Official John Wall Appreciation Thread

[DMVleGeND]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k09sJ87IUHg[/youtube]

I'm liking the post moves!

[fishercob]

Color me concerned. Based on this vid and another with Drew league highlights , I am really not seeing any apparent signs of improved mechanics in John's jumper. Bad footwork and balance, unnecessary fading and drifting, inconsistent release, etc.

[nate33]

Color me concerned. Based on this vid and another with Drew league highlights , I am really not seeing any apparent signs of improved mechanics in John's jumper. Bad footwork and balance, unnecessary fading and drifting, inconsistent release, etc.

I dunno fishercob, I was pleased to see that Wall is no longer shooting on the way down. He is releasing at the top of his jump. He still fades away a bit, but that doesn't bother me too much when he is shooting from 18 feet or closer. Typically, the defense is tighter that close to the basket and a the fade will help him get separation. With his quickness and ball skills, he'll be able to get that shot anytime he wants. If he can get his accuracy on that shot up to 45% or so, he'd be able to score 30 points a game. He'll be Dwyane Wade with better court vision.

He didn't really take any 3-pointers so it's hard to tell if he has improved much from that range. I agree that fading away from that distance is a problem.

[Nivek]

I agree with fish's assessment. There was no reason for Wall to fade and drift on many of those shots. I'm less concerned about fading and more concern about drifting.

45% on mid-range to long-range 2s is a high bar. Last season, league was about 38%. For PGs, about 39%. For PGs it was .398. Wall was around 30%. To reach 45% starting from awful, he'd have to speed right past average to "very good." That's not going to happen.

He definitely needs to learn to shoot better. Hopefully he's still working on it, because that video suggests he still has a long ways to go. He also needs to use better shot selection either way. He shoots a good percentage when he gets to the rim, and he's been awful from everywhere else. He'd have been better off last season shooting 3s or taking it to the hoop.

[GhostsOfGil]

Well when working with dave, Haywood went from a 54% ft shooter to a 74% ft shooter so wall should shoot his long twos in the 60s right?

But seriously, I tend to side with nate on this one; Walls form looks a lot smoother. Sure he's still fading but the hitch is gone.

[Nivek]

He still needs to work on the placement of his left hand. On many of those jumpers, it's too high -- almost on top of the ball. It needs to be down further -- alongside the ball. On top slows down the release and makes it tougher to get it off the ball before release. That puts weird spins on the ball, flattens the arc and reduces accuracy.

[Jimmy Recard]

honest question,,,,

are there any Olympic videos of John Wall playing?

please post them if you know any...

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3q8u9YHAdA[/youtube]

Jumper still looks ugly (mechanically wise).

God damn. He;s still not elevating enough on his jumpers.

[Brenice]

I don't care how ugly his jumper looks or how much elevation he gets. As long as he starts making it consistently, it doesn't matter. Defenders will respect his ability to go by them so he will get space to get the jumper off. Like everything else surrounding last year, his jumper improved after the team was blown up last year.

[DMVleGeND]

I don't care how ugly his jumper looks or how much elevation he gets. As long as he starts making it consistently, it doesn't matter. Defenders will respect his ability to go by them so he will get space to get the jumper off. Like everything else surrounding last year, his jumper improved after the team was blown up last year.

His jumper was good for a stretch after the trade, but then fell off and was just as bad as it was the beginning of the yr. The fact is that he'll have to change up his mechanics in order to become a consistent shooter.

[Nivek]

I don't care how ugly his jumper looks or how much elevation he gets. As long as he starts making it consistently, it doesn't matter. Defenders will respect his ability to go by them so he will get space to get the jumper off. Like everything else surrounding last year, his jumper improved after the team was blown up last year.

Actually, his jumper got worse.

From 10-23 feet, here are his percentages by month:

Dec/Jan -- .242
Feb -- .534
Mar -- .284
April -- .208

[nate33]

God damn. He;s still not elevating enough on his jumpers.

