Asik Discussion. Pg 50 Sheridan: Bulls will match

[BIGGIEsmalls 23]

I hope in gauging whether to match Omer or not, the Bulls are shopping the hell out of Taj and Noah right now, just to see what the value is.

This is the main problem that matching this offer presents.

Asik is not a better player than Noah nor Taj.

[League Circles]

I think you're overestimating the value of Taj and Omer to other teams if you think them combined will get you an all-star perimeter player. Coldfish said it a while back, but Taj and Omer have the type of value that's good, but the value that no team would trade you their star player for in a package built around them. They're more so sweeteners than centerpieces of a great deal.

I said a package of Omer, Taj, and the Bobcats pick. That's two pretty young, elite defensive big men plus a likely high lottery pick.

[Red Larrivee]

Taj and Omer aren't two players though who can be apart of a core going forward, that's the point. Taj and Omer's value to the Bulls isn't their value to the rest of the league.

[theanimal23]

Don't know where to put this but by using the MMLE on Kirk, do we have a hard cap at $74 million? Thanks.

[League Circles]

I hope in gauging whether to match Omer or not, the Bulls are shopping the hell out of Taj and Noah right now, just to see what the value is.

This is the main problem that matching this offer presents.

Asik is not a better player than Noah nor Taj.

Of course he isn't, but that means nothing. The question is, are we better off with whatever the one we trade brings us (likely a SG) plus the guys that remain, or by letting go someone, which makes any trade of one of the remaining two a trade that opens another hole. The only reason you shop Taj and Noah right now is because you can't shop Omer right now, but getting a feel for what Noah or Taj might fetch may help in deciding about Omer's match. For example, say the Bulls get a feeling that they may be able to get Harden in a deal for Noah. Well, then, losing our best C, resulting in Taj and Omer splitting C time long term, isn't nearly as big of a problem, because we now have an excellent SG. On the other hand, if shopping Noah sounds like it won't fetch us a really great return (and same with Taj), then maybe it would be best to let Omer go. Matching Omer means one of four things essentially must happen:

1) Noah is traded, Omer and an extended Taj split the C spot long term
2) Taj is traded or walks as an RFA next summer, Noah must play some PF next to Omer long term
3) Omer is traded, which basically must be done within 1 year or his value will collapse
4) Keep all of them and wave goodbye to cap space as a backup plan in 2014

[League Circles]

Don't know where to put this but by using the MMLE on Kirk, do we have a hard cap at $74 million? Thanks.

Great question. I'm pretty sure the answer is no. The full MLE instills that 74 mil hard cap, but I don't believe the MMLE does. After all, some teams who can use the MMLE are already over 74 mil.

[League Circles]

Taj and Omer aren't two players though who can be apart of a core going forward, that's the point. Taj and Omer's value to the Bulls isn't their value to the rest of the league.

One of them can, and if Noah is traded, both of them can. We wouldn't want to stay put with 4 pricey bigs long term, but three is fine.

[kyrv]

Don't know where to put this but by using the MMLE on Kirk, do we have a hard cap at $74 million? Thanks.

Great question. I'm pretty sure the answer is no. The full MLE instills that 74 mil hard cap, but I don't believe the MMLE does. After all, some teams who can use the MMLE are already over 74 mil.

Ah the apron, I've read about 80 to 90% that it is a hard cap (74 mil) and you and someone else said there wasn't (not here national I believe).

It's a pretty important point, it would mean the Bulls would safely have about 2 mil more to offer someone.

[kyrv]

Taj and Omer aren't two players though who can be apart of a core going forward, that's the point. Taj and Omer's value to the Bulls isn't their value to the rest of the league.

One of them can, and if Noah is traded, both of them can. We wouldn't want to stay put with 4 pricey bigs long term, but three is fine.

I agree, at least three. The way the Bulls are built and need to win, they need to have an advantage with the bigs with defense and rebounding.

If Asik and Taj are worth less to the rest of the league, they shouldn't be getting big offers.

[Red Larrivee]

One of them can, and if Noah is traded, both of them can. We wouldn't want to stay put with 4 pricey bigs long term, but three is fine.

