive rebounds or cuts to the rim.

I would be happy with MKG but I think I would be happier with Beal. I know you
feel pretty much the reciprocal way. Maybe we'll both end up unhappy when the
pick ends up being neither one of them. TRob is lurking, Drummond has regained
some position on many people's board and Barnes surprised with his measurables
at the combine.

I don't think Vesely is the player MKG is. Vesely is also 4 years older than MKG. And yes, MKG's presence would have me looking at potential deals for Vesely.

I see Vesely as more a tweener without a real position. Time will tell if he'll rebound well enough at the 4 or 5 but with MKG, I would be looking for a PF that can space the floor instead.

[nate33]

I still think too many people downplay the relative importance of defensive big men, and the relative unimportance of defensive wings. It's easy to say that we can find a stretch 4 to balance out MKG's weaknesses, but the reality is that most stretch 4's play lousy defense. And having a bad defensive PF kills your team defense, even if you have an exceptional defensive SF.

For argument's sake, let's assume that Vesely becomes Noah, MKG becomes Gerald Wallace, and Beal becomes Eric Gordon. I'd rather have Gordon + Noah than Wallace + Illyasova. (Not to mention that in the Gordon/Noah scenario, we'd have more cap room to acquire a SF.)

[closg00]

Kennedy tweeted that multiple teams are trying to trade-up to get Beal.

[nate33]

Kennedy tweeted that multiple teams are trying to trade-up to get Beal.

Trade up to where? #2? #3? #4?

[nate33]

For the record, I like Beal but I'm not willing to trade up to #2 to get him. If Beal is gone at #2, I'd happily take MKG or Robinson at #3 and be done with it.

[DCZards]

Kennedy tweeted that multiple teams are trying to trade-up to get Beal.

As I've said many times, I'd be happy with MKG (or even TRob) but I really, really want Beal because I believe he's the player who will help improve the Zards the most. But I'm getting the vibe that Beal may be gone at 2 either via trade or because Charlotte drafts him. Given that possibility, I hope the Zards management is taking a good look at Barnes and Drummond as well.

[Dat2U]

I still think too many people downplay the relative importance of defensive big men, and the relative unimportance of defensive wings. It's easy to say that we can find a stretch 4 to balance out MKG's weaknesses, but the reality is that most stretch 4's play lousy defense. And having a bad defensive PF kills your team defense, even if you have an exceptional defensive SF.

For argument's sake, let's assume that Vesely becomes Noah, MKG becomes Gerald Wallace, and Beal becomes Eric Gordon. I'd rather have Gordon + Noah than Wallace + Illyasova. (Not to mention that in the Gordon/Noah scenario, we'd have more cap room to acquire a SF.)

I can buy your original point but your example is one helluva stretch bro. I mean you had to walk a country mile to get there.

If Vesely somehow magically becomes as good as Noah (incredibly unlikely) then you might have a point, but there's nothing to indicate that will ever happen. And isn't it Gordon + Noah + FA vs. Wallace + Noah + Ilyasova? You take Vesely out of the MKG equation, but if he's the next Noah then certainly were keeping him right?

[Upper Decker]

The Miami Heat would disagree with you. Of course there are some roster issues that need to be addressed by adding floor spacers at the 2 & 4 but LeBron & Wade do the bulk of their damage from mid-range, slashing to the rim and getting out the break.

As for Vesely, his presence shouldn't impact any decision. We may need to think about consolidating some these rookie contracts for veterans with shooting ability.

The problem with this logic is that both Wade and LeBron are worlds better shooters than Wall and MKG. Not only that Wade and LeBron more than make up for their 'poor' shooting because they are two of the most elite dribble penetrators in history.

Pretty much everyone universally considers Kyrie Irving a better player than Wall even though Wall's better at defense, rebounding, penetrating, running an offense, passing, and he's longer, stronger, quicker, and more explosive. But Irving is the better shooter. Not only that, but Irving is downright awful at a few things including defense and passing. Beal has no glaring weakness like Irving and can actually shoot, unlike MKG.

[dobrojim]

If you have any sense at all, you don't bring him back period - under any circumstances. He's had 7 years in the NBA. Just keeping him around the team would be an obvious step backwards to any momentum this organization has built. It's amazing to the point of absurdity to me that people think it makes sense to give him another chance.

Look, I get that it is fun for some people type this kind of stuff but come on.

It does make some sense to bring him back. It makes Ted money sense. That was my point. I think it is what he will do if he can't trade him before the season starts. I never said it was ideal. I just don't believe it is near a forgone concussion that Dray will get amnestied or traded before the season and if neither of those two things happens, guess what.... he will be on the roster.

So if you are one of the people who will lose their mind with outrage if that happens, I suggest you start doubling up on your meds around October.

Foregone "concussion" -- I like that! Your superior tone not so much.

As I've already asked of you -- why don't you suggest one trade -- just one will do -- w/ any team in the league -- any one will do -- that would make sense for that team and for the Wizards? Obviously, it doesn't have to be something you've heard about, something real in that sense. Just a notion that would work.

Dray is broken. If amnestied, the best he'll get is a one-year veteran minimum contract. Can you really convince yourself otherwise? And, in that case, what will a team want us to take off their hands in return for taking on $23+ million through 2015 instead? We were already unable to trade him last year.

typos are so much fun

upper decker wrote
I completely agree. While many of us think Singleton was totally worthless last year and shouldn't be a consideration on whom to pick I don't believe EG feels the same way. Apparently they were very high on him last year and to select a 'duplicate' player is an admonition of failure. I think most GM’s are a bit too proud to admit failure.

I think almost all GMs would admonish failure long before they would make an
admission of failure.

for the record, I'm far from immune to this sort of thing so feel free to find
and make fun of any typos I've made.

An old friend of mine used to use the expression (a lot) violent effort
when what he really meant was a valiant effort. It's all good (for laughs).

[dobrojim]

When you're open, does it really matter who you share the court with? How often have we seen Singleton bend the rim on wide open shots this past season? The shots were there for him to make.

The story on Leonard heading into the draft was how much he's worked over the offseason and how much his shot had improved as a result.

Saying that Leonard wouldn't have been successful on this roster is absurd. He was precisely what this team needed.

Turned out to be but I think what some are trying to point out is
there was little way to really be sure of that in advance. It was not
a foregone conclusion or concussion that this is what would happen.

[Dat2U]

The Miami Heat would disagree with you. Of course there are some roster issues that need to be addressed by adding floor spacers at the 2 & 4 but LeBron & Wade do the bulk of their damage from mid-range, slashing to the rim and getting out the break.

As for Vesely, his presence shouldn't impact any decision. We may need to think about consolidating some these rookie contracts for veterans with shooting ability.

The problem with this logic is that both Wade and LeBron are worlds better shooters than Wall and MKG. Not only that Wade and LeBron more than make up for their 'poor' shooting because they are two of the most elite dribble penetrators in history.

Well DUH! LeBron & Wade are 2 of the best 3 wings in the league. Wade is 30, LeBron is 27. Wall is 21 and MKG is 18 so they are both 9 years younger! Stop trying to write the obit on the Wall/MKG combo before they even step on the court. The ceiling for Wall & MKG is not written in stone yet.