It doesn't bother me that his 3-point shot is more of a set shot than a jumper. You only need to jump on that shot if there's a defender in your face, and I don't want Wall shooting 3's with a defender in his face. He should only shoot it if the defender is daring him to take the shot.

Wall gets sufficient elevation on his midrange jumper, which is all that matters. Now, we just need him to make it more often.

[Dark Faze]

My biggest problem with Wall last season was that he was avoiding contact on drives and he didn't even try to develop his jumper.
'
I loved him in year 1 because he actually shot 3's with confidence. He'd hit these runs where he'd knock them down with confidence, same with his mid range. He was still a bad shooter but there wasn't any evidence that he couldn't improve.

Year 2 was just a horrible development year. He basically lost a year of development concerning his jumper because he just avoided shooting it. I really blame the coaching staff for not forcing him to take more jumpshots. Good thing about year 2 was the improved defense and the dismissal of the scary health concerns from year 1, also the additional weight.

With year 3 he's added more strength, his handle looks a lot tighter...if he can just play like he did as a rookie on offense, combined with his defense and health gains from year 2, I've got confidence he'll take a big stride as a player.

[Dat2U]

I don't care how ugly his jumper looks or how much elevation he gets. As long as he starts making it consistently, it doesn't matter. Defenders will respect his ability to go by them so he will get space to get the jumper off. Like everything else surrounding last year, his jumper improved after the team was blown up last year.

Actually, his jumper got worse.

From 10-23 feet, here are his percentages by month:

Dec/Jan -- .242
Feb -- .534
Mar -- .284
April -- .208

Yeah, people got selective memory with regards to the Nene trade. Wall actually played his best ball while McGee & Young were still on the Wizards. Wall went off for about 4-5 weeks when his shot was butter. He looked like an all-star. I know I've said this before but it's all about his confidence in that jumper. He lost his confidence with his J after that real nice stretch and never got it back.

In summer league and pickup games, Wall oozes with confidence and the J goes down. I'm sure it's going down in practice too. The huge question to me is, can he regain that confidence during the regular season and maintain it. I thought he had it for significant stretch last season, so for him to completely lose it again was a bit disappointing.

[Ruzious]

Wall definitely did not benefit by playing with Crawford full-time. At least playing with Young, there was a fit - Young learned to play the role of a catch and shoot guy. Crawford didn't. And Wittman seemed to be more interested in boosting Crawford than Wall - and let Crawford control the ball quite a lot. And Wall was clueless playing off the ball - he'd never done it, and his skills don't match playing off the ball. I think how he was used with Crawford stifled Wall's progress last season.

[DCZards]

I think Wall played his best ball the last couple of months of the season. He may not have shot better (.420 after the all-star break as compared to .426 before it), but he averaged fewer turnovers, and more steals and assists after the all-star break.

Even more importantly, it was obvious that John was a happier, much more relaxed player after the Nene trade. The Zards were winning and Johnny Ballgame was having fun.

[Nivek]

I've posted it before (and made the same points to folks within the organization I talk with now and then) that I think Wall not shooting 3s last season was a big mistake. Whether it was Wall's decision or something that came from the coaching staff, it was bad advice. He did a nice job of boosting his at-rim shot attempts (38% of his FGA as a rookie; 43% in year 2), but his long 2pt attempts went up slightly (from 30% to 32%) while his efficiency from that range was awful.

The two seasons together, here's a quick table showing Wall's efg from each spot:

At-Rim -- .608
3-23 ft -- .296
3pt -- .354

Yet 52% of his FGA have come in that 3-23 foot range. 31% of his FGA from 16-23 feet. He and the team would be better served if he cut WAY back on the mid-range stuff and focused on getting to the rim, dishing to teammates and attempting spot-up 3s. Even if he shot 20% on 3pt attempts, the effect would be the same as shooting .296 from 2pt range.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

He still needs to work on the placement of his left hand. On many of those jumpers, it's too high -- almost on top of the ball. It needs to be down further -- alongside the ball. On top slows down the release and makes it tougher to get it off the ball before release. That puts weird spins on the ball, flattens the arc and reduces accuracy.