I don't see it. I'm still not convinced that Gibson is a great starter, and Asik...nah. But again, I don't see any team who's about to trade their all-star whoever saying "yeah I want a package built around Taj Gibson or Omer Asik." They're sweeteners not centerpieces.

We have good assets, we just a lack a cheap, high upside, really really good asset.

[bullsnewdynasty]

We have good assets, we just a lack a cheap, high upside, really really good asset.

Bobcats pick?

[Red Larrivee]

Bobcats pick?

That's not quite there yet. Plus the Bulls shopped that during the NBA Draft and nobody bit. It's only going to have great value the season it's unprotected and if the Bobcats are kicking rocks again.

We don't have a Gallinari, Gordon or Wilson Chandler on a cheap rookie deal. That's what we would need.

[bullsnewdynasty]

We don't need that though. We just need a star who is willing to re-sign in Chicago.

Deng+Noah probably could have gotten us Melo. If that deal was still around today, I'd say the Bulls would have taken it.

Reports from CBS also were that the Bulls and Magic could have worked a deal pretty easily if Dwight was interested in Chicago.

[Red Larrivee]

We don't need that though. We just need a star who is willing to re-sign in Chicago.

Deng+Noah probably could have gotten us Melo. If that deal was still around today, I'd say the Bulls would have taken it.

You're basically saying what I said though. Noah was a cheap, young, really productive, high upside asset. Noah fit the criteria of a Gallinari, Chandler or Gordon.

I don't think that deal was on the Bulls though, Denver didn't really show the desire to take on a long-term deal like Deng's. They wanted to be able to negotiate the terms for their guys.

[BIGGIEsmalls 23]

Regarding Denver. Nothing mattered anyway because Melo was only willing to re-up with NY.

[bullsnewdynasty]

We don't need that though. We just need a star who is willing to re-sign in Chicago.

Deng+Noah probably could have gotten us Melo. If that deal was still around today, I'd say the Bulls would have taken it.

You're basically saying what I said though. Noah was a cheap, young, really productive, high upside asset. Noah fit the criteria of a Gallinari, Chandler or Gordon.

I don't think that deal was on the Bulls though, Denver didn't really show the desire to take on a long-term deal like Deng's. They wanted to be able to negotiate the terms for their guys.

Noah wasn't cheap. He just signed a $60 million contract.

And also, Wilson Chandler isn't that much different than Asik or Gibson in terms of an asset.

[Red Larrivee]

Noah signed that contract after the Denver rumors ended. When his name was being floated he was still only making like 3-4M and coming off a season where he averaged 11ppg and 11reb.

And a 23-year-old Wilson Chandler is a noticeably better asset than Taj or Omer.

[bullsnewdynasty]

Noah signed that contract after the Denver rumors ended. When his name was being floated he was still only making like 3-4M and coming off a season where he averaged 11ppg and 11reb.

Nope, you're wrong.

[Red Larrivee]

Nope, you're wrong.

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/nba/n ... id=5550421

Updated: September 10, 2010, 4:09 PM ET
ESPNChicago.com

The Chicago Bulls are interested in trading for the Denver Nuggets' Carmelo Anthony, a league source told ESPNChicago.com on Thursday.

And while the source said that the team is holding internal discussions as to whether the Bulls would allow Joakim Noah to be part of any deal, Chicago has not reached a consensus. Another source close to the situation told ESPNChicago.com's Nick Friedell that Noah would not be part of an Anthony deal.

The Nuggets are hesitant to take back Luol Deng as part of a deal with the Bulls because Denver is leery of taking on long-term contracts with the collective bargaining agreement set to expire on June 30, 2011. Deng is two years into a six-year, $71 million contract, the initial source said.

Noah will make $3.1 million this season in the fourth year of his rookie deal. The center would become a restricted free agent next season unless the Bulls extend his contract.

Noah signed an extension in October 2010, per Sham.

[bullsnewdynasty]

Denver wanted Noah. You don't think Denver knew they had to extend him? It wasn't Denver who balked, it was the Bulls.