I didn't like his shooting either in that video. In addition to drifting on his shot, the ball comes off his hand with a flatness and a sidewinding kind of motion.

Nivek, I think you are right about what the cause of that is. Wall's hand IS too much on top of the ball. Instead of using his guide hand alongside the ball and releasing it that way, John Wall is stopping his shot from being true as it could be.

I saw Rondo really improve his shooting and the thing he does a lot better is he puts a great arc on his shot now. John Wall is going to have to shoot the ball with a higher trajectory. He could benefit IMO by shooting a lot of one hand set shots, while releasing the ball as high as possible. I suspect that will automatically force his guide hand to the side instead of over top his shooting hand. Also, I think he should shoot the same amount of left hand set shots with a very high release point. His balance is good but maybe Wall would drift less right or left if he trained both sides. He should be exploding vertically and on balance.

It seems to me that John Wall is just not a shooter, however. I think he would do well to become just an average NBA jump shooter. He is a scorer who could really improve by just being an average jump shooter.

[DCZards]

Nivek, I’ve heard you say before that Wall should focus on the three-point shot rather than the midrange jumper. I disagree. Given Wall’s offensive skillset, especially his ability to get into the lane and make plays for himself and his teammates, I’d argue that he needs to be able to consistently knock down the midrange shot for both his sake as well as the Zards’ success as a team.

I see Wall as being very similar to Russell Westbrook. Both are strong, quick and athletic, and both are capable of getting into the paint at will for 10-18 foot jumpers. Like Wall, Westbrook was also a terrible midrange shooter early in his NBA career.

Here’s the progression of Westbrook’s 2 pt. FG% for the four years he’s been in the league--.398, . 418, .442, .457. Meanwhile, his 3 pt. % has gone like this--.271,.221,.330,.316.

John’s 2pt. % was .409 his rookie year and .423 last season. Both better than Westbrook’s first two seasons.

I consider Wall adding a three point shot as the icing on the cake, but the midrange shot is the cake, imo. Westbrook is the classic example of that. Russell’s short jumper, not his three point shot, is easily his best offensive weapon.

Other than that tall, lanky guy he plays with, of course.

[Nivek]

I'm not talking about 2pt percentage, because that includes shots at the rim. I'm talking about 2pt JUMPERS vs. 3pt attempts.

In all but his 2nd season, Westbrook's efg from 3pt range has been better than his percentage on two-point jumpers, and Westbrook started as a MUCH better shooter than Wall. Like Wall, Westbrook would likely be even more efficient if he cut back on the 2pt jump shots and took more shots at-rim or from the 3pt line.

Two point jumpers are bad shots for most players. Some are necessary, but (especially long 2s) should be a last resort when the offense can't get a shot at the rim or from the 3pt line. Last season from 3-23 feet (all 2pt attempts not at-rim), the league shot .386. The league shot .343 from 3pt range, which is equivalent to shooting .514 from 2pt range. Not many players can shoot 51%+ on 2pt jumpers.

As I said, some 2pt jumpers are necessary. But it's shot too frequently. That's true of Wall. As bad as he shoots long 2s, they should be a last resort for him -- not 40% of his shot attempts.

[queridiculo]

Color me concerned. Based on this vid and another with Drew league highlights , I am really not seeing any apparent signs of improved mechanics in John's jumper. Bad footwork and balance, unnecessary fading and drifting, inconsistent release, etc.

I don't know. Based on that Reebok video it looks to me like his release has improved considerably.

One of the things I've noticed watching him play was that he had a tendency to shoot on the way down. He may have been fading, and sliding on his shots, bot the release looked considerably better.

He looks like he's releasing the ball quicker and with more confidence, didn't see much hesitation on any of the shots, save the 3 pointer they showed from the team USA practices.